The Book of Havok

[TrollBrute]

Originally Posted by Karat

I'm not really a fan of that version yet. Keep trying.

What don't you like about it? It's hard to make suggestions when we don't know what the LD is looking for.

I like what V posted, but I would make a couple tweaks:

COSMIC ENERGY ABSORPTION X
Before taking a turn with Havok, you may place a purple Energy Marker on this card. At the end of the round, you may reveal an "X" Order Marker on this card to place an Energy Marker on this card. A maximum of 6 Energy Markers may be on this card.

PLASMA BURST SPECIAL ATTACK
Range 3+special. Attack 3+special.
Before attacking with this special attack, you may remove up to 3 Energy Markers from this card. Add 1 to the Range and Attack numbers of this Special Attack for each Energy Marker removed. If you remove 3 Energy Markers in this manner, all figures adjacent to the defending figure are also affected by the attack. Roll attack dice once for all affected figures. Affected figures roll defense dice separately

I would also consider bumping his Defense to 6, or his Life to 5, to give him a little more staying power.

[Karat]

I'm not liking the 3 markers or the 3+.

[Viegon]

Originally Posted by Karat

I'm not liking the 3 markers or the 3+.

Well, TB's most recent version kept the 6 markers, but limited him to only being able to use 3 at a time.

The thing is, if the SA starts at 0 range and attack, it's only useful once he's fully charged or at least close to it. But since that's really his only form of useful offense, and because he doesn't charge very fast passively, you get stuck wasting a bunch of turns to charge him. As I see it, he needs to either:
1) Be able to use his SA more frequently;
2) Have another form of offense so that you're not wasting turns recharging him; or
3) Be able to charge faster and/or passively.

Or even a combination of the above. TB, YodaK, weebear, and I were suggesting options that fit into #1, but if you don't like that, we could look into the other two; maybe give him base range (helps with #2), and allow him to gain 3 markers when he reveals an "X" (helps with #3)?

[TrollBrute]

Originally Posted by Karat

I'm not liking the 3 markers or the 3+.

Well, you're the LD here, what do you want to see? Do you disagree with the SA being too weak? What is it that you do and don't like?

[Karat]

Originally Posted by TrollBrute

Well, you're the LD here, what do you want to see? Do you disagree with the SA being too weak? What is it that you do and don't like?

COSMIC ENERGY ABSORPTION X
Start the game with 2 purple Energy Markers on this card. After taking a turn with Havok, you may place an Energy Marker on this card. At the end of the round, you may reveal an "X" Order Marker on this card to place an Energy Marker on this card. A maximum of 4 Energy Markers may be on this card.

PLASMA BURST SPECIAL ATTACK
Range 3+special. Attack 3+special.
Before attacking with this special attack, you may remove any number of Energy Markers from this card. Add 1 to the Range and Attack numbers of this Special Attack for each Energy Marker removed. If you remove an Energy Marker in this manner, all figures adjacent to the defending figure are also affected by the attack. Roll attack dice once for all affected figures. Affected figures roll defense dice separately.

Upon further reflection, my complaint about the 3+ is null and void with how often he "absorbs" energy. I think this will definitely increase his power level like people were wanting and allowing him to fulling "recharge" in a round. I'm also not opposed to bumping his life to 5.

[Viegon]

COSMIC ENERGY ABSORPTION X
Start the game with 2 purple Energy Markers on this card. After taking a turn with Havok, you may place an Energy Marker on this card. At the end of the round, you may reveal an "X" Order Marker on this card to place an Energy Marker on this card. A maximum of 4 Energy Markers may be on this card.

PLASMA BURST SPECIAL ATTACK
Range 3+special. Attack 3+special.
Before attacking with this special attack, you may remove any number of Energy Markers from this card. Add 1 to the Range and Attack numbers of this Special Attack for each Energy Marker removed. If you remove an Energy Marker in this manner, all figures adjacent to the defending figure are also affected by the attack. Roll attack dice once for all affected figures. Affected figures roll defense dice separately.

Starting with half of the markers feels weird to me, I'd prefer to just see him start at full power. Also, with 4 markers, I think we'd have to drop the SA to 2 base range and attack; the potential for a 7 range 7 attack explosion SA is a bit too much in my opinion. Though, personally, I still prefer the 3/3 base stats for the SA and 3 markers.

Otherwise, .

[Yodaking]

I'd like to see him have enough control to hit someone with an attack of 4 without also hitting an adj. ally. I get that he should not be able to precisely target/control his power at the highest levels but a SA of 4 is pretty average. An SA of 3 fairs rather poorly in this base 5 def. world.

[Karat]

Originally Posted by Viegon

Starting with half of the markers feels weird to me, I'd prefer to just see him start at full power. Also, with 4 markers, I think we'd have to drop the SA to 2 base range and attack; the potential for a 7 range 7 attack explosion SA is a bit too much in my opinion. Though, personally, I still prefer the 3/3 base stats for the SA and 3 markers.

Otherwise, .

I don't feel it's that much different than Cyc, and much more limited too I'm not opposed to him starting fully charged though.

Originally Posted by Yodaking

I'd like to see him have enough control to hit someone with an attack of 4 without also hitting an adj. ally. I get that he should not be able to precisely target/control his power at the highest levels but a SA of 4 is pretty average. An SA of 3 fairs rather poorly in this base 5 def. world.

I have contemplated a different route for this. something more like this.

PLASMA BURST SPECIAL ATTACK
Range 6. Attack Special.
The attack value of this Special Attack is equal to the number of Energy Markers on this card before each attack. When attacking with this Special Attack, all figures adjacent to the targeted figure are also affected by this attack. Affected figures roll defense dice separately. After attacking with this special attack, you may remove an Energy Marker from this card to attack again. Havok may not attack with this Special Attack more than 3 times in a single turn.

Then he could start with 6 or 5 markers. I think I prefer 6. This way you can be really aggressive with him but each successive attack drains him and he'll burn out of power quickly, and take some time to recharge.

[Viegon]

Originally Posted by Karat

I don't feel it's that much different than Cyc, and much more limited too I'm not opposed to him starting fully charged though.

Except Cyclops only has 5 attack with it and is forced to attack in a straight-line. That version of Havok's SA would easily outclass Cyclops's. Having Havok max-out at 6/6 puts him and Cyclops at about the same level.

Originally Posted by Karat

I have contemplated a different route for this. something more like this.

PLASMA BURST SPECIAL ATTACK
Range 6. Attack Special.
The attack value of this Special Attack is equal to the number of Energy Markers on this card before each attack. When attacking with this Special Attack, all figures adjacent to the targeted figure are also affected by this attack. Affected figures roll defense dice separately. After attacking with this special attack, you may remove an Energy Marker from this card to attack again. Havok may not attack with this Special Attack more than 3 times in a single turn.

Then he could start with 6 or 5 markers. I think I prefer 6. This way you can be really aggressive with him but each successive attack drains him and he'll burn out of power quickly, and take some time to recharge.

Eh, not a fan. I think we already have a really cool and unique SA, we just need to find the right balance for it.

[TrollBrute]

Originally Posted by Karat

PLASMA BURST SPECIAL ATTACK
Range 6. Attack Special.
The attack value of this Special Attack is equal to the number of Energy Markers on this card before each attack. When attacking with this Special Attack, all figures adjacent to the targeted figure are also affected by this attack. Affected figures roll defense dice separately. After attacking with this special attack, you may remove an Energy Marker from this card to attack again. Havok may not attack with this Special Attack more than 3 times in a single turn.

YK is right that this is too much of a swing in the opposite direction. This would be too strong. He could attack with 6 Range/6 Attack all adjacent affected, then 5 Range/5 Attack all figures adjacent affected on every single turn.

I like the version you posted just above that though.

[weebaer]

Originally Posted by Karat

I don't feel it's that much different than Cyc, and much more limited too I'm not opposed to him starting fully charged though.

I have contemplated a different route for this. something more like this.

PLASMA BURST SPECIAL ATTACK
Range 6. Attack Special.
The attack value of this Special Attack is equal to the number of Energy Markers on this card before each attack. When attacking with this Special Attack, all figures adjacent to the targeted figure are also affected by this attack. Affected figures roll defense dice separately. After attacking with this special attack, you may remove an Energy Marker from this card to attack again. Havok may not attack with this Special Attack more than 3 times in a single turn.

Then he could start with 6 or 5 markers. I think I prefer 6. This way you can be really aggressive with him but each successive attack drains him and he'll burn out of power quickly, and take some time to recharge.

I like this @Karat . I think this would put him in the 250 point range you were looking for. I think this is what he should be playtested at. Now I am excited to play him, thanks Karat.

EDIT: sorry for the double post, I should have kept reading before posting. Bottom line is, I like both of Karat's ideas.

[IAmBatman]

Originally Posted by weebaer

7 range and 7 attack is completely reasonable to me. He will not be able to use it very often. I think a more powerful SA is needed for the time it takes to recharge. I might even think about bumping it to 8 if you want to see his point between 200-250 points.

Agreed. 8 is too much, though, IMO. Start zone bombing could become a competitive concern even at 7 range and 7 attack. 8 would be too much, IMO.

Originally Posted by weebaer

I like this @Karat . I think this would put him in the 250 point range you were looking for. I think this is what he should be playtested at. Now I am excited to play him, thanks Karat.

Really depends on how the charging power works. If he's adding a marker at the end of every turn, that's waaaaay too powerful. If it's only on the X-Marker, I think it works. I might kill the last line, though. Why not let overly aggressive players completely burn him out in one glorious turn if they want?