Wave 9 - Specials Too Complex??

[Sokol]

Nice list, kenjib! I was thinking of figuring this up myself. You just saved me a lot of time.

[Agent Minivann]

Originally Posted by kenjib

A lot of good stuff

I can't think of them off the top of my head, but there are the cards that combine Ghost Walk and Disengage into Phantom Walk. All the old schoolers in the house might think of them as 3 (or 4?) power cards.

[TheSparkleInYourWater]

Originally Posted by Sherman Davies

Thanks for adding nothing to the conversation and insulting those who disagree with you, Yodaking. See kenjib's post below yours for a perfect example of an excellent post.

Please re-read (or read for the first time) the original post; EyeofSauron wasn't saying the new units were too complex for him, he was questioning whether his son's perception of that complexity might change Heroscape's appeal or alter the metagame.

I didn't feel like Yodaking was insulting anyone with his post. If I had to guess, I'd say he saw the thread title, thought to himself "No. If it was though, I could just play the basic version and still enjoy the game". So he decided to post his thought real quick without thinking it might seem a little rude (To me it didn't seem rude). Either that or he's a jerk.

I was just wondering if there were any army cards with 4 abilities on it the other day. Now I know Sonya is the only one, thanks Kenjib.

[Pilgrim]

Notice too that some of the abilities are sort of non-abilities. The Divider's second "ability" limits them from using the Hive's rebirth ability. On the dwarves you have climb x2, which is technically an ability, but in reality just makes them able to get around the board like a normal unit.

Probably the figures most surprisingly loaded with abilities, to me, are the mohichans. It seems a lot for 70 pt squad figures. But I suppose their base stats offset the power of three abilities. The same could be said for repulsors, but again their base states and their focus on soulborgs seems to keep their three abilities from being OP.

I like TBR and Brave Arrow having so many abilities. This seems to fit a hero, IMO.

[BurnyFlame]

Originally Posted by TheSparkleInYourWater

I didn't feel like Yodaking was insulting anyone with his post. If I had to guess, I'd say he saw the thread title, thought to himself "No. If it was though, I could just play the basic version and still enjoy the game". So he decided to post his thought real quick without thinking it might seem a little rude (To me it didn't seem rude). Either that or he's a jerk.

I want to support the idea that inviting someone to play the Basic Game is NOT an insult. More people should do so, it really is quite fun.

As for the discussion, I think that if they can fit the powers in the limited space of the left side of a card, it can't be that complex. And I don't see what "MetaKnight's game" has to do with extra powers in HeroScape . . . maybe something about tournament variations . . .

[RichardD]

Originally Posted by BurnyFlame

I want to support the idea that inviting someone to play the Basic Game is NOT an insult. More people should do so, it really is quite fun.

No it isn't, the basic game is awful. If you're old enough to read and understand the *right* side of the cards (and my 6.5 year old is starting to manage that) you should be playing the expert game. I've played plenty of basic game in demoing HS to people (I *always* use the full game, *unless* they're under eight), but still remember my first game of basic - it was enough to put me off playing Heroscape completely for several months.

Going back to the topic, I'd say that all of the new abilities I've seen on the Wave 9 cards so far *are* complex, and nudge at the edge of "too complex" - if only because they force the players to try and remember an awful lot of stuff when these figures are in play.

But at the end of the day I'd rather have "almost too complicated" than "definitely too simple", because it makes the game richer in tactics and options, and gives the units more flavour. I've been disappointed time and again with previous waves when the official figures didn't match up to the pre-release speculation here on HS - and this was always down to cards being too simple or special powers too bland or too few, for units that I thought deserved more based on the units' names.

[Jexik]

I agree with RichardD. The basic game is not fun. I tried to teach my father how to play with the Basic Game, and he got bored and has never wished to give it another chance. It's the powers that give units all of the flavor, differentiation, and synergy that help make Heroscape what it is.

[kenjib]

I've updated my stats with the rest of the wave 9 units.

[Mythic]

Originally Posted by kenjib

I've updated my stats with the rest of the wave 9 units.

Might I suggest re-posting your amazing stats analysis in another thread so that it could be referenced easier?

I have the feeling that this thread will become buried as we all get accustomed to wave 9 and I would hate for these interesting stats to be "lost".

I'm not sure if the "definitive list of lists" should reference it or if there is another summary thread somewhere that would be a better home...

[hakysak]

Well, my three year old thinks the basic game is awesome. The more dice she rolls the happier she is.

I felt that the new wave is extremely technical, especially compared to former units. low to average stats with a slew of special abilities, a lot of them having certain conditions present in order to be performed.

"If you have all of you order markers on gladiators, and at least one of those is on this card, and it is your birthday, and your opponent's name is Doug, you automatically win initiative."



That was fun.