[Pod 0] Honored Soul-Guides - Editing

[flameslayer93]

Thinking on it a bit, I think it would be neat if Last Will only proc’d on normal attacks since we have units like Ana Karithon who have SA’s that are meant to destroy the undead. Plus it would give them some extra counterdraft-ness.

Edit: A thing that kills undead would also probably be welcome as a counterdraft unit in the set. Hmm.

[Pumpkin_King]

I'd be up to try that version Scy, that sounds good. If it helps rules headaches I'm for it.

[Scytale]

Originally Posted by Pumpkin_King

I'd be up to try that version Scy, that sounds good. If it helps rules headaches I'm for it.

That version is pretty safe, except for some oddities such as with Spirits, though that stuff already has to be handled by the Revive glyph.

[caps]

It loses the cool factor of re-using one of your opponent's destroyed figures. But maybe that is for the best?

What was the motivation for a power change here? I don't see it clearly in the last couple dozen posts.

[flameslayer93]

Originally Posted by capsocrates

It loses the cool factor of re-using one of your opponent's destroyed figures. But maybe that is for the best?

What was the motivation for a power change here? I don't see it clearly in the last couple dozen posts.

Complexity, I believe.

[Astroking112]

Originally Posted by capsocrates

It loses the cool factor of re-using one of your opponent's destroyed figures. But maybe that is for the best?

What was the motivation for a power change here? I don't see it clearly in the last couple dozen posts.

I don't believe that we were planning on letting you reuse opponent's destroyed figures in the current iteration. Thematically and mechanically, I prefer limiting it to units that you control, anyway.

Mostly complexity. The single-turn revival is messy and leads to lots of unclear interactions that we don't really want new players to deal with.

[caps]

Originally Posted by Astroking112

I don't believe that we were planning on letting you reuse opponent's destroyed figures in the current iteration. Thematically and mechanically, I prefer limiting it to units that you control, anyway.

Mostly complexity. The single-turn revival is messy and leads to lots of unclear interactions that we don't really want new players to deal with.

Sure enough. I like Scytale's proposal then. It does seem simpler. Could be too good on figures like Heracles though.

[Astroking112]

I'm also a little concerned about figures with healing capabilities like Cyprien, who can theoretically heal back up to full health if things go south. This could be emulated with other characters as well with Kelda and a bit of luck.

Auras like Raelin or Taelord also don't need to worry about receiving OMs again if they're placed in the middle of the field, but they at least typically have lower defense values.

Ironically, the Deathwalkers essentially get two full extra lives from this idea, making them an excellent combo. I wouldn't be too concerned if the Zettian Infantry wasn't a thing, but we'd want to test that combo and make sure that it isn't too strong. If we bring back the small/medium restriction, then it's at least limited to only DW7k.

I'm game to move forward with Scytale's proposal. I think that it'll need a lot of testing, but the idea feels much more fitting for this project.

[Pumpkin_King]

Oof, I'm much more concerned now with those points, Astro.

[flameslayer93]

Sure enough. I like Scytale's proposal then. It does seem simpler. Could be too good on figures like Heracles though.

I'm also a little concerned about figures with healing capabilities like Cyprien, who can theoretically heal back up to full health if things go south. This could be emulated with other characters as well with Kelda and a bit of luck.

Auras like Raelin or Taelord also don't need to worry about receiving OMs again if they're placed in the middle of the field, but they at least typically have lower defense values.

Ironically, the Deathwalkers essentially get two full extra lives from this idea, making them an excellent combo. I wouldn't be too concerned if the Zettian Infantry wasn't a thing, but we'd want to test that combo and make sure that it isn't too strong. If we bring back the small/medium restriction, then it's at least limited to only DW7k.

I'm game to move forward with Scytale's proposal. I think that it'll need a lot of testing, but the idea feels much more fitting for this project.

I certainly view it as a concern, but that is ultimately what playtesting is for. If we do feel it is too much, we could always destroy the figure at the end of the round in addition to only having one wound, but I think we should test these guys out first with Scytale's suggested wording (maybe with the normal attack restriction, but I get if I'm the only one who is leaning that way).


Regarding DW7k; maybe its for the best that he gets a way to again.


That puts us at:

JANDAR
HONORED SOUL-GUIDES
Species Undead
Unique Squad
Class Psychopomps
Personality Stoic
SIZE HEIGHT Medium 5

LIFE 1 (2 figures)
MOVE 5 / BASIC 6
RANGE 1 / BASIC 1
ATTACK 2 / BASIC 3
DEFENSE 4 / BASIC 4

?? POINTS

LAST WILL
After an Honored Soul Guide is destroyed, you may place it on an Army Card of a previously destroyed Unique Hero. At the start of any round, before placing order markers, you may remove that Honored Soul Guide from that Army Card and remove enough wounds for the Hero to have 1 Life remaining. Then place that Hero adjacent to any figure you control.

STEALTH FLYING
When counting spaces for an Honored Soul-Guide's movement, ignore elevations. An Honored Soul-Guide may fly over water without stopping, pass over figures without becoming engaged, and fly over obstacles such as ruins. If an Honored Soul-Guide is engaged when it starts to fly, it will not take any leaving engagement attacks.

I'd think 50 will be a hair too low, so eyeballing it, I'm gonna say 60 points to start. They are still gonna be endgame things, and opponents are probably going to deliberately wait to kill these guys. That's gonna help keep their price down, especially because 2 attacks of 2 isn't going to be all that effective.

What does everyone think?
@NecroBlade
@Pumpkin_King
@Astroking112
@All Your Pie
@capsocrates

[caps]

I don't see why an opponent would want to attack an honored soul guide unless they hadn't destroyed any heroes yet. Are they now reserved for cleanup? Where they are a dicey proposition? This is everything you just said but is that the gameplay you want? I liked that before the player could choose when to trigger the power. Now their opponent chooses it

[Pumpkin_King]

Yeah, that’s also true caps. I’m liking this version of the power less now. Could we keep the “rezzed with one life” angle but the player chooses when to destroy a guide?