Public Design Workshop

[Viegon]

Originally Posted by bsbush7690

@Viegon You're right about the name, phone did an out correct somehow it is supposed to be Wesley Dobbs and I lIke the idea if it being before attacking with Gas Gun so how's this?

GAS GUN
After moving and before attacking, you may use Sandman's Gas Gun. choose a figure within 4 clear sight spaces and roll the 20-sided die. If you roll a 16 or higher remove one unrevealed Order Marker from that figure's card.

You don't need the part I struck-through, but otherwise it looks good.

[Soundwarp SG-1]

Maybe it's just me, but Side-kick seems like a weird class for Stargirl considering she had her own book for awhile and has a side-kick of her own.

[laughing matter]

Yeah, I would have gone with adventurer, and given her a team up ability( i.e. yukio) instead of a sidekick ability.

[Arkham]

I'm really hoping to see Justice League Batman get made sometime in the future, or at least see him go into more than just a concept.

Originally Posted by Yodaking

I looked up and reviewed that JL Batman design we discussed last Spring. Here is where I am at with it now.

NAME = BATMAN III
SECRET IDENTITY = Bruce Wayne
SPECIES = Human
UNIQUENESS = Unique Hero
CLASS = Strategist
PERSONALITY = Driven
SIZE/HEIGHT = Medium 6
LIFE = 5
MOVE = 5
RANGE = 1
ATTACK = 4
DEFENSE = 5
POINTS = 250?

WORLDS GREATEST DETECTIVE
Before taking a turn with Batman, if Batman is unengaged, you may choose an opponent's figure and look at all unrevealed Order Markers on its Army Card. Order Markers revealed in this manner will stay on the chosen figure's Army Card. In addition, you may then reveal the "X" Order Marker on this card and remove one Order Marker from the chosen figure's Army Card.

JUSTICE LEAGUE COMBATANT
After revealing an Order Marker on this card and taking a turn with Batman, if Batman is engaged you may reveal the X Order Marker on this card and take an immediate turn with any Champion, Fearless, or Valiant Hero you control.

MASTER MARTIAL ARTIST
When attacking an opponent's adjacent figure with a normal attack, add one automatic skull to whatever is rolled. When defending against a normal attack from an adjacent figure, add one automatic shield to whatever is rolled, and all excess shields count as unblockable hits on the attacking figure.

Bumped the life up to 5 and gave him the auto shield vs. adj. normal attacks to help him survive a bit longer. Dropped the attack down to 4 but gave him the auto skull so he still packs a punch. Tweaked the two X powers a bit. Now he is either unengaged and foiling the enemies plans, or engaged and calling in some JL back up.

Just for reference.
Champions
Valiant Personalities
Fearless Personalities

One thing I'd like to see changed/added, would be to see his Justice League synergy expanded to include at least the initial Justice League members. The easiest way, would be to include markers similar to Cap, so you are always guaranteed to be able to form your Justice League, and future proof it with other versions of the characters. However, if we're trying to stay away from markers, we could just throw in more classes/personalities to cover the rest. As we can already see, Valiant now no longer covers Aquaman II, so this is the sort of thing I hope is avoided. Although I prefer Aquaman I anyways, I feel the members should always be able to make it in to the synergy, the less limiting like that, the better, at least as it pertains to the original members. So perhaps something like:

JUSTICE LEAGUE COMBATANT
After revealing an Order Marker on this card and taking a turn with Batman, if Batman is engaged you may reveal the X Order Marker on this card and take an immediate turn with any Champion, Officer, Archer, Vigilante, Valiant, Scientist, Protector, Martian, or Warrior Hero you control.

This covers a great deal of the main ones:

Champion:
Superman I, Superman II, Wonder Woman, Flash (Wally), Booster Gold
Officer:
Green Lanterns Hal Jordan, Guy Gardner, John Stewart, Kyle Rayner
Archer:
Green Arrow
Vigilante:
Black Canary
Valiant:
Aquaman I, Steel
Scientist:
Atom, Flash (Barry), Flash (Fox)
Protector:
Red Tornado
Martian:
Martian Manhunter
Warrior:
Hawkman, Hawkgirl, Aquaman II

Now, the issue is, some may find that to be a bit much to list in one power, making it seem tedious. My biggest concern is, if you don't make the power have range, at the very least covering a decent amount of Justice League members over the years, you are really limiting the synergy this power offers. If you are going to purposely/knowingly paint yourself into a corner with it, it just seems like a waste. The JLA is in desperate need of some C3G representation, and currently all that is there is a movement ability by Martian Manhunter, which isn't even necessarily JLA tied, as it actually benefits his Telepath synergy more. This is a real shame, as obviously the JLA is DC's biggest group of their AAA heroes, and they should be on par with the Avengers in terms of representation and importance. We've got Cap, Ms. Marvel, and Wasp II offering a solid group dynamic, we need at least 1 solid offering for the JLA.

Now, with that in mind, if you don't want to put all the classes/personalities/species necessary to both cover a good amount of current JLA mainstays, as well as future proofing, then I strongly suggest a much simpler marker system that will always be future proof, and allow the variety and range necessary for the synergy to shine. You don't want to be limited to the same 10 choices each time you go to form your team when wanting to play a JLA army.

JUSTICE LEAGUE COMBATANT
At the start of the game, you may choose up to 6 other Unique Heroes you control and place a Justice League Marker on each of their cards. After revealing an Order Marker on this card and taking a turn with Batman, if Batman is engaged you may take an immediate turn with any figure with a Justice League Marker on its Army Card that you control within clear sight of Batman, and you may not take any additional turns with other figures you control.

[Smithy Winfred]

Originally Posted by Aggressive Sock

I'm really hoping to see Justice League Batman get made sometime in the future, or at least see him go into more than just a concept.

One thing I'd like to see changed/added, would be to see his Justice League synergy expanded to include at least the initial Justice League members. The easiest way, would be to include markers similar to Cap, so you are always guaranteed to be able to form your Justice League, and future proof it with other versions of the characters. However, if we're trying to stay away from markers, we could just throw in more classes/personalities to cover the rest. As we can already see, Valiant now no longer covers Aquaman II, so this is the sort of thing I hope is avoided. Although I prefer Aquaman I anyways, I feel the members should always be able to make it in to the synergy, the less limiting like that, the better, at least as it pertains to the original members. So perhaps something like:

JUSTICE LEAGUE COMBATANT
After revealing an Order Marker on this card and taking a turn with Batman, if Batman is engaged you may reveal the X Order Marker on this card and take an immediate turn with any Champion, Officer, Archer, Vigilante, Valiant, Scientist, Protector, Martian, or Warrior Hero you control.

This covers a great deal of the main ones:

Champion:
Superman I, Superman II, Wonder Woman, Flash (Wally), Booster Gold
Officer:
Green Lanterns Hal Jordan, Guy Gardner, John Stewart, Kyle Rayner
Archer:
Green Arrow
Vigilante:
Black Canary
Valiant:
Aquaman I, Steel
Scientist:
Atom, Flash (Barry), Flash (Fox)
Protector:
Red Tornado
Martian:
Martian Manhunter
Warrior:
Hawkman, Hawkgirl, Aquaman II

Now, the issue is, some may find that to be a bit much to list in one power, making it seem tedious. My biggest concern is, if you don't make the power have range, at the very least covering a decent amount of Justice League members over the years, you are really limiting the synergy this power offers. If you are going to purposely/knowingly paint yourself into a corner with it, it just seems like a waste. The JLA is in desperate need of some C3G representation, and currently all that is there is a movement ability by Martian Manhunter, which isn't even necessarily JLA tied, as it actually benefits his Telepath synergy more. This is a real shame, as obviously the JLA is DC's biggest group of their AAA heroes, and they should be on par with the Avengers in terms of representation and importance. We've got Cap, Ms. Marvel, and Wasp II offering a solid group dynamic, we need at least 1 solid offering for the JLA.

Now, with that in mind, if you don't want to put all the classes/personalities/species necessary to both cover a good amount of current JLA mainstays, as well as future proofing, then I strongly suggest a much simpler marker system that will always be future proof, and allow the variety and range necessary for the synergy to shine. You don't want to be limited to the same 10 choices each time you go to form your team when wanting to play a JLA army.

JUSTICE LEAGUE COMBATANT
At the start of the game, you may choose up to 6 other Unique Heroes you control and place a Justice League Marker on each of their cards. After revealing an Order Marker on this card and taking a turn with Batman, if Batman is engaged you may take an immediate turn with any figure with a Justice League Marker on its Army Card that you control within clear sight of Batman, and you may not take any additional turns with other figures you control.

I kind of liked the Fearless, Champion, Valiant synergy, the list you have is way too long, and at least it covers the most important (WW, Supes, Green Lantern, Aquaman) it does miss some key members, most notably Martian Manhunter, but he really doesn't need synergy. I am also strongly against another marker figure to represent the Justice League. I feel the Avengers are cool, but copy-pasting the same idea onto the Justice League seems like a waste.

I also believe there was some talk of recycling that synergy list on a Martian Manhunter II card as well

[TrollBrute]

I still find Batman a weird choice for a JLA leader. I haven't read much JL stuff, but in most stories, Batman is the loner, the guy who doesn't work well with a team. In Grant Morrison's JLA run, he even has files on how best to take out his teammates if they go evil. I just don't see a Batman (III) as a JL synergizer.

If anything, I'd try to find a way to fit the Watchtower in and have that give some synergy to a Justice League team. Maybe on a Martian Manhunter card, or even as a glyph?

[Tornado]

MMII with a Watchtower power sounds pretty awesome.

[bsbush7690]

With Mera coming out soon I wanted to take a shot at a design for some Atlantean Soldiers.

ATLANTEAN SOLDIERS

SPECIES - ATLANTEAN
UNIQUENESS - COMMON SQUAD (2)
CLASS - PROTECTORS
PERSONALITY - PROUD

SIZE/HEIGHT - MEDIUM 5

LIFE - 1

MOVE - 5
RANGE - 1
ATTACK - 4
DEFENSE - 4

WATER STRENGTH 1
Atlantean Soldiers do not stop their movement when entering a water space. Add 1 die to each Atlantean Soldier's attack and defense while they are on a water space.

WATER CANNON SPECIAL ATTACK
Range 4. Attack 3 + Special
When an Atlantean Soldier uses their Water Cannon Special Attack to attack a figure while on a water space, roll 2 additional attack dice.

BATTLE MANEUVER
After taking a turn with the Atlantean Soldiers, you may move any Atlantean Hero you control up to 4 spaces. Atlantean Heroes moved by Battle Maneuver will not take any leaving engagement attacks.

Or

ATLANTEAN BONDING
After revealing an Order Marker on this card and before taking a turn with Atlantean Soldiers, you may first take a turn with any Atlantean Hero you control.

SUPER STRENGTH

[Smithy Winfred]

Originally Posted by bsbush7690

With Mera coming out soon I wanted to take a shot at a design for some Atlantean Soldiers.

ATLANTEAN SOLDIERS

SPECIES - ATLANTEAN
UNIQUENESS - COMMON SQUAD (2)
CLASS - PROTECTORS
PERSONALITY - PROUD

SIZE/HEIGHT - MEDIUM 5

LIFE - 1

MOVE - 5
RANGE - 1
ATTACK - 4
DEFENSE - 4

WATER STRENGTH 1
Atlantean Soldiers do not stop their movement when entering a water space. Add 1 die to each Atlantean Soldier's attack and defense while they are on a water space.

WATER CANNON SPECIAL ATTACK
Range 4. Attack 3 + Special
When an Atlantean Soldier uses their Water Cannon Special Attack to attack a figure while on a water space, roll 2. additional attack dice.

BATTLE MANEUVER
After taking a turn with the Atlantean Soldiers, you may move any Atlantean Hero you control up to 4 spaces. Atlantean Heroes moved by Battle Maneuver will not take any leaving engagement attacks.

Or

ATLANTEAN BONDING
After revealing an Order Marker on this card and before taking a turn with Atlantean Soldiers, you may first take a turn with any Atlantean Hero you control.

SUPER STRENGTH

I'd go with a 3 man squad and use battle maneuver

[bsbush7690]

[MENTION=35907]Smithy Winfred[/MENTION] Yeah I was debating about doing a 2 like the Hawkmen of Thanagar but I can see the benefits of having 3 and I think battle maneuver is overall the better choice for movement of the heroes into position.

[Yodaking]

I was trying to tie the Justice League together into team without using markers and I'd still like to see something like that get done. A Martian Manhunter II card might be the best option for a true Justice League leader. I was just also trying to make a Batman card that would be a good Justice League choice.

If a MM2.0 card had a way to bring either one of the current Batman cards into a Justice League build, I'd still leave him out of it. The two cards we have are just better geared to dealing with street level criminals than the heavy hitters Justice League deals with. The lone exception being a Kryptonian threat since he has those gear for that.

So I wanted to make a Batman 3.0 to better represent his time with the Justice League, while also doing something with his detective and master strategist skills. He is not really a leader of the team in my version, he just helps tie the team together with some synergy. He isn't really giving out orders to the team, he inspires others into action once he engages because everyone else on the team knows he is just a normal human without super-powers while they are super-powered so they get into the fight quicker in response to guilt/shame/honor/empathy/etc. When not in the fight, he is using his mind to help the team by foiling/disrupting the opponents plans. This makes him a key addition to the team without making him their leader.

I would actually like to see my Bruce Wayne card get made as well as a MM2.0 that had some different JL synergy (maybe using those other classes/personalities mentioned), then when fielding both Batman 3.0 & MM 2.0 along other members of the JL, you have a good 2000+ point team to rival the Avengers without repeating the Marker system.

That being said, I could see expanding the synergy list on my Batman design to include a 4th one but more than 4 seems like too much. I'd consider either adding Scientist (Flash-Barry) or Warrior (Hawkgirl). Both seem like good choices for different reasons.

[dok]

My issue with that Batman is that using the X to kill your opponent's OMs is about as useful, and more versatile, than using it to take a turn with someone else. There's not a ton of strategic tension there - kill opposing OMs with the X until you get engaged, then use it to bond. You really only need one 300+ point bruiser, as Batman will probably die first anyway.