Kinseth's Customs - Devil's Faction(SOV work)

[Tornado]

Cool.
For Horned Devil, you will have to alter the wording or look out for destroying your own figures (like 10 point Ninjas or Rats) to return Common Devils.

Is the Horned Devil 2-hexes? You may run into some issues destroying/replacing 2-Hex and 1-Hex figures. Not sure if this mechanic has been breached in classic.

Mindless Attack feels a little blah. How often are you going to choose to not attack?

I like the direction of the faction. I always enjoyed reading the original Monster Manuals.


superfrog

[Kinseth]

Mindless attack - Attacking an someone with Counterstrike, or other defensive abilities you might not want to trigger perhaps, like a deathreaver scatter.

I was considering only bringing back Lemures and no Imp Devils, and also considered making Imp Devils Uncommon Heroes and using a power similar to Tagawa's Bloodlust and that when that Imp devil has 3 Markers on it, you can turn it into a Unique Devil.

Could I limit "Do thy bidding" on the Horned Devil to Uncommon and Common Devil heroes (Turned the Horned Devil into a Unique devil.)?

[superfrog]

I don't think any card calls out Uncommon Heroes, but I can't see how it would be unclear or anything.

[Tornado]

That may help.

The problem I see is you are putting a stranglehold on the faction so any future Devils are locked into some impressive synergy that always has to be accounted for in the future.

Future Devils will have to bear the extra cost that emerges as the faction grows.
At least that is my theory.

[Kinseth]

Originally Posted by Tornado

That may help.

The problem I see is you are putting a stranglehold on the faction so any future Devils are locked into some impressive synergy that always has to be accounted for in the future.

Future Devils will have to bear the extra cost that emerges as the faction grows.
At least that is my theory.

I am not sure I follow here, how does it put a stranglehold on?

[Sir Heroscape]

I love the direction this is headed. Having a devil faction would be so saweet!

[Astroking112]

Originally Posted by Kinseth

I am not sure I follow here, how does it put a stranglehold on?

I believe that Tornado is referring to how this design limits the space for future Unique Devils (or something else along those lines). Since the synergy is so broad and central, any future Devil heroes would need to be designed as additions to this faction instead of something else.

[Lazy Orang]

Why don't you base the whole 'rising' mechanic on class rather than Uniqueness? Seems a lot cleaner to me, and avoids restricting future design space, at least as much - Horned Devil kills a figure and creates a Devil Spawn (Lemure), Lemure Devil kills something and becomes a Devil Soldier (Imp), Imp Devil kills something and can become a Devil Champion (Horned Devil). Nice, clear, no need to restrict design space for future Devils. You'd probably need to keep Do My Bidding working with all Devil Common Heroes even with this model, but I don't see that as an issue since Common Heroes are rarely that strong anyway - no more of a concern than Kurrok, certainly. The main things are that the Horned Devil will always be creating Lemures and that the Imp Devil won't be able to turn into any future, stronger, possibly fully Unique Heroes (and that the Lemure won't be able to turn into any Devil Common Heroes save Imps, assuming you want that - if not, you can always keep that one to Devil Common Hero).

Nice to see the idea of Devils as separate from Demons being a thing. I'm not really into D&D, but I know a tad and plan to play Planescape Torment and Baldur's Gate, so I'm all for expending a little D&D stuff, especially in this way - seems really cool.

[Ixe]

The D&D theme is a bit off. Horned Devils are brutes of the devil heirarchy but they aren't really leaders or all that intelligent. They aren't the best fit for a leader like that. I see where you're going with Deal with the Devil but the name at least does not fit the theme you are going for. You also call out a special attack in that power but the Horned Devil has no special attack so it seems a bit weird. I think the flavor would be more on point if that were instead a special attack with a sacrificial summoning flavor to bring in devils. If you had space, you could even add a line that the defending figure may choose not to roll defense dice so you could sacrifice one of your figures to bring a devil back. Not the most useful, but potentially a cool bit of flavor and could tie in to some cultist support at a later point. Lastly, Stealth Flying is a bit off since Horned Devils are more brutish than tricky.

The Imp idea is pretty cool, although Soldier is off for the class. 1 die deadly strike gives them a sneaky and potentially dangerous feel and the Rise in the Rank theme is cool.

The Lemure also seems like a faithful adaptation. Overwhelm should say two or more devil heroes.

I like where you're going with the faction and I'm curious about the gameplay. Good work.

[Leaf_It]

Originally Posted by Lazy Orang

Why don't you base the whole 'rising' mechanic on class rather than Uniqueness? Seems a lot cleaner to me, and avoids restricting future design space, at least as much - Horned Devil kills a figure and creates a Devil Spawn (Lemure), Lemure Devil kills something and becomes a Devil Soldier (Imp), Imp Devil kills something and can become a Devil Champion (Horned Devil). Nice, clear, no need to restrict design space for future Devils. You'd probably need to keep Do My Bidding working with all Devil Common Heroes even with this model, but I don't see that as an issue since Common Heroes are rarely that strong anyway - no more of a concern than Kurrok, certainly. The main things are that the Horned Devil will always be creating Lemures and that the Imp Devil won't be able to turn into any future, stronger, possibly fully Unique Heroes (and that the Lemure won't be able to turn into any Devil Common Heroes save Imps, assuming you want that - if not, you can always keep that one to Devil Common Hero).

Nice to see the idea of Devils as separate from Demons being a thing. I'm not really into D&D, but I know a tad and plan to play Planescape Torment and Baldur's Gate, so I'm all for expending a little D&D stuff, especially in this way - seems really cool.

I have only a little expereince with D&D, so my perspective is solely based on how I see the design itself, and not based on anything from D&D lore. I like Lazy Orang's method the most I think. Tie the rank up mechanic to the class of the devil, and thus remove the potential stranglehold on future design space. I would also specify that the Rise in Rank ability on the imp brings back an Uncommon Champion Devil hero. This way if you ever wanted to created a named Unique Devil, or a Devil that wasn't a Champion, and didn't synergize as much, you could do that without worrying about them being brought back.

So, Common Devil Spawn -> Common Devil Soldier(or Scourge, Fiend, Helion, etc) -> Uncommon Devil Champion.

Horned Devil: If the name of the power was changed so that the Horned Devil was simply ordering lesser ranks around because he could, and less because he was a leader. This would alleviate Ixe's issue with them being leaders. Perhaps it could be tied to a d20 roll like the undead Thralls.
Killing a figure should only bring back a Devil Spawn, or as Superfrog pointed out, you would just bring back Imps every time.

I also agree that Stealth Flying doesn't make a lot of sense, but it doesn't bother me too much. I would expect stealth flying more on the imp, than on the Horned Devil.

Imp Devil: I like the design. Maybe a different class would make more sense for a devil, but it's not a big issue for me. Stealth flying would be neat here, though it would probably raise the price 5 - 10 points.

Lemure Devil: Not being very familiar with most of D&D, I thought the name was funny at first. I actually like Mindless attack. Overwhelm helps it be less of a detriment, but it allows your opponent something to play around.