Boot Camp of Valhalla: Kobolds of Idona Keep (Reworking)

[Maklar the Silver Prince]

Originally Posted by ollie

I've been reading occasionally but not following closely. This is a great project.

I've just seen the "Warrior's Devotion" power for the first time. How much discussion was there about using Warrior as the class? I would've thought that was an automatic no: it's the bland generic class to use when you don't want any synergy. Isn't it?

There was no to very little discussion at all about using the warrior class. I think the reason there was no problem with the warrior class is because it doesn't have very much synergy and wouldn't over power these guys. Besides, these guys are Sentinels, help some underappreciated units, and use an interesting power barely based off two other official powers. I don't think that's bland.

Also, after reading through many, many pages of discussion, I found where we discussed making these guys from Valhalla. I must have missed it. Somebody should write a bio for these guys. Perhaps I do that today. As for the name, perhaps something that symbolizes how they have pledged their allegiance to Jandar. Goblet-Bearers of Jandar? Or maybe something that explains their class. Kobold Watchers? Kobold Pickets of Idona Keep?

I've made myself clear on the point, but all we really need to do is pick a number and move on. I suggest we start with 40, 45, or 50.

[ollie]

Originally Posted by Maklar the Silver Prince

There was no to very little discussion at all about using the warrior class. I think the reason there was no problem with the warrior class is because it doesn't have very much synergy and wouldn't over power these guys. Besides, these guys are Sentinels, help some underappreciated units, and use an interesting power barely based off two other official powers. I don't think that's bland.

My point on blandness was the other way: you can use the Warrior class on a unit without it adding to the stack of synergies you have to think about. Giving these guys synergy with Warriors removes that trait.

That the Warrior class has no synergy is, I think, the reason not to use it here.

[caps]

Originally Posted by ollie

I've been reading occasionally but not following closely. This is a great project.

I've just seen the "Warrior's Devotion" power for the first time. How much discussion was there about using Warrior as the class? I would've thought that was an automatic no: it's the bland generic class to use when you don't want any synergy. Isn't it?

I think the idea was to make them servants of the Kyrie while keeping other options open. Your point is good, though--maybe Warriors should remain synergy-less. What's a good alternative, in your opinion, Ollie?

[ollie]

Wasn't there something about them serving dragons at some point?

[Soundwarp SG-1]

Originally Posted by ollie

Wasn't there something about them serving dragons at some point?

They're not the right Kobolds for that. The Dragon Worship is a D&D thing, but these Kobolds are mammalian not reptilian like the D&D Kobolds.

[ollie]

Aah, thanks Soundwarp.

It's a shame that there are so many variants on royalty in the classes; Kings and Queens could have worked well. Still might, I guess. But Kings, Queens, Empresses, Dukes, Minor Barons, Second Earls,... not so much.

Champion? (Are there others beside the Human and Orc Champions? If not this gives a good wide spread of targets without adding new synergy to currently unsynergised heroes.)

[Soundwarp SG-1]

Originally Posted by ollie

Aah, thanks Soundwarp.

It's a shame that there are so many variants on royalty in the classes; Kings and Queens could have worked well. Still might, I guess. But Kings, Queens, Empresses, Dukes, Minor Barons, Second Earls,... not so much.

Champion? (Are there others beside the Human and Orc Champions? If not this gives a good wide spread of targets without adding new synergy to currently unsynergised heroes.)

The problem there (for me anyway) is they wouldn't have anyone from their own Planet that they work with. Right now, the plan was that they would be from Valhalla. Even if the homeworld changes, they can't be from Earth. They could be from Grut I guess, but those Champions follow the wrong General.

I'm on the opposite side of the fence when it comes to adding synergy than you are, but if Warriors are an absolute no go for you, what about Kyrie Heroes? It preserves the intent of the power (mostly) and Kyrie are already an established synergy group.

EDIT- Come to think of it, Warriors are an established synergy group too thanks to Zogross...

[Maklar the Silver Prince]

How about Kyrie and Kobold heroes? Shows who they've devoted themselves to, and even though there are no Kobold heroes, there weren't any LizardFolk heroes till Zogross Hardscale.

Now that I think about it, Ollie is right about the warrior class. Its a shame though, I wanted to see a sea of these little guys charging into battle with Jotun.

[johnny139]

Still like Art C best here.

Warrior has never really been a "generic" class to me - not on heroes, at least. It's always pretty much been Kyrie heroes, though with squads it's pretty much a generic term for "low level semi-trained battle guys."

I don't mind using it here because it's a generic term, and I don't want to lose Ulfrid or Jotun... but I do feel bad cutting away one of the few "generic" classes. I know Zogross has synergy there but it's more Ullar synergy and not anywhere near as significant as these guys - you wouldn't need to take it into account for balancing, y'know?

I'd be in favor of a switch to "Unique Kyrie Hero" as it gives us no new options and we only lose three units (Jotun, Shurrak, Ulfrid). It makes the thematic tie as "servants of the Kyrie" a bit more direct as well. Kyrie Devotion is my vote.

I'm in favor of Kobolds of Idona Keep as well by the way. It hearkens to the old Magic the Gathering card (Kobolds of Kher Keep) as well, which is a fun little semi-shout-out. I haven't seen any other popular suggestions so are we running with it?

[Soundwarp SG-1]

Originally Posted by johnny139

I'm in favor of Kobolds of Idona Keep as well by the way. It hearkens to the old Magic the Gathering card (Kobolds of Kher Keep) as well, which is a fun little semi-shout-out.

Glad someone else got that.

[Arch-vile]

I think the Warrior class offers a lot more diversity than "Kyrie Heroes", personally. All the Kyrie heroes have very similar stats (5 life, 3 attack, 3 defense). Sure, there are some deviations and the various auras will make them play differently but a major variation would be if Ulfrid, Jotun, or Shurrak was the Kobold's chosen warrior. Suddenly you have a high-life hero which allows more Kobolds to attack (Jotun), high attack heroes (Jotun, Shurrak), and a hero with insane survivability (Ulfrid). No Kyrie offers those options.

We have plenty of generic synergy less classes we've only used once or twice. Fighter, Marauder, etc.

Kobolds of Idona Keep is a great name, I love that scenario in the castle set.

[Soundwarp SG-1]

You know, for some weird reason, I keep see these guys as talking exclusively in rhyme. I have no idea why

So, to get it out of my system, I composed a poem! It is Terrible!

The Traditional Kobold hymn of service:

Noble Master, full of grace
Gives us a home, gives us a place

We watch the castle, watch the keep
Tend the fires, floors we sweep

Harm the master
You’d better run
We ask no quarter
And we offer none.