[Pod 0] Velnesh Alphas (Leyline Phantoms) - AotV Testing

[Knox]

If we ended up with a compromise the 80-85 range is underutilized points-wise across all of scape. But I'm more in favor of 75

[caps]

I think a decent comparison is the Horned Skull Brutes. However, they are a common squad. A unique squad should be cheaper

[Astroking112]

The Horned Skull Brutes can't jump on top of a castle.

Another example would be the Shaolin Monks. They lose out on Whirlwind Assault and monk synergies in exchange for +1A and +1D, a defensive power, and being able to use their movement power after moving normally.

[Knox]

Originally Posted by Astroking112

The Horned Skull Brutes can't jump on top of a castle.

Another example would be the Shaolin Monks. They lose out on Whirlwind Assault and monk synergies in exchange for +1A and +1D, a defensive power, and being able to use their movement power after moving normally.

Again, Shaolins are common (a buff compared to Velnesh) and overpriced at 80. Delta has corrected them to 65. Every example that's given is more evidence for a slight decrease to Velnesh points

[NecroBlade]

I very much don't want to price the NotNW further out of existence. I do not mind them at 90 as I've seen them do great things and even when they're not "earning points" through kills, their rapid and constant movement gives them a lot of utility in tying things up. 80 feels like an absolute floor for me, tests permitting if we want to push for that.

[caps]

I'd encourage y'all to reread all the playtest results. On the whole they have been underwhelming at 90 and 100.

[Knox]

Originally Posted by caps

I'd encourage y'all to reread all the playtest results. On the whole they have been underwhelming at 90 and 100.

Yeah I read through all of their playtest results too and was surprised at how many times I read that they didn't have much of an impact but were still fine at 90. But I think 80 would be a good compromise if we playtested it

[caps]

I'm also wondering if they don't have a clear enough role and that's why people have struggled to use them. Are they sharks? Menacers? Defenders? They aren't bread and butter or cheerleaders. I've been wondering if 3/5 would give them a more well defined role as glyph grabbers, screeners, and/or cleanup. Right now it seems like people tend to roll them out early but then one or two of them die and they don't her used after that. This isn't a strongly held opinion as much as a line of inquiry.

What do y'all think?

[NecroBlade]

I don't hate it, but I do like that with 4 Attack they can use their bonus moves to set up powerful attacking positions. We also have the Honored Soul Guides and possibly Alabaster Sentinels that will be able to fill passive/glyph grabbing roles, so I like the slightly more offensive take on these.

[Astroking112]

My thoughts align with NecroBlade's. I have a slight preference for the offensive angle, but I'd agree that the 3/5 stats are more in line with their powers and best use. I'd be fine with experimenting with it at the very least.

[caps]

So it sounds like we're left with disagreeing about points. Does anyone have anything further to suggest on that topic? Maybe each of us could post one number in a spoiler that we think is the appropriate point value? Once we've all posted we can look at all the spoilers and resume the conversation from there? I'll start...

Spoiler Alert!

70 points

[Captain Stupendous]

I'd rather stick with the 4/4 stats as I think they've been found to play well at that statline as long as the points are dialed in.

Spoiler Alert!

I find @caps comparison to Horned Skull Brutes to be compelling. I say we start at 75.