The Book of Guile

[SirGalahad]

yea and yea

[johnny139]

Cool - this passes, so I'll put it On Hold for the moment and start up Chun-Li this evening. Thanks all.

[SirGalahad]

Who was the artist that we were trying to use for the comic art?

[johnny139]

Not one specific artist, but the "Power Foil" comic covers. If you do a Google search for the character + Power Foil it should show up.

[johnny139]

So, we got some mini pics from fret HERE. Workable, @japes ?

[japes]

Originally Posted by johnny139

So, we got some mini pics from fret HERE. Workable, @japes ?

I think I can make those work.

[Viegon]

C3G STANDARD PLAYTEST FEEDBACK FORM

NAME OF THE PLAYTEST UNIT: Guile (@130 points)

Army Test
Map: Conflict Chernobyl (no glyphs or special rules)
Units: Guile, Captain America (C3G), Bucky, Thaddeus Ross (590 points) VS Scandal Savage, Catman, King Shark (590 points)

Spoiler Alert!

UNIT SUM-UP
Damage:
Normal Attack: 2 wounds to Catman, 4 wounds to King Shark.
Special Attack: all 4 wounds to Scandal.
Power Usage/Effectiveness:
Military Loyalty: Boosted 2 attacks, boosted 1 defense roll.
Sonic Boom SA: Used after moving 1 time, used without moving 2 times.
Flash Kick: Never used instead of attacking. Rolled for instead of defending 1 time, 12+ rolled and OM removed.

GAME SUMMARY:
Ross targets King Shark and Catman chooses Cap as his prey.

Scandal moved up first for the Outlaws as Cap, Guile, and Bucky made their way forward. Scandal took down Bucky with a couple of attacks, but a couple really lucky rolls from Guile’s SA took down Scandal. Catman got in on Cap, but despite his double attacks was never able to score a wound before he went down late in the third round. King Shark was stranded back in his base and it took him most of a round to move up, while Cap and Guile positioned on the tail-end of the plane. King Shark’s first attack was blocked by a successful Lightning Kick, which also took his last OM of the round. Guile (super boosted by height, Cap, Ross, and Military Loyalty) hit King Shark for 4 wounds, and Cap finished him off the following round.

Round One: Army 2 wins Initiative.
ARMY 2: Scandal advances.
ARMY 1: Cap and Bucky advance (Catman stalks).
ARMY 2: Scandal moves up.
ARMY 1: Guile and Bucky fail.
ARMY 2: Scandal puts 3 wounds on Bucky.
ARMY 1: Guile and Bucky put 2 wounds on Scandal.

Round Two: Army 2 wins Initiative.
ARMY 2: Scandal kills Bucky and moves Catman.
ARMY 1: Cap fails (Catman stalks).
ARMY 2: Catman fails.
ARMY 1: Guile kills Scandal.
ARMY 2: Catman fails.
ARMY 1: Cap fails.

Round Three: Army 1 wins Initiative.
ARMY 1: Cap puts 3 wounds on Catman.
ARMY 2: Catman fails.
ARMY 1: Cap puts 4 wounds on Catman.
ARMY 2: Catman fails.
ARMY 1: Guile kills Catman.
ARMY 2: Turn lost on Catman.

Round Four: Army 1 wins Initiative.
ARMY 1: Cap positions.
ARMY 2: Shark advances.
ARMY 1: Guile fails.
ARMY 2: Shark loses an OM to Flash Kick.
ARMY 1: Guile puts 4 wounds on King Shark (Military Loyalty+Avengers Assemble+Priority Objective+height, total of 8 attack dice).
ARMY 2: Turn lost to Flash Kick.

Round Five: Army 2 wins Initiative.
ARMY 2: Shark puts 1 wound on Guile.
ARMY 1: Cap kills Shark.

Captain America unwounded, Thaddeus Ross unwounded, Guile with 1 wound.

___________________________________________________________

Army Test
Map: Conflict Chernobyl (no glyphs or special rules)
Units: Guile, Captain America (C3G), Bucky, Thaddeus Ross (590 points) VS Luke Cage, Iron Fist, Moon Knight (600 points)

Spoiler Alert!

UNIT SUM-UP
Damage:
Normal Attack: N/A
Special Attack: N/A
Power Usage/Effectiveness:
Military Loyalty: N/A
Sonic Boom SA: N/A
Flash Kick: Never used instead of attacking. Rolled for instead of defending 1 time, failed his roll (resulted in killing him).

GAME SUMMARY:
Ross targets Iron Fist. Moon Knight used the first turn to jump onto to his card, while Iron Fist and Luke Cage moved up and clashed with the Soldiers on the center of the plane. Moon Knight dropped in the start the second round but only managed a wound to Cap. Ross called for an Air Strike on Iron Fist and Luke Cage but only Fist took a single wound. Cage and Fist started rolling hot and took down Cap with an OM still on his card. Guile got in a single normal attack but rolled poorly, and he went down the following turn (failing an attempted Flash Kick). Bucky followed shortly after, and Ross only got in one attack before going down himself.

Round One: Army 1 wins Initiative.
ARMY 1: Cap and Bucky advance.
ARMY 2: Moon Knight jumps unto his card.
ARMY 1: Guile and Bucky move.
ARMY 2: Cage and Fist advance.
ARMY 1: Guile and Bucky put 1 wound on Cage.
ARMY 2: Cage and Fist advance (Fist heals Cage).

Round Two: Army 2 wins Initiative.
ARMY 2: Moon Knight drops and puts 1 wound on Cap.
ARMY 1: Cap and Bucky put 1 wound on Moon Knight and 2 wounds on Iron Fist.
ARMY 2: Cage and Fist put 3 wounds on Cap and 2 wounds on Bucky (Fist heals himself).
ARMY 1: Ross uses Air Strike but only does 1 wound to Fist.
ARMY 2: Cage and Fist kill Cap.
ARMY 1: Turn lost on Cap.

Round Three: Army 1 wins Initiative.
ARMY 1: Guile and Bucky fail (Guile takes a disengagement wound).
ARMY 2: Cage and Fist kill Guile (who failed Flash Kick) and put 1 wound on Bucky (Fist heals himself).
ARMY 1: Turn lost on Guile.
ARMY 2: Cage and Fist kill Bucky.
ARMY 1: Turn lost on Guile.
ARMY 2: Cage and Fist put 2 wounds on Ross.

Round Four: Army 1 wins Initiative.
ARMY 1: Ross fails.
ARMY 2: Cage and Fist kill Ross (Fist heals himself).

Luke Cage unwounded, Iron Fist unwounded, Moon Knight with 1 wound.

___________________________________________________________

Army Test
Map: Conflict Chernobyl (no glyphs or special rules)
Units: Guile, War Machine, Donald Ferguson, Iron Patriot (850 points) VS Wonder Woman, Wonder Girl, Amazon Warriors x4 (840 points)

Spoiler Alert!

UNIT SUM-UP
Damage:
Normal Attack: 3 wounds to Wonder Woman.
Special Attack: N/A
Power Usage/Effectiveness:
Military Loyalty: N/A
Sonic Boom SA: Used after moving 0 times, used without moving 2 times.
Flash Kick: Not used on attack or defense.

GAME SUMMARY:
Iron Patriot lost initiative for the first round, leaving them to struggle to get out of their base. Meanwhile Wonder Woman rushed in and pulled Patriot next to her, killing him in two attacks. Donald Ferguson attempted a rescue but only managed a wound before she took him down too. Guile got in a few attacks while the Amazons focused on War Machine, and his first attack did result in a lucky 3 wounds to Wonder Woman, but he didn’t last long once War Machine went down.

Round One: Army 2 wins Initiative (Army 1’s “X” and “3” get rearranged).
ARMY 2: 3 Amazon Warriors advance.
ARMY 1: Patriot advances.
ARMY 2: Wonder Woman advances.
ARMY 1: Patriot kills a Warrior and Donald moves up.
ARMY 2: Wonder Woman lassos Patriot and puts 4 wounds on him.
ARMY 1: War Machine kills a Warrior.

Round Two: Army 1 wins Initiative.
ARMY 1: Donald puts 1 wound on Wonder Woman and moves Guile.
ARMY 2: Wonder Woman kills Patriot.
ARMY 1: War Machine fails.
ARMY 2: Wonder Woman kills Donald.
ARMY 1: Guile moves.
ARMY 2: Wonder Woman puts 2 wounds on War Machine.

Round Three: Army 1 wins Initiative.
ARMY 1: Guile puts 3 wounds on Wonder Woman.
ARMY 2: Wonder Woman kills War Machine.
ARMY 1: Guile fails.
ARMY 2: Wonder Woman puts 2 wounds on Guile.
ARMY 1: Guile fails.
ARMY 2: Warriors kill Guile.

Wonder Woman with 3 wounds, Wonder Girl unwounded, 10 Amazon Warriors.

___________________________________________________________

THOUGHTS ON THE TESTED UNIT'S COST, BALANCE, & DRAFTABILITY: 130 seems pretty accurate here. As the first game shows, Guile is very boostable and when things go his way he can do some damage; but as shown in the other two, he will generally go down fast without doing much. Currently he’s stuck in a bit of an odd spot as the faction he’s connected to (the soldiers) aren’t much of a faction. Hopefully we get more soldiers at some point, which will definitely boost his draftability.

GENERAL THOUGHTS ON THE TESTED UNIT: Guile is a fun design. I can’t speak to the theme at all, but Sonic Boom SA is pretty handy and Military Loyalty plus his synergies makes him very boostable, which is fun. I really like the option of using Flash Kick instead of defending, but I never used it on offense and can’t imagine I ever would (giving up your turn to potentially remove a single OM is useless except for in very rare cases). Personally, I’d like to see Flash Kick simplified to only being a defensive power (as-is it’s hard to read too), but otherwise I like the design as-is.

[johnny139]

Awesome. I also hope we get some growth in the Soldier faction in the future. If we ever get Charlie Nash (Guile's partner!) he'll certainly fit in.

I've argued that, even if Flash Kick is not going to be used in offense 99% of the time, it's a cool enough option (and the card is simple enough in general) that I'd like to keep it. But I'm not married to it, and I'm willing to relent to the majority there - I know Bats was in favor of limiting it to defense as well.

[Tornado]

I have two Soldiers, I would like to LD. Sgt. Rock(would be my first DC) and Rogue Trooper(needs a mini).
Also there is another 2000AD comic based on Soldiers I want to get to someday, Bad Company.
Looking good here. I could see a tweak to Flash Kick, nice tests V.

[Viegon]

Originally Posted by johnny139

I've argued that, even if Flash Kick is not going to be used in offense 99% of the time, it's a cool enough option (and the card is simple enough in general) that I'd like to keep it. But I'm not married to it, and I'm willing to relent to the majority there - I know Bats was in favor of limiting it to defense as well.

My issue with it is that, even setting aside it only seeing use in 1% of games or what have you, that it also causes Flash Kick to be a very wordy, very inelegant power that you honestly need to read multiple times to understand. Unless it's absolutely necessary for the theme of the character, it's not worth keeping and bogging down the power. My .

For reference, we could take the power from this:

FLASH KICK
Instead of rolling attack or defense dice for or against a normal attack with Guile, if the attacking and defending figures are adjacent, you may roll the 20-sided die. If you roll 1-11, nothing happens, and the turn continues as normal. If you roll 12 or higher, remove 1 unrevealed Order Marker from that opponent's figure, if possible, and, if the opponent's figure was attacking, that figure's turn immediately ends and Guile receives no wounds.

And simplify it to this:

FLASH KICK
Instead of rolling defense dice against a normal attack from an adjacent attacking figure, you may roll the 20-sided die. If you roll 12 or higher, Guile receives no wounds, remove 1 unrevealed Order Marker at random from the attacking figure's Army Card, and the attacking figure's turn immediately ends.

Or even if we want to be extra clear about the "instead of defending" bit:

FLASH KICK
If Guile is attacked by an adjacent figure with a normal attack, you may roll the 20-sided die. If you roll 1-11, Guile cannot roll any defense dice against that attack. If you roll 12 or higher, Guile receives no wounds, remove 1 unrevealed Order Marker at random from the attacking figure's Army Card, and the attacking figure's turn immediately ends.

[IAmBatman]

Agreed on all Viegon's points. Also, a single trigger makes it feel more like a video game "move" to me, in that it requires a certain combo to pull off type of deal.

[Yodaking]

Giving up all defense dice makes the Flash Kick risk hard to take, especially if the figure attacking you has no OMs on their card. Maybe instead just roll 2 fewer defense dice, then it become a better gamble.