The Book of Human Torch (Jim Hammond)

[IAmBatman]

Playtest done through squad tests. Army tests to come ... tomorrow.

[Lord Pyre]

Without an attack that affects multiple figures (can't burn damage an adjacent figure after destroying a figure because it's no longer adjacent to anything)

Really? I read that as he could, and I thought he'd be decent at melee squads. I guess it makes sense with the wording, but I never would have thought of it that way.

[Margloth]

Yeah, I overlooked that too. My gut reaction is to try and change the wording so he's a bit more effective against squads, but I'll wait til the initial is done. It might be too much theoryscaping paranoia at this point.

[IAmBatman]

Basically you just need to burn up a hero if you want to hit someone adjacent. I'm OK with that. He doesn't need to be a squad killer. He smells like 150 to me right now, though. We'll see once I get to the last two army tests.

[Margloth]

Well, thematically speaking, Torch was something of a two-bit criminal hunter in his day, so I'd like him to not get completely owned by Street Thugs, but since he should generally have height, he should be okay.

Also, I like that he's a pretty good anti-heavy hitter for cheap. I think that's a pretty good fit for a guy who was always wrestling with Namor. Ranged, 5 attack with flying is a pretty good hit, even before his SA.

[johnny139]

150 seems so PUNY for a guy that goes toe-to-toe with Namor, don't you think?

[Margloth]

Torch is a character who's hard to place.

In his initial appearances, he was pretty powerful... largely because he was kind of unlike anything seen before. He was more in the 'monster' catagory than 'hero'.

Later, as the 'superhero' comic concept began to develop, he seemed a bit more mundane. I mean, he shoots fire... and that's about it. Remember at the time, Namor's diminishing strength out of water (and when exposed to flame) was much more emphasized.

Nowadays, he seems to have been retconned into one of the more powerful characters in the Marvel Universe.

So it's kind of hard to say what points he should be.

[IAmBatman]

OK - all wrapped up. I like him at 150.

Edit: And from what I know of the character, I'm happy with him at 150. I always like the idea of newer characters being evolved a bit from earlier ones. So Golden Age superheroes shouldn't be as powerful as their more iconic predecessors. (Just a rule of thumb, not a hard rule, mind you). But I like him at 75 under Johnny Storm. Feels "right" to me.

[Margloth]

From what I see, he looks useful and pretty draftable. He's not exactly ever gonna be at the core of your army, but he's a nice draft if you've got a few points left and need a ranged flier or a special.

As for upping his survivability / attack potential, I believe a possible future Toro Sidekick could do this.

[tcglkn]

Definitely looks good at 150 to me and I don't see any reason to try and "power up" the design. Premptive yea to playtesting.

[IAmBatman]

Originally Posted by tcglkn

Definitely looks good at 150 to me and I don't see any reason to try and "power up" the design. Premptive yea to playtesting.

and, yeah, Toro would be a nice addition. Honestly, though, he has plenty of offensive punch - he just doesn't last long under heavy fire. Preemptive yea to playtesting (at 150).

[Griffin]

Preemptive yea at 150.