The Book of Iron Man (Mark III)

[Griffin]

After "saving" him, yeah, you won't normally get much more value out of him, but you could. Anyways, I think Marv Art is somewhat new to C3G, and that has to account for something here.....

How well did Batman stand up to Iron Man's Flying Ranged Special Attack of 4... WITH RANGE OF 6? That range of 6 bypasses Evasive Strike.

How did Cyclops do earning his point value when he had no allies to lead? Or how well did his life of 4 and defense of 4 stand up to Iron Man's life of 4 and defense of 6 WITH A DEFENSE POWER while their biggest attacks are on par with each other?

No offense, but I wondering how well YOU are trying to utilize Iron Man's strength's while exploiting those enemies' weaknesses.....

[Good Pig]

Are you sure? I thought Marv_Art was in his 40's. His play tests have looked pretty solid in what I've seen over the past few months. I think it is the case of the swing creating good and bad experiences for different players.

I also think that you (Griffin) are more likely to squeeze more value out of any figure than anyone in C3G and as such lean towards the high end of a figures point range. This isn't a bad thing, just an observation as a point cost is rarely dead on, but rather a gray area of what each player can accomplish with each design.

Regarding this figures cost I'd say that a 'burned out' Iron Man post Circuitry Reroute is easily worth 40-50 points. Basically imagine how much a common hero with 5 attack / 6 defense would cost. He can also have as much as full life remaining after using Circuitry Reroute, if you were to biff big with your defense roll early on.

[Griffin]

Good points GP. I updated my comment in bold.

Thanks. I will pass this on to the Sanctum.

Originally Posted by marv_art

Iron Man could get 1 attack in out of range before Batman could become adjacent, I think out of the 5 playtests Iron did get 1 attack that wounded Bat's before he was adjacent, which doesn't take much with Bat's move of 6. I had a couple of tests were Bat's didn't roll good on Evasive Strike and some where he did. I also had 2 out of the 5 tests, where Irons Circuitry Reroute saved him from a KO. 1 test he would have received 4 wounds and KO'd in one punch if it hadn't worked. I had to run the 5 tests over, because my first run, I forgot Irons didn't have a RANGE value more than 1 and Irons was rolling a range attack on Bat's of 6 dice with height adv. After I realized my error I reran the tests. Also, as for Cyclops, I think his biggest fault was his 4 Defense, he couldn't save himself without the help of his teammates. Iron's 4 or 5 attack was too much for him. Some figs don't work well with themselves and he's proof of this, that's why I used Bat's as an alternative test, he seems more on same level as Iron. I like this Iron more than the Hasbro version. And feel he's good at 200, Can't wait to see the next.

[IAmBatman]

Honestly, from those head-to-heads (3-2 versus Batman, and 4-1 versus Cyclops) I'd put him at 210 minimum. So I'd say the tests have him at 230 and 210 thus far, which balances out at 220 - we'll see what the third test adds to the equation.

[Griffin]

That sounds logical.

[Griffin]

Thanks a lot.

Originally Posted by Margloth

C3G STANDARD PLAYTEST FEEDBACK FORM

NAME OF THE TEST UNIT Iron Man mk. 3

- THEME TEST/ Check to see if there are any powers or stats on the test unit card that does not accurately reflect the theme or likeness of what the character would and could do. Also consider destructible objects, and whether or not this characters powers should affect them.
Pass.

- MIRROR TEST/ Check to see if the unit were played against itself, if there would be any loops that would upset the balance of the Game.
Pass.

- BONDING TEST/ Compare the unit card with all possible currently existing Bonding abilities to make sure there are no continual Bonding possibilities that do not stop appropriately or do not stop at all. This is to prevent loops in Bonding.
Pass.

- SYNERGIES TEST/ Compare the unit card with all possible currently existing synergies to make sure there are no factors that could break the game by making any unit to powerful or too weak.
Pass.

- POWER CHECK/ Consider the test unit and all existing units and all glyphs to compare to and check for any powers that could be over amplified and break the game. Each power must define when it takes place, who or what it affects, and What are the stipulations on the power if there are any.
Pass.

- FUN TEST/ Consider whether or not the design was fun to play.
Pass.

- FUN COMPETITIVE TEST/ Consider whether or not the design was fun to play against.
Pass. Unless you're dumb and bring only low-move non fliers on a map with a lot of height.

- DRAFTING TEST/ Consider whether or not this design is worth drafting.
Pass.

- USAGE TEST/ Consider whether or not all of the powers on this card were used or at least usable.
Pass.

- STRATEGY TEST/ Consider whether or not the design offers any real strategy or interesting tactics to the overall game.
Pass. Simple but sweet, Shoot then scoot with your Iron suit.

_____________________________________________________________

Army Test
- Does it pass, Yes or No? Yes.
- What should be the unit's point value? Tested at 200 points, felt okay here, but I played him recklessly.
- Give a brief overview. Iron Man got owned pretty hard due to a whiff against Supes and then a Reroute fail. I think this Iron Man is simple and complex at the same time. An inexperienced player (whether new to the game or just new to Iron Man) can look at him and think, "6 defense and the opportunity to not die? I can put him right in the thick of things!" Unfortunately, as we all know well by now, 6 defense and 4 life is a bit of a glass jaw, and Reroute is more of a bonus than anything that should play a large roll in your strategy. But actually, I think this is perfect, as it can encourage an arrogant playstyle, which is theme = win.
Anyway, his team actually did very well here, and Iron Man did manage to rough Supes up a little, so I would definitely pay 200 points for him and can see the potential for more.
Map: X Marks the Spot (No Team Up)
Units: Iron Man, Giant Man, Thor, Cap (Hasbro) (1030) vs. Superman, Doomsday, Flash (1040)

Spoiler Alert!

Round 1: Initiative Avengers.
Giant Man moves out to take point. Doomsday superleaps into the fray. Cap moves forward adjacent to Giant Man, and puts 2 wounds on D-Day with a hurl of his shield. D-Day attacks Cap and puts a wound on the super soldier. Iron Man repulsors D-Day adjacent to Giant Man, but fails to get a Giant Swat in. D-Day chooses to heal rather than attack.

Round 2: Initiative Avengers.
Iron Man takes to a rooftop and blasts at D-Day, but fails to get a hit in. D-Day chooses to heal another wound. Iron Man uses his threat range of 12 to get 2 wounds and blow back Superman. Supes catches Tony and one shots him, Cicuitry Reroute and all, and taking OM 3 with him. Superman moves in to attack Giant Man, but gets swatted back.

Round 3: Initiative Avengers.
Thor moves forward and swings with Mjolnir, but fails to wound either of the Kryptonians. Supes gets a big 4 wound hit on Thor. Thor puts 2 wounds on D-day. Supes attacks Thor to no effect. Thor takes out D-Day. Supes attacks Thor to no effect again.

Round 4: Initiative Avengers.
Cap moves to support Thor, but fails to wound Supes with his shield. Supes attacks Thor but fails. Thor brings Supes to 5 wounds with his normal attack. Supes fails to break Thor's defense. Thor finishes Supes, taking OM 3 with him.

Round 5: Kryptonians.
D-Day heals. Thor moves out to hunt down Flash. D-Day heals again. Thor moves in and rolls for GoTS, but fails. D-day goes down to 3 wounds. Thor attacks Flash and rolls 4 skulls... Flash rolls defense... 4 skulls. Game over.

Summary: Avengers win R5T3 with Thor with 4 wounds, Cap with 1 wound, full health Giant Man.

_____________________________________________________________

Army Test
- Does it pass, Yes or No? Yes.
- What should be the unit's point value? Tested at 220. Definitely worth every bit of his points here and more. Based on this test, I would have absolutely paid up to 230 for him.
- Give a brief overview. Vigilantes is an army that has very good, but not excellent, mobility. I thought it would be interesting to really explore Iron Man's kiting potential here, and Vigilantes seemed a very fair army to try it against.
Vigilantes... got... OWNED. Iron Man's army is actually pretty awesome... excellent threat range, good defense, decent offensive power, and excellent flexibility. Definitely an army I'd try again.
Map: X Marks the Spot (No Team Up)
Units: Batman (Bruce), Robin, Huntress, Echo, Daredevil (800) vs. Iron Man, Flash, Hush, Bodyguards x 7 (795)

Spoiler Alert!

Round 1: Bruce is chosen for Obsessive Vendetta. Initiative Vigilantes.
Huntress and Robin move forward. Iron Man takes a rooftop and fires at Huntress, but misses. Huntress closes in to two spaces out and fires two bolts at Tony, but they glance off his armor. So does Robin's batarang. Flash moves onto the scene and fullisades Huntress for 2 wounds. Huntress and Robin fire on Flash, but he dodges or blocks all attacks. Flash takes out Huntress.

Round 2: Initiative Vigilantes.
Daredevil moves up to support Robin, and Robin falls back to him. Iron Man repulsors Robin for 2 wounds and pushes him back 3 spaces. DD moves up and fails an attack on Flash, but Robin gets him for 1 wound. Flash moves in to hammer DD with fist fullisades, knowing he can't Radar Sense too far away and expose Robin to Flash's fists, and puts 3 wounds on him due to a poor combination of defensive rolls. DD causes Flash to Speed Dodge, and Robin recklessly grapples to the top of the building to attack Tony, but fails to connect. Tony whiffs his Repulsor roll.

Round 3: Initiative Iron Man.
Tony repulsors Robin out of existence. DD attacks Flash, but catches nothing but air and suddenly finds the Speedster at his side. Seeing OM's on Echo, Flash peels off to hit her with a good fullisade, giving her 2 wounds. Echo mimicks Batman's defense and attacks Flash, but he dodges away. Flash can't break through her enhanced defense, but dodges her attack.

Round 4: Initiative Iron Man.
Tony moves off his rooftop and throws a weak repulsor blast Batman's way; easily countered. Batman attacks Flash; dodged. Tony takes a rooftop on the other side of the map and blasts Echo away. DD, having been ignored with his 3 wounds as crippled but still too hard to kill, makes a surprise rush at Hush, and puts a wound on him. Unfortunately, the gamble doesn't pay off, as he is surrounded by Bodyguards, fails a Radar Sense roll, and then his defense roll, and dies. Batman attacks Flash, but the Speedster dodges it.

Round 5: Initiative Iron Man.
Iron Man blasts Batman for 3 wounds and shoves him back 3 spaces. Batman decided to make a run at Hush, hurling batarangs at Flash and Iron Man on his way, but doing no damage. Iron Man falls back, being careful to maintain 6 spaces between Bats and himself, and fires an off-target blast. Bruce nears the enemy startzone and lets the 'rangs fly, but only takes out 1 Bodyguard. Iron Man blasts him into eternity.

Summary: Flash and Hush each have 1 wound, one bodyguard is dead, Iron Man has full health, and 6 bodyguards remain.

MARGLOTH'S BONUS SUMMARY O'DOOM!

Spoiler Alert!

Iron Man is an excellent, very fun unit with tons of potential in a relatively simple package. I really think this is an excellent representation of Tony, that may not jump out at your immediately.
Point cost is a little difficult for me to determine. Is he worth more than 200? Yes. Is he worth more than Hasbro Iron Man? Given the right circumstances, yes. Is a more skilled player able to get 230 out of him consistently? I'd say yes. Will the average player get 230 out of him consistently? Probably not. But I'd feel comfortable with him in the 220-230 range.

After all, anyone who could kite Superman can be pretty scary at times! On hilly terrain, this guy can be a real beast against walkers, and a 6 range SA is always a bit scary.

[Griffin]

I think 220 works for us here.

I propose we move to Final Editing at 220.

[IAmBatman]

220 sounds like the sweet spot here.

Edit: yea!

[SirGalahad]

yea to editing

[tcglkn]

Yea

[A3n]

Yea

[Spidey'tilIDie]

Yea to Final Editing.