The Book of Kingpin (II)

[japes]

Originally Posted by dok

The bottom bullet point could be fun to trot out in some 2000+ point mega-game, where you can manage a ton of different options - probably crooks, thieves, X23, Typhoid Mary, some Mutant Criminals, and mutant sidekicks + Yukio/Robot. Not really concerning since there's a million ridiculous things you can do at those point totals, but something you could try as sanity check.

I think it would be pretty cool to see you and Soundwarp go at it in a 2000 point online test so we can watch the magic happen.

oh and officially a YEA from me.

[johnny139]

Yea as well. I like dok's suggestion of the Frame Up ending when Kingpin is killed.

As for mini - I kind of like the third one, with the brandished cane, here. It looks like he's giving orders, which feels appropriate here. If the scale is better than the first one, naturally.

[Viegon]

Yea

[Soundwarp SG-1]

Originally Posted by johnny139

Yea as well. I like dok's suggestion of the Frame Up ending when Kingpin is killed.

I'm fine with Frame-Up having an out, not a huge difference either way. I guess I can just put that to vote after the initial vote is done?

As for mini - I kind of like the third one, with the brandished cane, here. It looks like he's giving orders, which feels appropriate here. If the scale is better than the first one, naturally.

Unfortunately, I can't find any pictures of that mini that I could gauge the scale from, but I did find a comparison of the other three Kingpins, and the size difference isn't is large as I remembered (it has been a long time since my Option A Kingpin has stood on his original legs). The scale of modern clix is a lot more even then it was with the early stuff, so I'd imagine Option C is pretty close to Option B's size. Modern clix are also a bit smaller and slimier on average too, so Option A would probably look fine among them (my modified one was meant to look Kingpin sized even among classic scape figures and such). I've got a fresh Option A coming in the mail, so I can get some pics of him and Option B next to a few figures when he arrives.

[Spidey'tilIDie]

If availability and look are equal, then option 2 is the best. I personally like Option 3, but I feel he is using the cane as a weapon. Could/would you be interested in tweaking his stats to make him a tad more combative than the original Kingpin? It would make either mini 2 or 3 seem much more appropriate.

[Soundwarp SG-1]

Originally Posted by Spidey'tilIDie

If availability and look are equal, then option 2 is the best. I personally like Option 3, but I feel he is using the cane as a weapon. Could/would you be interested in tweaking his stats to make him a tad more combative than the original Kingpin? It would make either mini 2 or 3 seem much more appropriate.

I can't really give him better stats than Kingpin I, decent stats are about the only thing Kingpin I has going for him. You have to play Kingpin I as basically an evil version of Luke Cage, where he's in the thick of combat and more of a field leader type, to get any use of him. This Kingpin is meant to be a more 'behind the scenes' take. I don't really want his points driven up by stats he's not meant to be using that often, and I'm not sure it would fly anyway since my understanding was sequel heroes are only ok if they represent different takes and don't step on the first card's toes. I'd imagine this Kingpin being more punchy than the punchy Kingpin would be a no go.

[Ronin]

I think their leadership powers are different enough that there's very little overlap between this guy and Kingpin I anyway, but I agree with Soundwarp's point on the differentiation.

[Soundwarp SG-1]

Originally Posted by Ronin

I think their leadership powers are different enough that there's very little overlap between this guy and Kingpin I anyway, but I agree with Soundwarp's point on the differentiation.

Oh yeah, their powers do lend to very different things, but part of my concern is that this Kingpin is a Crime Lord (and I'd prefer to keep him that way), which means he can sneak back into some of the same play patterns as Kingpin I through other card's bonding type powers. Not a concern with his current stats, but if he gets bumped up to a 6/6 or something I think it would start eating into the limited territory Kingpin I gets to play in in an undesirable way.



Anyway, the vote for Initial Playtesting passes. Huzah. I should be able to get started on that this weekend.

[Yodaking]

Originally Posted by Soundwarp SG-1

Punisher is definitely one of Kingpin's better Frame-Up targets, but I don't think it will end up anything super concerning simply because Punisher already has a couple ways to get to similar output levels with other builds. Worth a test though.

Fortunately, none of the current Criminal synergy is anything terribly crazy, and Frame-Up can only pull from classes that already are established synergy recipients themselves, so I think the power will remain reasonably stable.

--

Anyway, on to other business, there are a couple of mini options for Kingpin-

Option A: A bit short for Kingpin (I had to completely replace the legs on my modded one to get him to the right height), but has the best pose for a 'behind the scenes' Kingpin.

Option B: Better on size but the pose is all wrong.

Option C: I don't have this one, so I can't speak to the size, but the pose isn't great.


This is the comic art I'm leaning towards at the moment, only one I could find that has the right feel so far. If we go with this one, I can edit it a bit to match whatever mini is picked.


Anyone have any thoughts here? Also, I don't really know what the steps are for a design or when to change them, so if y'all could let me know when I'm supposed to do that stuff I'd appreciate it.

The sun was shining today so I took some pics of option B (the only one of the 3 I had on hand) should you decided to go with it. They will be in the mini photo depository.

[Ronin]

Any updates on the initial here?

[Soundwarp SG-1]

Originally Posted by Ronin

Any updates on the initial here?

Sorry, having to write out everything as it happens really kills my testing speed. I should have something later tonight.

[Ronin]

No worries, just wanted to check in.