The Book of Super Soldier

[fret_gurglo]

I think Soldier makes sense here and would like to add that I don't see it causing any potential Joe issues. Joes will be humans and should not add much more than what Bucky would already add to a Soldier build. Just tossing in my two cents.

[MrNobody]

I’m not in love with Metamutate, mainly because it feels like a step too far. Extrapolating a bit seems fair for a C3G design, but creating an entirely new species never mentioned in the text? It feels a bit off.

For Joes, I think the main concern is not that Joes will disrupt Super Soldier builds, but the other way around. I agree that if this dude that was in ~2 comics in the 90s is a must-have in any Soldier build, that’s a bad thing. But I’m also not too worried about that happening. LO raises a valid point with Magneto, Silver Surfer, etc not really destroying their respective synergies.

Commando feels very off to me.

[Dr. Jekyll]

Sorry for the wait. I'm not entirely sold on the Metamutate race. I understand that he is not fully human because of the experiment/procedure. I was hoping for Human but, I could go for Mutate if that is the overall gravitation. Here is what I came up with, an overall drop in stats first off. Then I changed up the 2nd and 3rd power using the suggestions from Lazy, Nobody, LP. Thanks guys!!

NAME = SUPER SOLDIER
SECRET IDENTITY = CLARK KENT

SPECIES = HUMAN?
UNIQUENESS = UNIQUE HERO
CLASS = SOLDIER
PERSONALITY = PATRIOTIC

SIZE/HEIGHT = MEDIUM 5

LIFE = 6

MOVE = 7
RANGE = 1
ATTACK = 6
DEFENSE = 5

POINTS = 450?

HEAT VISION SPECIAL ATTACK
Range 4. Attack 2 + Special.
Choose a figure to attack and roll 2 attack dice, or 3 attack dice if the chosen figure is an Android or Destructible Object. For each skull rolled, roll one additional attack die. Continue rolling an additional attack die for each additional skull rolled until no skulls are rolled. The defending figure rolls defense normally.

MAN OF WAR
If there is a revealed Order Marker on this card:

• When Super Soldier attacks, all blanks rolled count as extra skulls;
• If a Soldier within 6 clear sight spaces of Super Soldier attacks, you may count one blank rolled as an extra skull.

SAVIOR'S SHIELD
When defending against a normal or special attack, Super Soldier always adds one automatic shield to whatever is rolled. When a friendly figure within 6 clear sight spaces of Super Soldier it targeted for an opponent's normal attack and at least 1 skull is rolled, you may remove any unrevealed Order Marker on any other Army Card you control and move Super Soldier 6 spaces. If Super Soldier ends his movement adjacent to the targeted figure, then switch Super Soldier and the targeted figures, if possible. After the figures are switched, the attacking figure must target and attack Super Soldier, if possible.

FLYING
SUPER STRENGTH

[Tornado]

The Mutant and Adventurer factions were already solid from the start.
Soldier faction is just starting to come together and seems to be on the brink of a large expansion.
Who all is actually planning on running Soldier designs in the future?

[IAmBatman]

There’s Yodaking, fret, and you at least.

[tcglkn]

I’m sure I’ll do a soldier design at some point.

[Lazy Orang]

Originally Posted by MrNobody

I’m not in love with Metamutate, mainly because it feels like a step too far. Extrapolating a bit seems fair for a C3G design, but creating an entirely new species never mentioned in the text? It feels a bit off.

I absolutely get what you're saying, and I agree to a degree, but allow me to counterpoint.
Firstly, this wouldn't be the first time we've done this - we effectively did it with 2000AD, because, while they had an established species for the characters in question, we didn't want to make them Mutants for game purposes. So, we stretched a point, gave them the prefix 'Rad' as a reference to their origin and made them Rad-Mutants. That was an extrapolation, creating an entirely new species so they fit in the game.
Here, I am aware that creating an all new species for this guy is extrapolating, but isn't making him something like a Mutate extrapolating as well? As far as I can tell from this conversation, Mutate has no textual basis in the universe he's in either, and, honestly, feels a little out of touch with the basic concept of the setting, that being a fusion of DC and Marvel - Mutate is all Marvel with no DC. Metamutate, for all its lack of textual evidence, is at least a portmanteau name in the spirit of the setting, and feels like a logical extrapolation from the existance of Metamutants - if Amalgam had lasted long enough for such characters to require a designation, then this is the designation that feels, to me, most likely.

Whatever we do (unless it's Human, which feels increasingly unfitting) it will lack textual evidence within Amalgam. Is Metamutate perfect? Obviously not, because of that, but at least it feels in a similar spirit with some context to base it on, and I don't think you're going to get perfect.

[IAmBatman]

Cap's a Human. I think this guy makes sense as a Human.

[tcglkn]

At least as a Human he’s harder to fit into Star-Lord builds and Cap/Star-Lord builds won’t work. Making a new species is gonna make him easier to fit into those armies.

[Yodaking]

If we had a dozen Joes already released and priced featuring Solider synergy, then he would be taking on the cost of adding a 400+ point unit to an established ~200 point synergy web to his own point total. But since we don't, once a 400+ point Solider is released every future Joe with Solider Synergy is going to pay a point cost for having synergy with a 400+ point unit, when the goal will be for them to play well with mostly 100-200 point allies. Thus they will end up overpriced anytime they are not playing with that 400+ point soldier. If this guy was 250 points or something, it wouldn't be a big deal as we already have Cap at 240, Bloodshot at 260, War Machine at 270, and Snake Eyes could end up over 200 himself. I'm still seeing an estimated (target) of 450 points here, that's significantly stronger than any other Soldiers we have.

If this guy lead others into battle, then make him a leader. It would be good for future Solider synergy not to have a 400+ point unit in the mix, it would prevent stacking with Star-Lord since he's also a leader, and it would be a good reflection of this card since he's now handing out a boost to others. You can still have him boost Soldiers, just not be a solider himself so other Soldiers won't be bonding with him. If you leave him as a Solider, then after all testing is done, add 30 points to his cost and wait a few years for the soldier synergy web to catch up to him and make him playable at that cost.

And yes, I know we have Bucky Soldier Bonding available for testing but that won't be a good reflection of future bonding synergy at all. He's a 60 point unit, where as most future Joes will be at least twice as good at 120 and potentially up to three times as good at 180 points. Bucky uses a SA more often then not and SA won't be getting a boost from this guy. I don't ever include him in my CA builds as it is for the same reason. You are better off using those 60 points on someone who can do more with Cap's normal attack boost and/or defense boost. A Ranged Double Normal Attack unit, a Counter Strike unit, etc.

[Ronin]

Originally Posted by Dr. Jekyll

Savior's Shield feels a little overcomplicated to me. I'd probably try to streamline. I like the Cap + Superman element, but I might just let him use it freely to switch with adjacent figures or something:

SAVIOR'S SHIELD
When defending against an attack, Super Soldier adds one automatic shield to whatever is rolled. When a friendly figure adjacent to Super Soldier is attacked, you may switch Super Soldier and the targeted figure. After the figures are switched, the attacking figure must target and attack Super Soldier, if possible. Super Soldier takes leaving engagement attacks when moved with this special power, but the initially targeted figures does not.

You could stick a "once per round" in there if it's too good. I think the move and the OM thing is a lot to parse in that version you've got.

[Yodaking]

Does he throw the shield around like CA does with his? Could have that as his ranged attack option and SA.