HoME General Discussion Thread

[White Knight]

After the War of Wrath, Morgoth was cast through the Door of Night into the void, ending Morgoth's terror in Arda until the prophesied final battle of Dagor Dagorath where he would meet his Final Doom.

Morgoth was forever banished from Arda--the way back was locked. And so he sat, alone, in the blackness of the void, for long eons.

But the Valar underestimated Morgoth's power and evil. Somehow, he was able to create a rip in the void, or an opening, or a portal. He arrived in a new realm--the realm of Valhalla.

Morgoth soon realized the power of the wellsprings in Valhalla--and realized that with the power of the wellspring he would be able to return to Arda and seek revenge on the Valar who sent him to the void--maybe even seek revenge on Illuvatar Himself!

Morgoth refused to follow the Kyrie. Instead, he found a wellspring and, using its power, reached through the void to Arda and brought the first of his new army--a dragon, some balrogs, and scores of Middle Earth orcs. He would challenge these valkyrie generals and seize the wellsprings for himself!

Illuvatar saw all of this--indeed, it was part of His plan to prepare the way for the Final Battle. He called to the Valar, by now far hidden away in their own realm far from the sight or reach of men, and told them what Morgoth had done. The Valar met to decide what to do.

In the end, it was decided that three of the Valar would be sent to Valhalla to counter the schemes of Morgoth. Orome, the Hunter, would go and summon the elves in the Halls of Mandos to fight for him. Aule, the Craftsman, would go and summon the dwarves to fight for him. And Tulkas, the strong, would go and summon the noble Edain and Dunedain to fight for him.

And so four new generals came to Valhalla--Morgoth, Orome, Aule, and Tulkas.

[boromir96]

Originally Posted by White Knight

After the War of Wrath, Morgoth was cast through the Door of Night into the void, ending Morgoth's terror in Arda until the prophesied final battle of Dagor Dagorath where he would meet his Final Doom.

Morgoth was forever banished from Arda--the way back was locked. And so he sat, alone, in the blackness of the void, for long eons.

But the Valar underestimated Morgoth's power and evil. Somehow, he was able to create a rip in the void, or an opening, or a portal. He arrived in a new realm--the realm of Valhalla.

Morgoth soon realized the power of the wellsprings in Valhalla--and realized that with the power of the wellspring he would be able to return to Arda and seek revenge on the Valar who sent him to the void--maybe even seek revenge on Illuvatar Himself!

Morgoth refused to follow the Kyrie. Instead, he found a wellspring and, using its power, reached through the void to Arda and brought the first of his new army--a dragon, some balrogs, and scores of Middle Earth orcs. He would challenge these valkyrie generals and seize the wellsprings for himself!

Illuvatar saw all of this--indeed, it was part of His plan to prepare the way for the Final Battle. He called to the Valar, by now far hidden away in their own realm far from the sight or reach of men, and told them what Morgoth had done. The Valar met to decide what to do.

In the end, it was decided that three of the Valar would be sent to Valhalla to counter the schemes of Morgoth. Orome, the Hunter, would go and summon the elves in the Halls of Mandos to fight for him. Aule, the Craftsman, would go and summon the dwarves to fight for him. And Tulkas, the strong, would go and summon the noble Edain and Dunedain to fight for him.

And so four new generals came to Valhalla--Morgoth, Orome, Aule, and Tulkas.

I like the story, but I think wer're running out of Wellsprings. There are only so many...

[caps]

Originally Posted by White Knight

After the War of Wrath, Morgoth was cast through the Door of Night into the void, ending Morgoth's terror in Arda until the prophesied final battle of Dagor Dagorath where he would meet his Final Doom.

Morgoth was forever banished from Arda--the way back was locked. And so he sat, alone, in the blackness of the void, for long eons.

But the Valar underestimated Morgoth's power and evil. Somehow, he was able to create a rip in the void, or an opening, or a portal. He arrived in a new realm--the realm of Valhalla.

Morgoth soon realized the power of the wellsprings in Valhalla--and realized that with the power of the wellspring he would be able to return to Arda and seek revenge on the Valar who sent him to the void--maybe even seek revenge on Illuvatar Himself!

Morgoth refused to follow the Kyrie. Instead, he found a wellspring and, using its power, reached through the void to Arda and brought the first of his new army--a dragon, some balrogs, and scores of Middle Earth orcs. He would challenge these valkyrie generals and seize the wellsprings for himself!

Illuvatar saw all of this--indeed, it was part of His plan to prepare the way for the Final Battle. He called to the Valar, by now far hidden away in their own realm far from the sight or reach of men, and told them what Morgoth had done. The Valar met to decide what to do.

In the end, it was decided that three of the Valar would be sent to Valhalla to counter the schemes of Morgoth. Orome, the Hunter, would go and summon the elves in the Halls of Mandos to fight for him. Aule, the Craftsman, would go and summon the dwarves to fight for him. And Tulkas, the strong, would go and summon the noble Edain and Dunedain to fight for him.

And so four new generals came to Valhalla--Morgoth, Orome, Aule, and Tulkas.

At the same time that I really really like this, I still think its a better idea to stick with Classic Generals, for all the reasons we've already gone over.

If we were going to create our own, then this is how I would want us to go about it.

But all the points regarding Classic Generals still stand, I think.

Among other things, the Classic Generals pull from all eras of time and all physical locations, but the LotR Generals would only be pulling from Arda.

[infectedsloth]

Originally Posted by Xorlof

And assuming no one wants us to make stats for the Basic game (*please, please, please let there be no one*), if we have enough art talent, I'd *love* to see a card with a miniature picture side using Hasbro card designs, and another side with our own design and movie-type photographs instead of the miniatures. On "our side" we could alias the generals into factions along the lines of what infectedsloth previously said.

Originally Posted by capsocrates

If this is what you are saying then, yes, I agree.
Basically, yes. We would design our figures to follow Classic Generals and balance them that way, but we would have an alternate card design following LotR generals and people could print them double-sided.

I agree with what's said above, I think it satisfies both sides. This should be taken to a vote soon, if it passes I like mine and Caps ideas as a starting points.

Originally Posted by infectedsloth

• The Edain and their descendents/Jandar
• Mordor/Valkrill
• Isengard and miscellaneous evil things/Vydar
• Dwarfs/Aquilla
• Elfs/Ullar
• Morgoth/Utgar
• Rohan and miscellaneous good thing/Einar

Originally Posted by capsocrates

• The Edain and their descendents /Jandar
• Mordor, Morgoth, and Co. /Utgar
• Isengard and other traitors /Vydar
• Dwarves and miscellaneous good/neutral /Aquilla
• Elves and possibly some forest creatures /Ullar
• Balrogs, Giant Spiders, other unaligned evils /Valkrill
• Rohan and miscellaneous good/neutral /Einar

For Vydar what did you mean by other traitors? Men of the east? Gollum?

Edit: Does anyone have the artistic talents to make custom templates, I sure don't.

[caps]

Originally Posted by infectedsloth

For Vydar what did you mean by other traitors? Men of the east? Gollum?

We may want to expand on Vydar beyond just Traitors, but I think Traitors should go there. Saruman. Grima. Gollum would be excellent in Vydar. People who were "good" but were then corrupted somehow. Maybe Boromir except he ends on enough of a high note that I would be happy with him having a Marcu-like power and following Jandar.

The Mountain men from Rohan would be a good fit for Vydar, and possibly the bad men that come to fight for Sauron towards the end--I think they're the Men of the East, but I can't remember.

But yeah, in general the Corrupted Good and the Neutral-with-a-bad-twist-but-not-bad-enough-for-Valkrill should go to Vydar.

[boromir96]

Originally Posted by capsocrates

We may want to expand on Vydar beyond just Traitors, but I think Traitors should go there. Saruman. Grima. Gollum would be excellent in Vydar. People who were "good" but were then corrupted somehow. Maybe Boromir except he ends on enough of a high note that I would be happy with him having a Marcu-like power and following Jandar.

The Mountain men from Rohan would be a good fit for Vydar, and possibly the bad men that come to fight for Sauron towards the end--I think they're the Men of the East, but I can't remember.

But yeah, in general the Corrupted Good and the Neutral-with-a-bad-twist-but-not-bad-enough-for-Valkrill should go to Vydar.

I did what? Oh yeah... Anyway, I just have a hard time seeing any LotR units going to Vydar. It just doesn't make sense to me. Vydar is futuristic and Techno.(with the exception of Murphy, Sudema, And Otanashi, I still don't understand why they went to Vydar.)

[caps]

Originally Posted by boromir96

I did what? Oh yeah... Anyway, I just have a hard time seeing any LotR units going to Vydar. It just doesn't make sense to me. Vydar is futuristic and Techno.(with the exception of Murphy, Sudema, And Otanashi, I still don't understand why they went to Vydar.)

Vydar, like the other generals, has multiple themes. One of them is mercenary, another is neutral, another is opportunistic, I think traitorous goes right with those as well, considering "recent events" in Valhalla.

[infectedsloth]

Originally Posted by capsocrates

We may want to expand on Vydar beyond just Traitors, but I think Traitors should go there. Saruman. Grima. Gollum would be excellent in Vydar. People who were "good" but were then corrupted somehow. Maybe Boromir except he ends on enough of a high note that I would be happy with him having a Marcu-like power and following Jandar.

I agree with Saruman, Grima and Gollum, but I like Boromir for Jandar/Gondor.

Originally Posted by capsocrates

The Mountain men from Rohan would be a good fit for Vydar

I think your referring to the Woses, I would like them to be lumped together with Rohan.

Originally Posted by capsocrates

and possibly the bad men that come to fight for Sauron towards the end--I think they're the Men of the East, but I can't remember.

They were Men of Rhun, Harad and Khand, the Haradrim were the ones with Mumakil. They could fighter for Vydar or Utgar/Mordor both fit well.

Edit:

Originally Posted by capsocrates

Vydar, like the other generals, has multiple themes. One of them is mercenary, another is neutral, another is opportunistic, I think traitorous goes right with those as well, considering "recent events" in Valhalla.

I agree with caps.

[caps]

Who are the Wose? I know this is bad, but when I think of "Wose" I think of walking trees from Battle for Wesnoth.

I'm thinking of the wild men that Saruman set against the Rohirrim.

[Son of Arathorn]

Originally Posted by capsocrates

Who are the Wose? I know this is bad, but when I think of "Wose" I think of walking trees from Battle for Wesnoth.

I'm thinking of the wild men that Saruman set against the Rohirrim.

Dunlendings. Carry on!

[infectedsloth]

Originally Posted by capsocrates

Who are the Wose? I know this is bad, but when I think of "Wose" I think of walking trees from Battle for Wesnoth.

I'm thinking of the wild men that Saruman set against the Rohirrim.

O.K. now I understand what you were saying, your thinking of the Wild men of Dunland, I think they should go with Saruman.

The Woses are the mountain men that helped the Rohirrim get through the mountains so they could reach Minas Tirith, they weren't in the movies.

[boromir96]

Originally Posted by infectedsloth

O.K. now I understand what you were saying, your thinking of the Wild men of Dunland, I think they should go with Saruman.

The Woses are the mountain men that helped the Rohirrim get through the mountains so they could reach Minas Tirith, they weren't in the movies.

Dunledings sound totally Valkrill to me. They're wild and crazy and hairy, what else could you ask for?