Unlimited Start Zone Hexes

[mccombju]

I've seen a number of threads which approach the topic of adjusting the start zone size. Often these threads debate the merits of finishing a tournament on time, scoring systems, and the subtleties of game designer army card point cost balancing. That isn't the purpose of this thread.

The purpose of this thread is to ask you the question:

How does having an unlimited start zone affect your army choice decisions?

Consider the unlimited start zone to be a given i.e. a relevant metagame factor (implementation: bring additional Hexes required for your army; Hexes are placed by tournament administrator). Imagine that other tournament variables are constant i.e. scoring system, time allocated for games, pool of maps, pool of glyphs, army restrictions (i.e. no Marvel), etc.

Do you simply approach the situation from the perspective:

"Sweet! I've always had a nifty army in mind that start zone hex limitations wouldn't allow. Now I can play that army without concern about dropping Y of my chosen figures. Thank you, tournament director! "

Alternatively, do you approach this metagame consideration from the perspective:

"Mwuhahaha! Fly my pretties!" *and proceed to field an army composed of mostly cheap commons or 2-Hex figures, vastly exceeding the typical 24-Hex start zone restriction*

As a follow-up, when using said unlimited start zone hex army, do you ever utter something along the lines of...

"Take your non-special-attacking-army... Use it... I have little to no offensive power... Strike my units down. Give in to your anger. With each Deathreaver Scatter, you become more and more my slave... err... more and more of your units become engaged..."

It occurs to me that with the abandonment of the 24-Hex start zone restriction, a premium is placed upon figures with excellent defensive/life point economy. That's actually the reason that I went on a number crunching tirade to determine which Heroscape figures represent the best bargain in terms of survivability and point economy.

With that in mind, it looks to me that the Marro Dividers would be absolutely ridiculous in this format...

Marro Dividers x6 - 300
Marrden Nagrubs x2 - 60
Su-Bak-Na - 160
--------------------------
520 Points, 30 Hexes

...that is, if they don't face opponents with auto-kill powers...

I encourage people to post the armies that they would play in unlimited start-zone formats (please include the point totals) as part of their answer to my above question.

Here's a few potential armies that could be used to abuse an unlimited start zone format:

Marrden Hounds x3 - 270
Deathreavers x3 - 120
Airborne Elite - 110
-------------------------
500 Points, 34 Hexes

4th Mass x7 - 490
Eldgrim - 30
-------------------------
520 Points, 29 Hexes

Marro Drones x7 - 350
Isamu - 10
Marro Hive - 160
--------------------------
520 Points, 28 Hexes

Krav - 100
Raelin - 80
Laglor - 110
Deathreavers x4 - 160
Isamu - 10
----------------------------
500 Points, 26 Hexes

Taelord - 180
Deathreavers x4 - 160
Ashigaru Harquebus x3 - 180
----------------------------
520 Points, 29 Hexes

[Bonecrusher]

I've always (who doesn't have a single squad of Ashigaru but uses proxies) thought this would be really fun:

Kato
5x Each Ashigaru
Kaemon
Raelin
Kozuke

1000 points

[ProtoFury]

I'd say something like this would be fun to play--

Marrden Hounds x2
Marro Dividers x3
Marro Stingers x3
Isamu
===================
520 Points, 31 hexes

Or,

Krug
Arrow Gruts x6
Swog Riders x6
Isamu
===================
520 points, 33 hexes

Or this,

Marrden Hounds x3
Marro Stingers x5
Isamu
===================
520 points, 34 hexes

These armies would be fun to play, and (in theory) pretty decent armies in terms of success as well.

[mccombju]

ProtoFury, that Krug army looks like fun to play.

I'd be a fan of the Marrden Hounds armies, too... if not for the fact that it will be nigh impossible to avoid Marro Plague on your own units (unless start zones were truly unlimited, with no fear of adjacencies... in which case, I like your 3rd army the best).

When it comes to making Marrden Hound armies that "play nice" with non-Soulborgs, you need to have either units that don't start in the start-zone (i.e. Airborne Elite or Rechets of Bogdan) or you'll need at least a few Soulborgs to wall-off your other figures susceptible to Marro Plague.

[IAmBatman]

Krav Maga
Rats x10
500 points

This is why there are start zone limits, lol.

[Rich10]

At 500 points, the most obvious army that I can think of is
4th Mass x 7 490 28 hexes

This might be a tough army as well.
MDG 100
Romans x 8 400
Total 500 33 hexes

I wonder if this would make the Blade Gruts better...
Grimnak 120
Tornak 100
Nerak 50
Blade Gruts x 6 240
Total 510 30 hexes

This would make for some very long battles. I think I prefer the strategy of having to consider start zones.

[Bonecrusher]

5x Stinger
5x Rats

35 Spaces

That is just ugly. Even dropping one of both or two of Deathreavers for Raelin is sick.

[ProtoFury]

Originally Posted by mccombju

ProtoFury, that Krug army looks like fun to play.

I'd be a fan of the Marrden Hounds armies, too... if not for the fact that it will be nigh impossible to avoid Marro Plague on your own units (unless start zones were truly unlimited, with no fear of adjacencies... in which case, I like your 3rd army the best).

When it comes to making Marrden Hound armies that "play nice" with non-Soulborgs, you need to have either units that don't start in the start-zone (i.e. Airborne Elite or Rechets of Bogdan) or you'll need at least a few Soulborgs to wall-off your other figures susceptible to Marro Plague.

I use Hounds with non-Soulborgs Qute often--in fact, one of my armies lately involves 2 sets of hounds with Krug and some Gruts/Swog combos. Using Hounds with non-borgs isn't necessarily the easiest thing ever, but it is far from impossible. It all comes down to smart placement in the staring zone. Keep them together on the end of your starting zone (if there is more than one squad) and one your first turn with them, get the three that are adjacent to any non-borgs out of adjacency (unless of course one is next to Krug and you're feeling cocky ). If placement was done well enough/correctly, you can end turn number one with no hounds adjacent to your figures.

And, during the actual match, an easy way to keep Hounds from mucking with your own figures is to just send them out early, use them as raiding parties to thin the enemy's ranks before they even get a chance to come up on you. I think my favorite time I used this was when a friend and I were playing on Embattled Fen, practicing for NHSD recently,and I used two sets of Hounds that left early and completely tore up my friend's Romans. They couldn't do squat against the Omnicrons behind them, but that's all I needed them for, was the initial assualt, and then using their high defense to catch the bots in engagements, hold the Wound Glyph (one hound lasted four rounds against Marcus Decimus Gallus, who was used about twice a round), and occasionally attack the remaining forces, while I got my orc archers in place, and prepared for Krug's rampage.

In terms of the placement though, here's a visual example of what I mean, using Grimnaks as a replacement for two squads of Hounds, and Marro Warriors (in an intentional irony) as anything else.

Spoiler Alert!

Here we have the inital stating placement--the green 24-hex is the starting zone.



And here, you can see the placement of the grim-hounds at the end of the first turn (provided they were selected first). I based the move off of the disadvantageous situaton in which they only move four spaces. if you're only moving two, you're kinda screwed no matter what, it's just a matter of minimalizing potential damage (but even in this case, by moving the guys that have been moved for the Move 4, you can make it so only one hound is in contact with your regular troops given a Move 2--and only 1 troop at that). But here is a good example of the hound placement strategies you can use.

Placement like this keeps your Hounds from doing hardly any damage to your own troops once they have been activated. It keeps things quite easy for you, and this type of thing can be done in many different (if not any) kinds of starting zones--I have done this on plenty of BoV maps--Embattled Fen, Road Rampage, and Highways and Dieways, to name a few.

Hound placement can be tricky, but when done properly, can be done with little to no damage to your own troops--quite often.

[wriggz]

Originally Posted by mccombju

I've seen a number of threads which approach the topic of adjusting the start zone size. Often these threads debate the merits of finishing a tournament on time, scoring systems, and the subtleties of game designer army card point cost balancing. That isn't the purpose of this thread.

The purpose of this thread is to ask you the question:

How does having an unlimited start zone affect your army choice decisions?

Interesting Post Considering your home town is holding an unlimited NHSD event.

I Think romans and 10th are the way to go:
Marcus: 100
4 X 10th: 400
2 x Romans: 500
25 figures.

I do fear Zelrig, other dragons, Deathwalkers 9000 and 8000. A fair run of luck and your army is toast. Knowing that my opponant might field so many commons that there is no way he can avoid the Zee-bomb in the start zone would make really consider bringing big red to the game.

Wriggz

[nyys]

I'd go Grut crazy.

Grimnak
Tornak
Nerak
Blades x3
Heavies x3
600pts - 30 Hexes

[FOOTBALLDUDE88]

3x B-trons 180
5x G-trons 400
Laglor 110
Otonashi 10
==============
700 points 34 Hexes

If I could do this army I would.
FBD88

[Aldin]

Doing away with the limits is pretty abusable with Rats, Drones and Dividers. I can't think of many things with the ability to stop 10xDividers at 500 points. 10xWoA perhaps? Still, the most fun would clearly be doublespace figs and I have a well-known weakness for the Deathstalkers:

3xDeathstalkers
2x10th
Tarn Vikings
500 points/30 hexes

~Aldin, who also likes 3xDS 5xRat at 38 hexes