The Pre-SoV Workshop

[Scytale]

Phoa Rah is interesting. Is it supposed to be a mummified pharaoh? If so, Guard doesn't really fit, though it's not terrible if needed for synergies.

Cursed Spirit doesn't really work, because Heroscape doesn't always clarify what figure causes wounds. In fact, normally can you can't even say "destroyed by an enemy figure" because you don't even know that. While it can work to limit these sorts of effects to triggering off of being destroyed by enemy attacks, here you can't even limit it to normal and special attacks because special attacks have somewhat of the same problem (Arrow Volley, for example). You would need to limit this power to normal attacks (for which the wound origination is clear). Possibly leaving engagement attacks as well, if you wanted to get cheeky.

Personally, I'd change Cursed Spirit to be a bit better overall and fit better in the ruleset, at the cost of a little theme:

CURSED SPIRIT
When Phoa Rah is destroyed, choose an opponent. That opponent must choose one of their figures. If that figure is Common, that figure is destroyed. If that figure is Unique, place Phoa Rah on that figure's Army Card. Phoa Ra's Spirit subtracts one from the Defense number on that card.

[SchismaticSounds]

Thanks for mentioning that. Was told about the issue with attacks from multiple figures like arrow volley, but it somehow slipped my mind. That does make more sense, though bit perplexing. So it needs more clarification than simply "destroyed by".

Trying to keep Cursed Spirits activation in all attacking scenarios (including special attacks from squads), here is an example of what I get
Edit:

Spoiler Alert!

If I did this correctly, attempting to include an affect for every attacking scenario ends up as an abysmal wording mess. And that leaves out engagement strike.

One option that just came to me but is a bit more drastic of a change would be "when Phoa Rah is destroyed, that you may choose a figure within X amount of spaces from him to inflict a wound to, additionally if the figure is a unique figure/squad", etc. It does open up a ton more possible scenarios to investigate though. I want it to fit in with all existing Spirit abilities as much as possible, so that could be a bit too off, but as you said, it will cost some theme.
Here is an Example of a push in that direction

Spoiler Alert!

I'm not sure how it would work while an enemy is in control of Phoa Rah, like with Mind Shackle.

Yes, that is the theme, a Pharaoh mummy that is stripped down to the point of being unrecognizable as such, acting nearly as another Crypt Guardian, allowing the Guard synergy.

[Knight of Scape]

Personally I like the simple approach of just making him exactly an inverse Thorgrim: "When Phoa Ra is destroyed, place this figure on any unique Army Card. Phoa Ra's spirit subtracts 1 from the defense number on that card."

Thematically I view as Phoa Ra choosing who to blame for his death. Like, even if he died from getting knocked into lava, he's still gonna curse one of his enemies, not the molten lava. Like with the Viking champions, that does open up the possibility of Phoa Ra killing himself off just to curse somebody, but I don't think that spending 90 points just to subtract 1 from an opponent's defense is ever going to be a worthwhile deal, so you're still going to want to play him in a way that will make the opponent want to kill him.

[quozl]

Originally Posted by Knight of Scape

Personally I like the simple approach of just making him exactly an inverse Thorgrim: "When Phoa Ra is destroyed, place this figure on any unique Army Card. Phoa Ra's spirit subtracts 1 from the defense number on that card."

Thematically I view as Phoa Ra choosing who to blame for his death. Like, even if he died from getting knocked into lava, he's still gonna curse one of his enemies, not the molten lava. Like with the Viking champions, that does open up the possibility of Phoa Ra killing himself off just to curse somebody, but I don't think that spending 90 points just to subtract 1 from an opponent's defense is ever going to be a worthwhile deal, so you're still going to want to play him in a way that will make the opponent want to kill him.

Yep.

[SchismaticSounds]

Originally Posted by Knight of Scape

Personally I like the simple approach of just making him exactly an inverse Thorgrim: "When Phoa Ra is destroyed, place this figure on any unique Army Card. Phoa Ra's spirit subtracts 1 from the defense number on that card."

Thematically I view as Phoa Ra choosing who to blame for his death. Like, even if he died from getting knocked into lava, he's still gonna curse one of his enemies, not the molten lava. Like with the Viking champions, that does open up the possibility of Phoa Ra killing himself off just to curse somebody, but I don't think that spending 90 points just to subtract 1 from an opponent's defense is ever going to be a worthwhile deal, so you're still going to want to play him in a way that will make the opponent want to kill him.

Thanks for your feedback! I tend to forget that Thorgrim/Finn can place their spirit on 'any' Unique Army Card. Perhaps I got carried away with keeping the dealing of a wound bit, since it made things extra interesting. His point value did feel slightly high even still. If there were to be a full line of negative dealing spirits (-1 Atk, -1 Move), then taking up -1 defense spirit named "Cursed Spirit" could be in question.

Spoiler Alert!

[quozl]

Cursed Defense Spirit, Cursed Attack Spirit, etc.

[vegietarian18]

I think you could even get away with -1 attack AND -1 defense on Cursed Spirit. With Finn and Thorgrim, you get to build your army around getting their boost, so more often they can do a lot of work. You can't control what your opponent is bringing, so I think -1/-1 is a closer parallel from a balance perspective.

Is the sculpt in the image different than the sculpt in the hitzone? The one with the trident spear in the hitzone picture looks much cooler.

[Scytale]

Originally Posted by SchismaticSounds

Perhaps I got carried away with keeping the dealing of a wound bit, since it made things extra interesting.

It's easy to get hung up on "forcing" specific themes, but it's how something plays that important. In gameplay, there won't be a lot of difference if you need to curse the specific figure that attacked or leave it more general. So all that extra text probably isn't worth it. Simple is better.

[SchismaticSounds]

Originally Posted by vegietarian18

I think you could even get away with -1 attack AND -1 defense on Cursed Spirit. With Finn and Thorgrim, you get to build your army around getting their boost, so more often they can do a lot of work. You can't control what your opponent is bringing, so I think -1/-1 is a closer parallel from a balance perspective.

Is the sculpt in the image different than the sculpt in the hitzone? The one with the trident spear in the hitzone picture looks much cooler.

True. I will have to test that. Certainly quite a difference with the reversal. Hence why I thought a wound could be appropriate.

I still have the hit box from the original model in there, which although very cool, is unfortunately an unpainted reaper mini. "Mummy Lich"

Spoiler Alert!

[Shiftrex]

Back with some edits, some new tests, and a new species that hopefully bridges some gaps. I think this version is really simple, has played really clean, and leans into the theme that monks have with their martial arts in Heroscape.



And for the species, I want to attach a reminder that it has several iterations and has been used by pop culture a lot. It's a hybrid without writing the word hybrid.

[vegietarian18]

Interesting. When I'm googling the word, I'm seeing it essentially only used in Biblical contexts. What's the homeworld supposed to be with this iteration of the design?

Death Touch is functionally identical to the Wyvern's Venomous Sting. Do you want to call it that?

I will say that I think the older version of the design appealed to me a little more in terms of its ability to bridge two factions. Now it's just an addition to the Monk faction, which is pretty thematically cogent now; just a random monster monk added to that faction that plays pretty similarly to the rest of the monk heroes. The monk heroes already suffer from being too same-y, which isn't the fault of this design, but it still impacts the design space you're working in.

[Shiftrex]

I mean, I'm not seeing how the miniature could venomously sting anything so I don't think I want that name. I did appreciate the stuff I was doing on the previous version as well but I was told multiple times that it was not thematic so I had to adjust course.

Generic dumping ground of Feylund, I don't know how to design for the other planets so I'm not trying. Don't know them well enough.

The word is used for your player characters in the long running Diablo series among many other properties dealing with angels, devils, and mortals. Not uncommon in pop culture.