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C3G Legacy Library This is the archive for all the designs released in the original era of C3G. Feel free to post any figure specific questions in their individual books.


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  #73  
Old August 12th, 2014, 08:03 PM
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Re: The Book of Zabu - Vote for Public Playtesting

yea to testing @ 130

I know that I do not know.
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  #74  
Old August 12th, 2014, 09:26 PM
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Re: The Book of Zabu - Vote for Public Playtesting

Yea at 130

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  #75  
Old August 12th, 2014, 10:07 PM
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Re: The Book of Zabu - Vote for Public Playtesting

Doesn't look like his normal attack is getting used at all. Should we set it back to 4?

Yea at 130 in either case.

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  #76  
Old August 13th, 2014, 12:19 PM
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Re: The Book of Zabu - Vote for Public Playtesting

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Originally Posted by Zettian Juggernaut View Post
SP updated, and I propose we move to public playtest with current SP.

VOTES:
A3n -
IAmBatman - Abstain?
johnny139 - Yea
Lord Pyre - Abstain
quozl - Yea
SirGalahad - Yea
Tcglkn - Yea
TrollBrute - Yea
24 hours, or @tcglkn and @A3n .

Quote:
Originally Posted by quozl View Post
Doesn't look like his normal attack is getting used at all. Should we set it back to 4?
It was used some, it's just only going to be used after you use the SA.

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Last edited by Zettian Juggernaut; August 13th, 2014 at 12:46 PM.
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  #77  
Old August 13th, 2014, 12:41 PM
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Re: The Book of Zabu - Vote for Public Playtesting

Yea.
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  #78  
Old August 13th, 2014, 05:31 PM
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Re: The Book of Zabu - Vote for Public Playtesting

Yea. Lost subscription here & now I don't know where I can subscribe to it. Since the update I don't have the subscribe to this thread option at the bottom of the page .

EDIT: Ok I just found where the subscribe option is. It's at the top of the thread now under the thread tools menu.
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  #79  
Old August 13th, 2014, 05:50 PM
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Re: The Book of Zabu - Vote for Public Playtesting

This Passes.

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  #80  
Old August 29th, 2014, 01:51 PM
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Re: The Book of Zabu - Public Playtesting Phase

Here's a report for Zabu.

I really like how Zabu plays right now; he's simple and thematic, and him and Ka-Zar are one of the most fun duos to play (especially on jungle maps). Hunters Companion is pretty interesting because it's not straight-up bonding, I liked some of the strategies it offered.

At first, I was worried Zabu would be too strong as-is, especially since Kraven is incredible for his cost and Ka-Zar on a jungle map is killer; but after running four games I think Zabu is perfect at 130. His team did lose all four games, but at least in the last couple his team had below-average luck, and I matched them up against some tougher builds (namely the Hawks and the Titans). Zabu has the potential to do some serious damage, but he's fragile and a little tricky to use just right, and if his Companion goes down early (which can certainly happen) he'll be stranded and probably die too.

Zabu is perfect as-is in my opinion.

C3G STANDARD PLAYTEST FEEDBACK FORM

NAME OF THE TEST UNIT Zabu

- THEME TEST
Pass

- MIRROR TEST
Pass

- BONDING TEST
Pass

- SYNERGIES TEST
Pass

- POWER CHECK
Pass

- FUN TEST
Pass

- FUN COMPETITIVE TEST
Pass

- DRAFTING TEST
Pass

- USAGE TEST
Pass

- STRATEGY TEST
Pass

_____________________________________________________________

Army Test 1
- Does it pass, Yes or No?
Pass
- What should be the unit's point value? 130 seems great.
- Give a brief overview. Backed by Cap, Ka-Zar and Zabu made a deadly first-strike team, taking down Storm early in the first round, and then both the Sidekicks in the second. But Black King was able to get in on the Avengers, and with a little luck on his side took them down one by one, pulling out the win for the Mutant team.

UNIT SUM-UP
Damage:
Normal Attack: 2 wounds to Armor, 1 wound to Jubilee.
Special Attack: 1 wound to Storm.
Power Usage/Effectiveness:
Hunter’s Companion: Ka-Zar chosen to be companion. Moved after his companion 3 times, attacked after his companion 4 times.
Devastating Pounce SA: Used 1 times out of 4 attacks. Didn’t take any wounds.
Jungle Strength 1: Boosted 3 attack rolls, boosted 1 defense rolls.

Map: Island Plane Crash (no glyphs or special rules)
Units: Ka-Zar, Zabu, Captain America (C3G), Bucky (600 points) VS Storm, Black King, Jubilee, Armor (600 points)
Spoiler Alert!


_____________________________________________________________

Army Test 2
- Does it pass, Yes or No?
Pass
- What should be the unit's point value? 130 or so
- Give a brief overview. Zabu got in a big hit on Hawkgirl early, which was really useful, but he didn’t survive long after that.

UNIT SUM-UP
Damage:
Normal Attack: N/A
Special Attack: 3 wounds to Hawkgirl.
Power Usage/Effectiveness:
Hunter’s Companion: Kraven chosen to be companion. Moved after his companion 4 times, attacked after his companion 1 time.
Devastating Pounce SA: Used 1 time out of 1 attack. Took 1 wound from this SA.
Jungle Strength 1: Never came into effect.

Map: Island Plane Crash (no glyphs or special rules)
Units: Zabu, Kraven, Captain America (C3G), Bucky, Spider-Man (Miles Morales) (800 points) VS Hawkman, Hawkgirl, Hawkmen of Thanagar x3, Atom (800 points)
Spoiler Alert!


_____________________________________________________________

Army Test 3
- Does it pass, Yes or No?
Pass
- What should be the unit's point value? 130
- Give a brief overview. Zabu didn’t get to do anything this game because Ka-Zar went down early and Zabu got a couple wounds, making him too risky of a place to put OMs.

UNIT SUM-UP
Damage:
Normal Attack: Never attacked.
Special Attack: Never attacked.
Power Usage/Effectiveness:
Hunter’s Companion: Ka-Zar chosen to be companion. Moved after his companion 2 times.
Devastating Pounce SA: Never attacked.
Jungle Strength 1: Boosted 0 attack rolls, boosted 7 defense rolls.

Map: Island Plane Crash (no glyphs or special rules)
Units: Zabu, Ka-Zar, Bizarro (610 points) VS Nightwing, Cyborg, Raven, Beast Boy (Cheetah) (610 points)
Spoiler Alert!


_____________________________________________________________

Army Test 4
- Does it pass, Yes or No?
Pass
- What should be the unit's point value? 130
- Give a brief overview. Zabu didn’t do that well this game, but the dice were kind of against him. While everyone else was rolling well on attack dice, Zabu rolled poorly both times he Pounced, and he whiffed on a key defense roll, leading to him not doing much. Had the dice been more in his favor, I believe Zabu would have been able to swing the game for his team.

UNIT SUM-UP
Damage:
Normal Attack: N/A
Special Attack: 1 wound to Colossus.
Power Usage/Effectiveness:
Hunter’s Companion: Ka-Zar chosen to be companion. Moved after his companion 2 times, attacked after his companion 2 times.
Devastating Pounce SA: Used 2 times out of 2 attacks. Took 2 wounds from this SA.
Jungle Strength 1: Boosted 0 attack rolls, boosted 2 defense rolls.

Map: Island Plane Crash (no glyphs or special rules)
Units: Zabu, Ka-Zar, Bizarro (610 points) VS Colossus, Lockheed, Sabretooth (610 points)
Spoiler Alert!

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  #81  
Old August 29th, 2014, 02:43 PM
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Re: The Book of Zabu - Public Playtesting Phase

Thanks, Viegon. I'm happy with 130 so far.

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  #82  
Old August 29th, 2014, 06:52 PM
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Re: The Book of Zabu - Public Playtesting Phase

He looks maybe a tad weak for 130 there, but if the dice were part of it, I could see that.

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  #83  
Old August 29th, 2014, 08:04 PM
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Re: The Book of Zabu - Public Playtesting Phase

Quote:
Originally Posted by IAmBatman View Post
He looks maybe a tad weak for 130 there, but if the dice were part of it, I could see that.
While Zabu and his team never had terrible luck, they consistently had below-average luck. With balanced dice, Zabu would have been doing a little bit more damage each game and his team would have won the first and fourth game for sure.

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  #84  
Old September 7th, 2014, 11:54 AM
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Re: The Book of Zabu - Public Playtesting Phase

Results from Fret:
Quote:
Originally Posted by fret_gurglo
C3G STANDARD PLAYTEST FEEDBACK FORM

NAME OF THE TEST UNIT Zabu


- THEME TEST/ Check to see if there are any powers or stats on the test unit card that does not accurately reflect the theme or likeness of what the character would and could do. Also consider destructible objects, and whether or not this characters powers should affect them.
Pass

- MIRROR TEST/ Check to see if the unit were played against itself, if there would be any loops that would upset the balance of the Game.
Pass


- BONDING TEST/ Compare the unit card with all possible currently existing Bonding abilities to make sure there are no continual Bonding possibilities that do not stop appropriately or do not stop at all. This is to prevent loops in Bonding.
Pass.

- SYNERGIES TEST/ Compare the unit card with all possible currently existing synergies to make sure there are no factors that could break the game by making any unit to powerful or too weak.
Pass.


- POWER CHECK/ Consider the test unit and all existing units and all glyphs to compare to and check for any powers that could be over amplified and break the game. Each power must define when it takes place, who or what it affects, and What are the stipulations on the power if there are any.
Pass.

- FUN TEST/ Consider whether or not the design was fun to play.
Pass.

- FUN COMPETITIVE TEST/ Consider whether or not the design was fun to play against.
Pass.

- DRAFTING TEST/ Consider whether or not this design is worth drafting.
Tough call. Dice were not always in Zabu’s favor for my playtests, so these tests say FAIL. However I believe it should be a Pass at 130.


- USAGE TEST/ Consider whether or not all of the powers on this card were used or at least usable.
Conditional Pass. Zabu is only useful if taken with a Human Hunter (currently only Kraven meets this condition) and on a map that consists of 2 or more forest or jungle sets. But this is no worse than saying Sandman is only good if there is sand tiles or Iceman is only good using Tundra sets.


- STRATEGY TEST/ Consider whether or not the design offers any real strategy or interesting tactics to the overall game.
Pass.


Zabu is actually quite powerful in the right conditions. However, after doing these playtests it seemed relatively easy to nullify those conditions. By either avoiding trees, moving OMs or direct assaults on either Zabu or his companion very quickly eliminated all his advantages.

_____________________________________________________________


Army Test
- Does it pass, Yes or No? Yes

- What should be the unit's point value? 100-120

Give a brief overview. Hydra focused on Kraven and quickly took him out. This left Zabu with no master. OM control prevented some of Zabu’s synergy.
Map: Country Road
Units: ANIMAL KINGDOM (590) –Kraven (200), Super-Ape Peotor (170), Vulture (90), Zabu (130)VERSUS HYDRA (600) – A.I.M. Agents x2 (140), Hydra Agents (80), Red Skull (220), Scientist Supreme (160)
UNIT SUM-UP
Damage Inflicted(normal attacks): 1 wound Hydra Agent, 1 wound AIM agent
Power Usage/Effectiveness:
Hunter’s Companion(Movement): 3 times

Hunter’s Companion(Attack): 1 time
Devastating Pounce: 1 time to destroy a Hydra Agent
Jungle Strength: At least 6 rolls between attack and defend benefited

Spoiler Alert!

_____________________________________________________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by fret_gurglo
Army Test
- Does it pass, Yes or No? Yes

- What should be the unit's point value? ???

Give a brief overview. This was the most one-sided unlucky die roll game I have ever seen. ALL RESULTS HERE SHOULD NOT BEEN TAKEN INTO CONSIDERATION FOR POINT EVALUATION. Every time a Batman figure rolled defense it was all skulls. Truly this was amazing, but very frustrating to play
Map: Country Road
Units: HUNTING PARTY (800) –Bucky (60), Captain America (240), Emma Frost (170), Kraven (200), Zabu (130)VERSUS BATMAN FAMILY (800) – Alfred Pennyworth (60), Batgirl (130), Batman Bruce (200), Batman Terry (150), Red Robin Tim (160), Robin Dick (100)
UNIT SUM-UP
Damage Inflicted(normal attacks): 0
Power Usage/Effectiveness:
Hunter’s Companion(Movement): 4 times

Hunter’s Companion(Attack): 2 times
Devastating Pounce: 1 time to destroy Alfred
Jungle Strength: 0

Spoiler Alert!


Army Test
- Does it pass, Yes or No? Yes

- What should be the unit's point value? 100-110

Give a brief overview. Replay of the previous teams. Although the results were drastically different, it still does not give a good indication for Zabu as he was destroyed very early in the match. With the Batman Family frequently winning Initiative, it prevented many Captain America bonuses.
Map: Country Road
Units: HUNTING PARTY (800) –Bucky (60), Captain America (240), Emma Frost (170), Kraven (200), Zabu (130)VERSUS BATMAN FAMILY (800) – Alfred Pennyworth (60), Batgirl (130), Batman Bruce (200), Batman Terry (150), Red Robin Tim (160), Robin Dick (100)
UNIT SUM-UP
Damage Inflicted(normal attacks): 0
Power Usage/Effectiveness:
Hunter’s Companion(Movement): 2 times

Hunter’s Companion(Attack): 0
Devastating Pounce: 0
Jungle Strength: 0

Spoiler Alert!
Quote:
Originally Posted by fret_gurglo
I hope those tests are helpful. The dice were so wild during the playtesting.
Hmm, 130 might be a little high, but I'll wait to see after Ronin/Ornery. As to Usage Test, I could have sent them Ka-Zar with Zabu to give them a second option, but I forgot to.

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