Superfrog's Customs - Two Thralls 11/12

[superfrog]

Originally Posted by Pumpkin_King

I saw this figure in the new D&D release and loved her. Glad I wasn’t the only one who thought of a mounted elf hero.

Yeah, it's my favorite figure other than that wicked awesome Ogre. This design feels a little boring to me, but I wanted to stay away from an all-too-easy Ashra booster.

[Pumpkin_King]

Gah, I was even gonna bring up the idea of an Ashra-booster, but decided against it!

[superfrog]

It wouldn't even be hard:

Warriors of Ashra movement bonding
+1 defense to all elves within some number of clear sight spaces
Dual Strike (or Double Attack)

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I just figured I'd play off the weapon and the mount, and get some tension between two decent attacks and one more certain attack.

[Pumpkin_King]

You could also do some kind of ability that makes ranged attacks on elves less effective to try and force melee defense a bit more.

[caps]

I'm not sure you're there yet. It still feels kind of like you just tacked some powers together, more than offering a cohesive design that reflects the mini.

I like that you didn't go with an Ashra booster, and I do like the tension in the powers.

[superfrog]

Originally Posted by capsocrates

I'm not sure you're there yet. It still feels kind of like you just tacked some powers together, more than offering a cohesive design that reflects the mini.

I like that you didn't go with an Ashra booster, and I do like the tension in the powers.

I agree that I'm not there yet. Not sure what exactly is off though.

The vision I have in my head is that she and her mount both attack, and either they do that separately (dual strike), or the mount holds the defender in place while she stabs it (mounted assault).

Snow and Ice Enhanced Movement definitely feels tacked on, and I'll probably drop it.

[Flash_19]

Originally Posted by superfrog

Snow and Ice Enhanced Movement definitely feels tacked on, and I'll probably drop it.

That was the part that felt the most tacked on to me too. Based on current stats, I also might consider a point value of between 120-130. That autoskull with base four attack is on the stronger side. Combine that with fast movement, and a double attack option... Also, the 6L/4D seems more characteristic of 140+ point value characters.

Way cool mini. I'm excited to see what you do with it.

[Astroking112]

Originally Posted by superfrog

Ethrim is the most noble of Feylund's Elves, prouder than Syvarris and more valiant than Haduc. She rides a regal white wolf, tamed from the snows of Feylund's northern tundras.

This is a really cool sculpt, and I think that this design is serviceable, but it doesn't excite me. Before reading your explanations, I was scratching my head as to why she has Dual Strike and Mounted Assault, so perhaps renaming either ability to be more unique to her (such as Shaolin Assault > Whirlwind Assault) would help the theme become more clear.

The Snow and Ice Enhanced Movement doesn't bother me, but I hardly think it's an integral part of the design. If anything, it reminds me more of Nerak, where there just so happens to be a random terrain-based power that the unit is not at all reliant on.

Honestly, the biggest problem that I have with her is that she doesn't feel like an Elf. I like the idea of a mounted Elf hero, but the faction is characterized to me by the many intricate synergies or unique elements to them (even Syvarris, probably the blandest Elf, was originally unique from the other figures and still has 9 range). There's nothing wrong with creating a straightforward Elven design, but it just doesn't feel like it fits in with the rest of Ullar's crew to me yet.

[Ronin]

Haven't been following the development here, but aside from being an Elf, most everything about that sculpt/card feels really Jandarian to me. Considered a change in general at all?

I think the theme of teaming up with her mount or attacking separately is cool, but it doesn't come through cleanly to me either. Might be easier to pick up on if both things were implemented in one power - something to the tune of:

TANDEM ASSAULT
After moving and before attacking, you may choose to either add one automatic skull to Ethrim's attack this turn, or attack one additional time this turn. Ethrim cannot attack the same figure twice in one turn.

EDIT: That's slightly less restrictive, but I don't really mind the idea of her and her wolf going after the same target even if there are multiple choices.

Also, I really like Snow and Ice Enhanced Movement here. I'd push to keep that for flavor, if at all possible.

[Lamaclown]

I echo the sentiments about the mini- very cool!
I also echo @Astroking112 , right now she doesn't feel overly elvish, or elfen, or elf-like, or however you want to say it. Disregarding the sculpt, the abilities would be just as at home on an orc hero (of course orcs are just elves that have been twisted and perverted- according to Tolkien).

I think your thoughts about using her mount as part of her abilities are spot on and thematic for the unit and sculpt. Maybe you could adapt Cyberclaw in some way to impede movement and defense as her mount clamps down on the enemy with an iron bite.

Morsbane, Syvarris, and Sonlen (as far as I can recall; I am sure someone can correct me if I am wrong) are the only Feylund elf heroes who do not offer some type tie-in with the other elves so if she is a Feylund elf, maybe some type of tie-in would help her feel more like an elf. Of course those synergies existed probably because of them being Wizards, not because they were elves (although Morsbane is a wizard) so take that with a grain of salt.

Anyhow, I look forward to seeing what you do with her.

[superfrog]

Originally Posted by Ronin

Haven't been following the development here, but aside from being an Elf, most everything about that sculpt/card feels really Jandarian to me. Considered a change in general at all?

Hm, not really. The whole "elf wearing green" seems Ullar to me, but the wolf thing is very Jandar. I'll keep that up my sleeve.

I think the theme of teaming up with her mount or attacking separately is cool, but it doesn't come through cleanly to me either. Might be easier to pick up on if both things were implemented in one power - something to the tune of:

EDIT: That's slightly less restrictive, but I don't really mind the idea of her and her wolf going after the same target even if there are multiple choices.

Also, I really like Snow and Ice Enhanced Movement here. I'd push to keep that for flavor, if at all possible.

I almost had that exact power on the card but couldn't come up with any wording I liked. I like that wording.

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As far as the "she doesn't tie in anywhere" to all the other elves, that's mostly intentional. She's not a wizard, so she won't fit with their whole synergy web.

That said, I might take this out of my thread entirely. This is a really cool mini, and I'd love to have some sort of collaborative design on it. Tons of people have commented on my crappy little design for it, so maybe there's enough interest for Boot Camp of Valhalla v2?

[Astroking112]

Originally Posted by superfrog

As far as the "she doesn't tie in anywhere" to all the other elves, that's mostly intentional. She's not a wizard, so she won't fit with their whole synergy web.

True, but even the Ullar elves that don't fit in well together still feel like they could. Sonlen is probably the best example, since he has almost no direct synergies but his healing feels like another tool in their kit. My point wasn't that she needs to be Mind Linkable by Ulginesh or the like, but rather that she didn't seem to have a similar place of belonging in the Elven faction. Even Syvarris feels unique in that regard as having two attacks at a long range, despite actually probably being a poor choice to take with them. It's a hard thing to pin down, I think, and I'm not quite sure what I would even suggest to change it yet, although I suspect that the key is on the high movement here.