Aldin's Utterly Unofficial Design Tune Up Thread

[All Your Pie]

That would normally be true, but as I understand C3G's Destructable Object rules, DOs with a size designation may be targeted as figures of the same size. The Toxic Waste Barrel doesn't have one yet, but once I find an appropriate mini it will.

Thanks again!

[Aldin]

Originally Posted by GamerHusband

Psycho-Pirate

NAME = Psycho-Pirate

SECRET IDENTITY =Roger Hyden

SPECIES = Human
UNIQUENESS = Unique Hero
CLASS = Manipulator
PERSONALITY = Insane

SIZE/HEIGHT = Medium 5

LIFE = 4

MOVE = 5
RANGE = 1
ATTACK = 4
DEFENSE = 3

POINTS = 165

Emotional Vampirism
Start the game with 6 Medusa Mask markers. After moving and before attacking, Psycho-Pirate may choose one Unique Hero that he is engaged to and roll the twenty-sided die. If you roll a 12 or higher you may place a Medusa Mask marker on the defending figures army card. The chosen figure now has a Psychopath class. After Psycho-Pirate places a Medusa Mask, he may remove a wound.

Emotion Control
After taking a turn with Psycho-Pirate, you may take a turn with one Unique Hero that has a Psychopath class.

Quick editorial thing first - the name should be Hayden, not Hyden. Also, I'm not sure I understand why he's Insane.

As written, Psycho-Pirate is very similar to the Werewolf Lord and the comparison is worth making because right now, the design is pretty unbalanced.

The Werewolf Lord has better stats and a lower price. In particular, the Werewolf Lord is much harder to kill with a Defense of 4 and a Life of 6. For 25 points more, Psycho-Pirate is shockingly easy to kill with a mere 3 Defense and 4 Life. Existing C3G cards at that defensive stat level all either have some other defensive power (Harley Quinn's Acrobatic Maneuver, Professor X's Psychic Defense X, etc) or a ranged attack (Green Arrow, Ventriloquist, etc). For a figure that was really cheap with a unique but non-OM intensive ability that might work. However...

Psycho-Pirate has a much better version of the special ability. With twice as many markers, a D20 roll instead of needing to succeed with an attack and automatic control rather than 50/50, Emotional Vampirism and Control are more effective and more efficient than Lycanthropy and Moon Frenzy. That doesn't even take into consideration the immediate usefulness of doubling his turns with Green Goblin's excellent attacks or the ugly effectiveness of combining his abilities with Joker's potential OM switching. In short, his special abilities are in a much heavier weight class than his stats.

I was trying to figure out who your vision of Psycho Pirate is because he either needs a stat and point boost or an ability reduction to be a balanced figure. If you want to target him at a Poison Ivy level, you're probably looking at making him a lot more like the Werewolf Lord with slightly stronger stats (5 Life, 4 Defense?) and a significantly weaker set of abilities (marker placed on 16+? Control only on an 11+?). If instead, you want that set of abilities, you're probably shooting for significantly better stats (6 Move, 6 Life, 5 Defense?) and a substantially higher point total.

Does balancing down to a lower point total or up to his abilities' power level sound more appealing?

~Aldin, piratically

[Lord Pyre]

Awesome idea Aldin!

Spoiler

NAME = Spoiler
SECRET IDENTITY = Stephanie Brown

SPECIES = Human
UNIQUENESS = Unique Hero
CLASS = Crime Fighter
PERSONALITY = Reckless
SIZE/HEIGHT = Medium 4

LIFE = 4
MOVE = 6
RANGE = 1
ATTACK = 3
DEFENSE = 4
POINTS = 70


RECKLESS ASSISTANCE 12
After revealing an Order Marker on a Vigilante or Sidekick card you control and taking a turn with that Vigilante or Sidekick, if Spoiler is within 6 clear sight spaces of that Vigilante or Sidekick, you must roll the 20-sided die. If you roll a 12 or higher, you must take an immediate turn with Spoiler. You may not take any additional turns with other Vigilantes or Sidekicks you control.

CRIME SPOILER
When attacking a criminal figure, Spoiler rolls one additional attack die. When defending against a Crime Lord figure, Spoiler rolls one less defense die.

BAT-GRAPPLE 3



The idea is a cheaper, unreliable Robin, basically, which is what she is. I'd preferably like her to be a Sidekick, but Griffin said that's a theme fail for him and he wouldn't pass it. I don't know, she doesn't seem to be a Crime Fighter like Spiderman, and I'd love for there to be more Sidekicks to throw some cool synergy around, but I can deal with the Crime Fighter class.

Crime Spoiler is purely for theme, as she wants revenge on criminals, but when faced with smarter opponents (Black Mask), she just gets too reckless and doesn't listen to Bats (And gets shot by Black Mask).

[Scapemage]

Originally Posted by Aldin

Also, I'm not sure I understand why he's Insane.

Have you read Crisis on Infinite Earths? He's pretty dang insane in that event. I think insane works fine.

This is a great idea by the way! Myself and Marlgolth (sp?) have been working on a design together, do you mind if we PM it to you (the plan is to draw interest as soon as it hits the Public Design Post)?

EDIT: LP, Crime Fighter isn't a bad class to have.

[Aldin]

Scapemage, a PM would be fine.

LEIV, thanks for your patience - I have been considering Onslaught and should have something up in a few hours.

~Aldin, updatingly

[Aldin]

Originally Posted by LordEsenwienIV

Onslaught

Entity
Event Hero
Destroyer
Destructive
Large 8

Life 30
Move 5
Range 1
Attack 7
Defense 7
Points 2400

INDUCED ILLUSION
Once per round, after revealing an Order Marker on this card and instead of attacking with Onslaught, you may choose one enemy figure in clear sight of Onslaught that is adjacent to one or more enemy figures. Take temporary control of that figure and immediately take a turn with the chosen figure. During this turn, the chosen figure may not move and must attack one adjacent enemy figure with a normal attack. At the end of that turn, control of the chosen figure returns to the player who controlled the figure before the Induced Illusion. All Order Markers that were on the chosen figure's card will stay on the card.

Magnetic Smash
After moving and instead of attacking, you may choose one figure within 6 clear sight spaces of Onslaught. Place the chosen figure up to 6 spaces away from its original placement. After placing the chosen figure, roll the 20 sided die. If you roll a 1-8 nothing happens and your turn immediately ends. If you roll a 9-18 give the chosen figure 2 wounds. If you roll a 19 or higher, give the chosen figure 4 wounds. After you inflict at least 1 wound while using Magnetic Smash, roll the 20 sided die. If you roll a 16 or higher, you may use Magnetic Smash again. Onslaught may only use Magnetic Smash twice a turn.

Mind Melt Special Attack
Range 5. Attack 4.
Onslaught does not need a clear line of sight when using Telepathic Blast Special Attack. Figures may not roll defense dice against Telepathic Blast Special Attack.

Event Heroes have a unique set of considerations. Foremost among them is that an Event Hero needs lots and lots of playtesting to ascertain the correct cost. So I'll give you my gut impression that 2,400 is probably significantly higher than playtesting would reveal, but I'm not going to dwell on cost at all because he's an Event Hero and that tells us the rough power level we want to see irrespective of cost.

The next consideration is probably the most difficult to ruminate over considering what we're trying to do here. I doubt the C3G Heroes are going to be selecting Event Heroes for the Public Design Process any time soon. I could be completely wrong, but the Public Design Process seems poorly suited to creating Event Heroes and since there's only one so far, I suspect they will want to make the next several Event Heroes behind closed doors.

Now on to the fun part - let's break Onslaught!

The first thing I notice is that Onslaught has no answer to squads. Yes he can probably kill one squaddie per turn, but an equal point value of SHIELD Agents would have an excellent chance of knocking him off since they outrange him, are much cheaper on a cost per life point basis, and can do multiple points of damage to him per turn whereas he can only do 1 point of damage to them.

Actually, his lack of range and low damage output is surprising overall. Turns where he does more than three life points of damage will be rare and 1-2 will be more common. If Heroes decide not to be adjacent, Onslaught has a hard time projecting power more than five walking movement points away.

Some possibilities include:

-Making Induced Illusion more effective by having it affect more units, possibly with a D20 roll and probably better against squads. Removing the adjacency requirement and allowing any normal attack would boost it as well. Some sample language might be "Once per round, after revealing an Order Marker on this card and instead of attacking with Onslaught, you may choose up to two enemy hero figures or six enemy squad figures in clear sight of Onslaught. Take temporary control of those figures and immediately take turns with them in any order. During this turn, the chosen figure may not move and must attack with a normal attack. At the end of that turn, control of the chosen figure returns to the player who controlled the figure before the Induced Illusion. All Order Markers that were on the chosen figure's card will stay on the card." I suspect that can be further edited, but that would assist against squads and against "keep away" style heroes.

-Remove or reduce the restrictions on Magnetic Smash so that he can keep smashing more squaddies and heroes as long as he can keep rolling high enough. On a side note, as written he can smash the same figure multiple times. It could probably use language stating that a figure can only be subject to Magnetic Smash once per turn.

-Bump the range of Mind Melt. I don't like this one much because it always feels a bit unfair to be subject to attacks that bypass all your defenses. Also, it doesn't do anything to solve the squad problem. On a final note you'll want to change the text's "telepathic blasts" to "mind melts".

~Aldin, damage dealingly

[GamerHusband]

Thank you for the review Aldin. I'm having friends over tonight and we are going to play a few small games with this guy. I will take what I have learned here and continue to develop the character.

[Aldin]

Good deal, Gamer Husband.

~Aldin, happy to look him over again as a resubmission later if you're interested

[Aldin]

Originally Posted by Lord Pyre

NAME = Spoiler
SECRET IDENTITY = Stephanie Brown

SPECIES = Human
UNIQUENESS = Unique Hero
CLASS = Crime Fighter
PERSONALITY = Reckless
SIZE/HEIGHT = Medium 4

LIFE = 4
MOVE = 6
RANGE = 1
ATTACK = 3
DEFENSE = 4
POINTS = 70


RECKLESS ASSISTANCE 12
After revealing an Order Marker on a Vigilante or Sidekick card you control and taking a turn with that Vigilante or Sidekick, if Spoiler is within 6 clear sight spaces of that Vigilante or Sidekick, you must roll the 20-sided die. If you roll a 12 or higher, you must take an immediate turn with Spoiler. You may not take any additional turns with other Vigilantes or Sidekicks you control.

CRIME SPOILER
When attacking a criminal figure, Spoiler rolls one additional attack die. When defending against a Crime Lord figure, Spoiler rolls one less defense die.

BAT-GRAPPLE 3

So I think you've succeeded here, Lord Pyre, in creating a weaker version of Robin(Tim Drake). I mostly have two things you might want to think about. The first is purely aesthetic. Should she have Bat Grapple in her pre-Robin/Batgirl persona? Something similar, certainly, but Bat Grapple?

Also, it would be tempting to do something with Crime Spoiler that makes her more unique. Perhaps a + to the initiative roll based on driven figures, vigilantes, opponent's criminals or somesuch? Right now, it'd be awfully hard to draft her over Robin for any reason other than the pure desire to play her.

~Aldin, who likes working with figures at this power level and trying to make them individually worthwhile

[Lord Pyre]

Originally Posted by Aldin

Also, it would be tempting to do something with Crime Spoiler that makes her more unique. Perhaps a + to the initiative roll based on driven figures, vigilantes, opponent's criminals or somesuch? Right now, it'd be awfully hard to draft her over Robin for any reason other than the pure desire to play her.

I see the point with Bat Grapple. That can be renamed, easily!

But for your second point, she's not supposed to be drafted instead of Robin, but rather with him. Batman and Robin are doing their work, then she tags along, occasionally getting in the way, but also teaming up with Robin if need be!
I think it'd be hard to thematically justify an initiative bonus for her. I don't know, I'd have to see some ideas, I can't think of a way right now.

[Aldin]

One additional note. I am happy to consider designs via PM if you feel a need to keep it secret for some reason. My preference however, is to have the designs posted here so that everyone can see the process for as many submissions as possible.

~Aldin, open and aboveboardly

[Aldin]

Originally Posted by Lord Pyre

But for your second point, she's not supposed to be drafted instead of Robin, but rather with him. Batman and Robin are doing their work, then she tags along, occasionally getting in the way, but also teaming up with Robin if need be!
I think it'd be hard to thematically justify an initiative bonus for her. I don't know, I'd have to see some ideas, I can't think of a way right now.

Okay, I get that you don't want her drafted instead of Robin but with him, but right now, she is more of a hindrance than a help. None of her abilities make her activation a better thing than an activation of Robin. The initiative boost is simple to justify. She started out by leaving Batman and Robin clues about her dad's criminal activities. In her Spoiler persona, having the inside scoop on some criminal activities makes sense. You could even make the initiative boost dependent on her proximity to a vigilante, forcing the Reckless Assistance.

Make her something someone would want on the table mechanically as well as thematically and I think she's a much more appealing design choice.

~Aldin, leaving clues