Leaf_It's customs.

[Kinseth]

Could you do something like this

Shadow Shift
After revealing an order marker on, and taking a turn with a Common Drow Squad, or Common Drow Hero, you may choose one of the figures that attacked or moved this turn that is within 6 sight spaces of a Drow Assassin. You may Switch the Drow Assassin with the chosen figure. Figures moved by Shadow Shift never take any leaving engagement attacks.

Assassination 2
After taking a turn with a Drow hero or squad, you may reveal the X order marker on this card, if you do, you may take a turn with this Drow Assassin. During this turn, you may add 2 to its attack value.

Hide in Darkness
If a Drow Assassin is attacked with a normal attack and at least 1 skull is rolled, roll the 20-sided die. If that Drow Assassin is on a dungeon space, add 3 to your die roll. If it is on a shadow space, add 6 to your die roll. If you roll a 1-15, roll defense dice normally. If you roll a 16 or higher, ignore all damage that would have been inflicted by the attack.

Wording needs cleaning up, but I think this gives the feel of an assassin, without it adding too much to the faction, but adds just enough.

[superfrog]

Originally Posted by Kinseth

Could you do something like this

Shadow Shift
After revealing an order marker on, and taking a turn with a Common Drow Squad, or Common Drow Hero, you may choose one of the figures that attacked or moved this turn that is within 6 sight spaces of a Drow Assassin. You may Switch the Drow Assassin with the chosen figure. Figures moved by Shadow Shift never take any leaving engagement attacks.

Assassination 2
After taking a turn with a Drow hero or squad, you may reveal the X order marker on this card, if you do, you may take a turn with this Drow Assassin. During this turn, you may add 2 to its attack value.

Hide in Darkness
If a Drow Assassin is attacked with a normal attack and at least 1 skull is rolled, roll the 20-sided die. If that Drow Assassin is on a dungeon space, add 3 to your die roll. If it is on a shadow space, add 6 to your die roll. If you roll a 1-15, roll defense dice normally. If you roll a 16 or higher, ignore all damage that would have been inflicted by the attack.

Wording needs cleaning up, but I think this gives the feel of an assassin, without it adding too much to the faction, but adds just enough.

I love this idea.

[Leaf_It]

Before responding to all of you, my notes I made last night prior to seeing your suggestions were ass follows

Remove bonding from Shadow Shift, lower Shadow Shift's range to 4 spaces, allow Shifting to happen before or after moving with any figure that has the Hide in Darkness Ability, drop Sneak Attack, buff the Attack to 4, and drop the points to 25 for now. This makes it so that Drow range can exist, even in Common form, and as long as you don't give them HiD. It also allows for Uniques to synergize if they happen to have HiD.

I wasn't completely sure about the Hide in Darkness requirement, and I would probably have toyed with keeping it as just Common Drow as well. I wasn't sure about the reduced range to Shift either, though I expect that it's range raised some concerns,so I thought about lowering it. None of this was set in stone, it was just ideas I had to potentially rework the Assassin.

Now that I've got what I was thinking to do out of the way....

Originally Posted by wriggz

I will give the feedback I thought was valuable here:

1. Height restriction not required - Its magic so you can remove this, moving potentially 12 spaces is akin to fey step anyway. Also your limit already let him jump up 5 levels, which on any official map is close to the high point.

I like really tall maps, like maps that have double tall castles, and stuff. I think they look really cool. I don't play on them a lot, but I like them, and didn't want the Assassin to be able to just jump onto the top of a castle. If I was going to change this, I might increase it to 10, so that She could just up 1 high castle walls, but not double high castle walls. A more classic scapey reason, is that the Monks have a height limit, even if it is ridiculously high, and basically covers everything in normal tournament play. Also the Warforged, and the Horned Skull Brutes, which are the only official cards to have a switching mechanic, both had height restrictions.

Originally Posted by wriggz

2. Sneak Attack - I don't mind it but I really think you could just give him 4 attack and move on. Makes him more versatile too. Look at the Chain fighter - he is a bruiser.

Sneak attack was deliberate for 2 main reasons. It forced you to put the Assassin a dangerous place to get the full potential, and it was a deterrent to simply making a mad dash towards your opponent's army. The difficulty it brought towards using the Assassin at her full potential really kept her from being an over all huge buff to the Drow, though that doesn't seem to have mattered. As you can see above, I had already decided to take it off for simplicity's sake.

Originally Posted by wriggz

3. Drop defense to 2. This goes with the 4 attack, but really makes your custom unique. Everyone wants to throw 3 defense on everything. He already has hide in the darkness so that is already giving him some survivability.

I don't like this too much. However, if I keep bonding on the card, I might do this to lower her points, and make her easier to draft.

Originally Posted by wriggz

4. I would also go with "After revealing an order marker on, and taking a turn with a Common Drow Army Card" though I would check with others if that is a viable option.

This would be met with resistance due to the potential for kiting with range. It's mostly an issue with higher attack special attackers, which Estivara fits. If a common ranged Drow squad were to be created, it really wouldn't make them that great because you can only shift one of them at a time, and since they're common, they aren't going to have a very high attack thus limiting the potential. But this reason is from my understanding a reason the Assassin didn't pass this time through, and allowing Estivara to bond with them, would make that worse.
Wait, I read that completely wrong. I'm sorry. This is a good idea. Thank you.

Originally Posted by wriggz

This would make the card much less complex and crowded, and a lot more unique. If you go with these suggestions you may need to move the point total (likely to 30) but only testing will confirm that.

Thank you for the feedback and suggestions.

Originally Posted by Kinseth

Could you do something like this

Shadow Shift
After revealing an order marker on, and taking a turn with a Common Drow Squad, or Common Drow Hero, you may choose one of the figures that attacked or moved this turn that is within 6 sight spaces of a Drow Assassin. You may Switch the Drow Assassin with the chosen figure. Figures moved by Shadow Shift never take any leaving engagement attacks.

Assassination 2
After taking a turn with a Drow hero or squad, you may reveal the X order marker on this card, if you do, you may take a turn with this Drow Assassin. During this turn, you may add 2 to its attack value.

Hide in Darkness
If a Drow Assassin is attacked with a normal attack and at least 1 skull is rolled, roll the 20-sided die. If that Drow Assassin is on a dungeon space, add 3 to your die roll. If it is on a shadow space, add 6 to your die roll. If you roll a 1-15, roll defense dice normally. If you roll a 16 or higher, ignore all damage that would have been inflicted by the attack.

Wording needs cleaning up, but I think this gives the feel of an assassin, without it adding too much to the faction, but adds just enough.

This is an interesting idea, and it would make the Assassin much more versatile. I would also potentially require a price boost to accommodate that. I want to refrain from raising the price above 35 if I can so that they fit more easily with the Deepwyrm. I'll keep this in mind though. See my response to superfrog...

Originally Posted by superfrog

I love this idea.

But would those who voted against the Assassin love this any more than the original? Does this address the issues they had, or simply bring up more? Sneak attack had potential to be used more often, but in practice usually didn't come into play more than once or twice per round. This would give a guaranteed buff to the attack, but at the cost of taking 3 turns in a row when used at full potential. Take a turn with the Deepwyrm, then shift the Assassin, then reveal the X to take a third turn. It's almost a guaranteed kill to something at that point, because it gets you 5 separate attacks in. It's interesting, and if I thought it would be well received, I would be less reluctant to adapt the idea. It looks like a buff to me though. A design that's just straight up better than any other Common Drow, which wasn't my intention with the Assassin. Assassinate 2 feels like something that would fit better on a Unique, or Uncommon hero.

[TREX]

Originally Posted by Kinseth

Could you do something like this

Shadow Shift
After revealing an order marker on, and taking a turn with a Common Drow Squad, or Common Drow Hero, you may choose one of the figures that attacked or moved this turn that is within 6 sight spaces of a Drow Assassin. You may Switch the Drow Assassin with the chosen figure. Figures moved by Shadow Shift never take any leaving engagement attacks.

Assassination 2
After taking a turn with a Drow hero or squad, you may reveal the X order marker on this card, if you do, you may take a turn with this Drow Assassin. During this turn, you may add 2 to its attack value.

Hide in Darkness
If a Drow Assassin is attacked with a normal attack and at least 1 skull is rolled, roll the 20-sided die. If that Drow Assassin is on a dungeon space, add 3 to your die roll. If it is on a shadow space, add 6 to your die roll. If you roll a 1-15, roll defense dice normally. If you roll a 16 or higher, ignore all damage that would have been inflicted by the attack.

Wording needs cleaning up, but I think this gives the feel of an assassin, without it adding too much to the faction, but adds just enough.

I. LOVE. THIS.
All I would do from here is. Cut down the first power to just give a turn on the x marker when using the other drow units and give the assassin some poison weapons. He/she would be lethal with the 2 extra dice. What assasin doesnt need poison weapons. Im totally stealing this if you guys dont do something with it. It deserves the drow. Love the slinky side attack via the x marker for some shadowy assassin.

[Scytale]

Personally, I think that forcing this unit's interaction on a different army card's turn is doing the unit a disservice. You have to ask yourself, what do you want this unit to be? If the answer is, "something to beef up the Drow," then do something cheerleaderish. If the answer is "make a Drow assassin," then focus on that.

My suggestion would be something along the lines of the Drow Chainfighter, who doesn't rely on others to get his work done. I do like the ideas behind the Drow synergy of the original design, though, and think they could be utilized less forcefully.

Something like this:

Attack: 5
Defense: 2

Shadow Shift
Before or after moving a Drow Assassin normally, you may choose a small or medium Drow figure within 6 clear sight spaces. Swap the two figures. Figures moved by Shadow Shift never take leaving engagement attacks.

Hide in Darkness
If a Drow Assassin is attacked with a normal attack and at least 1 skull is rolled, roll the 20-sided die. If that Drow Assassin is on a dungeon space, add 3 to your die roll. If it is on a shadow space, add 6 to your die roll. If you roll a 1-15, roll defense dice normally. If you roll a 16 or higher, ignore all damage that would have been inflicted by the attack.

[Leaf_It]

Originally Posted by Scytale

Personally, I think that forcing this unit's interaction on a different army card's turn is doing the unit a disservice. You have to ask yourself, what do you want this unit to be? If the answer is, "something to beef up the Drow," then do something cheerleaderish. If the answer is "make a Drow assassin," then focus on that.

My suggestion would be something along the lines of the Drow Chainfighter, who doesn't rely on others to get his work done. I do like the ideas behind the Drow synergy of the original design, though, and think they could be utilized less forcefully.

Something like this:

Attack: 5
Defense: 2

Shadow Shift
Before or after moving a Drow Assassin normally, you may choose a small or medium Drow figure within 6 clear sight spaces. Swap the two figures. Figures moved by Shadow Shift never take leaving engagement attacks.

Hide in Darkness
If a Drow Assassin is attacked with a normal attack and at least 1 skull is rolled, roll the 20-sided die. If that Drow Assassin is on a dungeon space, add 3 to your die roll. If it is on a shadow space, add 6 to your die roll. If you roll a 1-15, roll defense dice normally. If you roll a 16 or higher, ignore all damage that would have been inflicted by the attack.

This is very similar to the reworked version that I posted earlier in this thread, except mine still uses the Assassination ability suggested by Kinseth. It didn't get a lot of attention though, because of how popular Kinseth's version is. I'm actually testing out both his, and my own version, to see which one I like more.

[Scytale]

Originally Posted by Leaf_It

This is very similar to the reworked version that I posted earlier in this thread, except mine still uses the Assassination ability suggested by Kinseth. It didn't get a lot of attention though, because of how popular Kinseth's version is. I'm actually testing out both his, and my own version, to see which one I like more.

Both that and Kinseth's versions have the one thing I removed: pseudo-bonding. It's neat and all, but it's the most design-restricting aspect of the whole unit. It prevents any future Drow bonding abilities, still has the large threat range concern (including early glyph-grabbing potential), and opens up a bunch of tricky end-of-turn interactions to consider. The question is, does the design need it? Is the bonus turn really core to the unit's functionality? Shadow Shift and Hide in Darkness already weigh it down with plenty of complexity for a common hero.

[Leaf_It]

Originally Posted by Scytale

Both that and Kinseth's versions have the one thing I removed: pseudo-bonding. It's neat and all, but it's the most design-restricting aspect of the whole unit. It prevents any future Drow bonding abilities, still has the large threat range concern (including early glyph-grabbing potential), and opens up a bunch of tricky end-of-turn interactions to consider. The question is, does the design need it? Is the bonus turn really core to the unit's functionality? Shadow Shift and Hide in Darkness already weigh it down with plenty of complexity for a common hero.

By Pseudo-bonding, are you referring to Assassination? My version of Shadow Shift happens on the Assassin's turn, and the Assassin's turn only.

Shadow Shift
Before or after moving a Drow Assassin, and before attacking, you may choose a Drow figure that you control within 4 spaces of that Drow Assassin. You may Switch the Drow Assassin with the chosen figure. Figures moved by Shadow Shift never take any leaving engagement attacks.