The Pre-SoV Workshop

[bmon]

I would love to see AotP used for redesigned SoV units. I just picked it up last week for $15. The 5 prepainted planeswalkers would look great amongst classic Heroscape. And if you use a squad of translucent blues and a squad of translucent reds as unique squads, (ignore the rest) they would be down to just over $1 a piece. Obviously great availability.

It would be neat to see them designed as summoners, such as Kurrok, in a more limited fashion (ex. Tied to only one elemental type). I wish there were more options for the elementals than just Kurrok.

[igelkott]

It seems a little odd to me to reject AOTP units as customs. I would think it would be a great vehicle to encourage new blood into the Heroscape universe. It drew me in.

[Evar-Scarcarver]

Originally Posted by igelkott

It seems a little odd to me to reject AOTP units as customs. I would think it would be a great vehicle to encourage new blood into the Heroscape universe. It drew me in.

Reject nothing as customs; you could make Heroscape customs from rocks and twigs from your backyard, and some have actually done so, with amazing results, even.

The SoV, however, is a little more stringent in their choices of material in order to cater to the fan base at large as well as possible; giving as much balance and availability as they can with the limited resources they have. It's possible at some point in the future circumstances will allow or force unpainted minis will be more accepted as nominees; but for now, that is not the case. (And the right call, in my opinion)

(If this post comes off as arrogant, or rude, I assure you that was not my intention, and I apologize in advance if that is the case.)



EDIT: To weigh in further on the specific subject, (as someone who owns a copy of AotP) while I would be against using the green, black, and white figures in the SoV, I think that the other figures would work just fine in the project, and I've been theorizing about customs for many the figures myself.

And, as an added bonus mostly unrelated to the VC, I've realized that most of the unpainted figures could work as proxies for some harder to find figures: The elven archers as Aubriens, and the zombies as Skeletons of Annelletia. I've actually considered picking up a couple more copies and repainting them just for that purpose.

[Tiranx]

Not sure if you guys are still doing this, but I was curious how this guy would rate for the SoV in your opinion?

He is a re-paint of Abomination, so it makes the availability conditions. His wording is mostly taken from Mok.

[superfrog]

To me, that repaint looks more involved than the only one that has been accepted (Tyrian). It's also uncommon rather than unique, which is a disadvantage when looking at availability.

I also don't entirely understand what being "affected by any abilities on a Marro Parasite's Army Card" means. Obviously the intent is that the Gnids don't hurt him when they're on his card. But imagine a Marro Parasite squad with Sneak Attack. Can they not use that against him? Or how about one with an area of effect power that spreads disease? Could they not pick the Vector as the target?

[caps]

I think this custom is a cool idea, but I don't think it would work for SoV as-is.

Perhaps if you split the immunity into a different power:
DISEASE IMMUNE
Vector's attack and defense is never reduced by any special power on any army card.

[Tiranx]

Originally Posted by superfrog

To me, that repaint looks more involved than the only one that has been accepted (Tyrian). It's also uncommon rather than unique, which is a disadvantage when looking at availability.

I also don't entirely understand what being "affected by any abilities on a Marro Parasite's Army Card" means. Obviously the intent is that the Gnids don't hurt him when they're on his card. But imagine a Marro Parasite squad with Sneak Attack. Can they not use that against him? Or how about one with an area of effect power that spreads disease? Could they not pick the Vector as the target?

The repaint is actually really easy. Tan for the body, grey for the shoulder and back texture, red for the eyes. Then just go over the whole figure with a wash (which is just diluted paint. You can even buy pre-made ones). I didn't think about the uncommon hurting the availability, though, that is a good point.

For your second questions, the Gnid immunity is so that when he carries them he is immune to their negative abilities. I agree that would give him immunity to all future Gnid abilities, but with 1 defense I don't see that as being overpowered.

[Tiranx]

Originally Posted by capsocrates

I think this custom is a cool idea, but I don't think it would work for SoV as-is.

Perhaps if you split the immunity into a different power:
DISEASE IMMUNE
Vector's attack and defense is never reduced by any special power on any army card.

I like that suggestion a lot.

[Scytale]

Originally Posted by Tiranx

For your second questions, the Gnid immunity is so that when he carries them he is immune to their negative abilities. I agree that would give him immunity to all future Gnid abilities, but with 1 defense I don't see that as being overpowered.

I share superfrog's concerns, and it's not a question of balance. It has to do with the inherent complexities of creating immunity powers. If, for example, a Parasite squad had an Initiative-boosting power, would it not work if you also had a Vector on your team? What if the opponent had one? "never affected" powers can get weird really quick if they're not sufficiently limited.

On the other hand, caps's idea is pretty solid.

I am also concerned about other interactions. If an enemy placed a Gnid on a Vector, can he still Transmit it? It doesn't seem like the intent. Also, a power like this is potentially limiting to future Parasite powers, though I'm not overly concerned about that.

Sadly, superfrog's comment about availability since this is an Uncommon is a very valid one. It's not as bad a Common but those collectors among us will want multiples.

Outside of all that, I like the concept here. Fun stuff and I like the creative synergy. The combination of 7 Move, 6 Life, and 5 Attack is really brutal, though, even with only 1 Defense. Even without Gnids that's some really-good value for 50pts. Of course, the Marcu comparison strongly suggests it's not out of line.

[wriggz]

It seems that Vector is a fairly hefty investment for a figure that can be torn apart by squads.

To get the most out of him you need to invest Half an order marker and 25 points of Gnids to load him up. Then you need to attack a hero at least 2 times in melee combat before he is destroyed (and remember if the hero is destroyed the Gnids are not used). After three attacks of 3 (easy for any ranged Squad) he is going to take an average of 3.62 wounds. Even with 7 move, there is a good chance there will be at least one un-answered attack.

I don't really see the option of loading him up anywhere but the start zone, since once in battle he is not going to last very long.

As for the figure, Uncommon means you are likely picking up some Heroclix figures for repainting. I'm fairly loose as far as marro go, but this version lacks the skeletal features most Marro have. Oddly enough if they ever made a Heroclix version of Abomination from the Movie it would look a lot more marro-ish.


I really like the idea of a diseased unit however and see lot of potential.

[Tiranx]

Originally Posted by wriggz

It seems that Vector is a fairly hefty investment for a figure that can be torn apart by squads.

To get the most out of him you need to invest Half an order marker and 25 points of Gnids to load him up. Then you need to attack a hero at least 2 times in melee combat before he is destroyed (and remember if the hero is destroyed the Gnids are not used). After three attacks of 3 (easy for any ranged Squad) he is going to take an average of 3.62 wounds. Even with 7 move, there is a good chance there will be at least one un-answered attack.

I don't really see the option of loading him up anywhere but the start zone, since once in battle he is not going to last very long.



As for the figure, Uncommon means you are likely picking up some Heroclix figures for repainting. I'm fairly loose as far as marro go, but this version lacks the skeletal features most Marro have. Oddly enough if they ever made a Heroclix version of Abomination from the Movie it would look a lot more marro-ish.


I really like the idea of a diseased unit however and see lot of potential.

In play testing, I regularly disengaged 3-4 times to get to a Hero I wanted to place a Gnid on. He is a very kamikaze unit. Put a few wounds on a hero unit, pass the Gnid, and he would usually die. If he didn't die it was a great distraction while my other units moved up.

I loved taking one squad of Gnids and two Vectors. Turn marker one always was a squad of Gnids loading up both Vectors. I would never take more than two Vectors in an Army. I always used my painted Abomination and then used an original one. Then it was easy to distinguish the difference without even using stickers.

[Tiranx]

Ok, I like Caps suggestion a lot. I would change Mutualistic Symbiosis by removing the last sentence.

Then, I could add the ability Disease Immunity.

Disease Immunity

"This Marro Vector's Attack, Defense, and Movement are never reduced by any special power on any Army Card."


I know the Gnids only affect Defense and Movement, but that leaves it open to new parasites in the future; additionally, it removes the immunity issues you guys brought up before.