HoME Brainstorming Thread

[faure]

Some thoughts:
- he's got far more experience/age than normal humans - I'd go with Dunedain for species
- for general, I think Ullar is the right choice
- Athelas (aka King's Foil) seems like it should go with Aragorn the King (and be able to counter things like the Black Breath), though a Ranger's Healing or the like is fine
- I'm not inclined towards a Ranger and a Hunter version - I really don't see him as that distinct but it's not a showstopper for me if others prefer that
- I prefer him to have Range (he's a Ranger/Hunter after all) but better attack or option for double attack when adjacent makes sense
- I like him having a protection ability (I prefer something like Dunedain Protection rather than the no hit zone option - the latter seems like a benefit from an elf cloak)

[caps]

Originally Posted by infectedsloth

• I feel the most natural choice would be for Aragorn to follow Ullar. Going with Aquilla would be an irreconcilable theme break.
• I prefer Dunedain over Human.
• Like most, I think a healing power of some sort is a must.
• I'd rather Aragorn not have range.

Dunedain Tracking
Before the game choose an opponents unique hero. After the chosen unique hero takes a turn you may move Aragorn 2 spaces.

I can see Ullar. How would Aquilla be a theme break? Jandar makes sense for Aragorn as a king.

Dunedain is alright with me, I think, as it keeps him outside some potential synergies for humans--probably a good thing.

I don't think a healing power is a must, especially since, as Faure points out, Aragorn performed more dramatic healing in Minas Tirith (in Heroscape terms, his use of Kingsfoil with Frodo was more like removing a Poison marker or the like). However, I think I am pro-healing power at this point.

I think whether or not I think Aragorn should have range will depend on what we decide on for the rest of the design.

Originally Posted by Son of Arathorn

Aragorn (the Hunter):

NAME = ARAGORN
GENERAL = JANDAR
PLANET = ARDA
SPECIES = DUNEDAIN
UNIQUENESS = UNIQUE HERO
CLASS = HUNTER
PERSONALITY = DETERMINED
SIZE/HEIGHT = MEDIUM/5

LIFE = 6
MOVE = 5
RANGE = 1
ATTACK = 4
DEFENSE = 4
POINTS = 120

ENGAGING STRIKE 14
After moving and before attacking with Aragorn, roll the 20-sided die once for each opponent’s small or medium figure engaged with Aragorn that he was not adjacent to at the start of his turn. If you roll a 14 or higher, that figure receives 1 wound.

DUNEDAIN LEADERSHIP
After revealing a numbered order marker on this Army Card and taking a turn with Aragorn, if he destroyed at least 1 opponent’s figure this turn, you may reveal an “X” order marker that is on this Army Card and take a turn with a friendly Unique Hero that is within 6 clear sight spaces of Aragorn.

I was willing to be persuaded that a "Hunter" Aragorn was necessary, but this writeup, and what it represents thematically, is not doing it for me.

Originally Posted by faure

Some thoughts:
- he's got far more experience/age than normal humans - I'd go with Dunedain for species
- for general, I think Ullar is the right choice
- Athelas (aka King's Foil) seems like it should go with Aragorn the King (and be able to counter things like the Black Breath), though a Ranger's Healing or the like is fine
- I'm not inclined towards a Ranger and a Hunter version - I really don't see him as that distinct but it's not a showstopper for me if others prefer that
- I prefer him to have Range (he's a Ranger/Hunter after all) but better attack or option for double attack when adjacent makes sense
- I like him having a protection ability (I prefer something like Dunedain Protection rather than the no hit zone option - the latter seems like a benefit from an elf cloak)

I didn't like DUNEDAIN PROTECTION in particular because taking wounds for an ally doesn't feel like a thematic fit for Aragorn, while hiding himself and an ally (allies?) in the wilderness does. However, we can brainstorm more if the general feel is against the hiding power.

[White Knight]

My thoughts:

- I like Ranger's Assault, and I like him as a melee fighter (but I'm OK with him having a bow for range)

- I think his race should be Human. Elros chose to be fully human, just as Elrond chose to be fully elven. Also, being a human allows lots of bonding options. I think of poor Erevan and Sharwin and am reminded of how they longingly wish to be part of the nine...

- I think Jandar would be best for a general.

- I do NOT want Strider to have healing powers. He couldn't heal Frodo--they had to send him to the House of Elrond and let Elrond and Glorfindel heal him. He's not a magical healer.

- I agree that the Strider power is better for Legolas. Yes, he's a Ranger, but I don't see him as running on water.

- I don't see a need for a Ranger and Hunter version. A King, yes, but not a Hunter.

- I'd be OK with some type of protection power, but I'm not convinced about either of the options yet.

- I'd be happy with Aragorn the Ranger having just 2 powers--Ranger's Assault, and perhaps some type of defensive or other power.

[caps]

To keep the ball rolling, here are two (of many) possible syntheses of SoA's and my drafts.

NAME = ARAGORN
GENERAL = ULLAR
PLANET = ARDA
SPECIES = DUNEDAIN
UNIQUENESS = UNIQUE HERO
CLASS = RANGER
PERSONALITY = TRICKY?
SIZE/HEIGHT = MEDIUM/5

LIFE = 5
MOVE = 6
RANGE = 5
ATTACK = 2
DEFENSE = 3
POINTS = 100

RANGER'S ASSAULT
When Strider attacks an adjacent figure or destructible object, he may add 2 dice to his attack or attack one additional time.

ATHELAS HEALING
After moving and instead of attacking with Aragorn, you may choose a friendly small or medium figure adjacent to Aragorn and remove 1 wound marker from it's Army Card.

RANGER OF THE NORTH
After taking a turn with Strider, if he is unengaged, you may choose an adjacent unengaged friendly figure. Strider and the chosen figure have no visible Hit Zones until the next time you reveal an Order Marker.

Note that I dropped the ranged attack down to 2 and the range down to 5. The double attack can still prove a potent option when Aragorn has height or a Treasure Glyph (personal items that I think it's likely many of the Fellowship will end up carrying in casual play and scenarios)

NAME = ARAGORN
GENERAL = ULLAR
PLANET = ARDA
SPECIES = DUNEDAIN
UNIQUENESS = UNIQUE HERO
CLASS = RANGER
PERSONALITY = TRICKY?
SIZE/HEIGHT = MEDIUM/5

LIFE = 5
MOVE = 6
RANGE = 1
ATTACK = 4
DEFENSE = 3
POINTS = 90

ATHELAS HEALING
After moving and instead of attacking with Aragorn, you may choose a friendly small or medium figure adjacent to Aragorn and remove 1 wound marker from it's Army Card.

RANGER OF THE NORTH
After taking a turn with Strider, if he is unengaged, you may choose an adjacent unengaged friendly figure. Strider and the chosen figure have no visible Hit Zones until the next time you reveal an Order Marker.

Here I removed all range from the card, dropped RANGER'S ASSAULT altogether and upped his normal attack to 4.

--

Do not take this post as a reason to abstain from posting your own writeup if you haven't yet.

--

Regarding Aethelas Healing, I'd like to make it more potent since he's giving up an attack to do it:

ATHELAS HEALING
After moving and instead of attacking with Aragorn, you may choose a friendly small or medium figure adjacent to Aragorn and roll the 20-sided die. If you roll a 3-16, remove 1 wound marker from its Army Card. If you roll a 17-19, remove up to 2 wound markers from its Army Card. If you roll a 20 or higher, remove up to 3 wound markers from its Army Card. See my post responding to WK below.

I like that he has to give up an attack, as his application of Aethelas is not like a healing touch or a magic spell that he can just do instantly. Thematically he should probably have to sacrifice his move to use it also, but that would probably make it to restrictive in gameplay terms so I'm alright with that part as-is.

[faure]

- I like Ranger's Assault, and I like him as a melee fighter (but I'm OK with him having a bow for range)

agree.

- I think his race should be Human. Elros chose to be fully human, just as Elrond chose to be fully elven. Also, being a human allows lots of bonding options. I think of poor Erevan and Sharwin and am reminded of how they longingly wish to be part of the nine...

Good point. He is human, just long-lived.

- I think Jandar would be best for a general.

Not convinced on this one, though would lean more towards Jandar than Aquilla after Ullar.

- I do NOT want Strider to have healing powers. He couldn't heal Frodo--they had to send him to the House of Elrond and let Elrond and Glorfindel heal him. He's not a magical healer.

True, but Frodo's wound was magical. Quite agree he would not be a magical healer, but more like a Field Medic.

- I agree that the Strider power is better for Legolas. Yes, he's a Ranger, but I don't see him as running on water.

agree.

- I'd be OK with some type of protection power, but I'm not convinced about either of the options yet.

I think it needs more brainstorming as well, but think this would be natural - he was very protective of largely defenseless hobbits at Weathertop.

- I'd be happy with Aragorn the Ranger having just 2 powers--Ranger's Assault, and perhaps some type of defensive or other power.

Would work for me. Might almost be inclined towards something like Tandros' Combat Challenge.

[caps]

Originally Posted by White Knight

- I think his race should be Human. Elros chose to be fully human, just as Elrond chose to be fully elven. Also, being a human allows lots of bonding options. I think of poor Erevan and Sharwin and am reminded of how they longingly wish to be part of the nine...

Which bonding options, in particular, does it allow? I can be persuaded either way on his race.

- I think Jandar would be best for a general.

I'm open to Jandar or Ullar--I can be persuaded either way.

- I do NOT want Strider to have healing powers. He couldn't heal Frodo--they had to send him to the House of Elrond and let Elrond and Glorfindel heal him. He's not a magical healer.

Strider is not incapable of any kind of healing. He was, however, incapable of doing anything other than slowing the pace of Frodo's wound. This is a good argument, however, in favor of the healing power being more restrained (only 1 wound, counter to what I just posted).

But, as I said in my last post, I don't feel a healing power is a MUST, just that its a possibility.

[caps]

Originally Posted by faure

Would work for me. Might almost be inclined towards something like Tandros' Combat Challenge.

I think I could see Combat Challenge for Boromir (I might even have it on my Boromir write-up) but I don't think it fits Aragorn.

If we give Aragorn a defensive power, I think it should be a subtle one. I do rather like the one I proposed. It could possibly be extended to protect more units, but I don't think it should protect too many more.

EDIT: Although I don't think that what I proposed (RANGER OF THE NORTH) meshes well with a ranged Aragorn. Aragorn could become really annoying in that scenario.

[White Knight]

[quote=capsocrates;1931197]

Originally Posted by White Knight

- I think his race should be Human. Elros chose to be fully human, just as Elrond chose to be fully elven. Also, being a human allows lots of bonding options. I think of poor Erevan and Sharwin and am reminded of how they longingly wish to be part of the nine...

Which bonding options, in particular, does it allow? I can be persuaded either way on his race.

Nevermind--and good call.

I just checked, and the only bonding is with human champions. Since Aragorn is not a champion, it won't make any difference.


I'm still adamantly opposed to healing on Aragorn the Ranger. Besides the LotR theme break, giving up your attack to heal only 1 wound is usually worthless game-wise (EXCEPT for dungeon crawls, where you can heal all wounds between battles). Kelda can heal more than 1 wound, but it's usually not worth giving up your attack--your opponent just hurts you again on his next turn and you're back to square 1.

On the other hand, if you can show me one passage in the book where Aragorn heals in the middle of combat, I'll reconsider.

(It's too bad Tolkien didn't give Athelas Healing to Aragorn the Ranger. If he had, poor Boromir would still be alive... )

"Farewell, Aragorn! Go to Minas Tirith and save my people! I have failed!"
"No!", said Aragorn, taking his hand and kissing his brow. "You have conquered. Few have gained such victory. Be at peace! Minas Tirith shall not fall!"
Boromir smiled.
"Which way did they go? Was Frodo there?" said Aragorn.
But Boromir did not speak again.
Then Aragorn used his Athelas healing on Boromir and Boromir recovered.

-------------------------------

For Gandalf, I posted all his fight scenes from the LotR books. Can someone do that for Aragorn (before the paths of the dead)?

[infectedsloth]

When did we decide we were making two versions of Aragorn? Based on the voting thread I assumed we were just making one. Aragorn wasn't labeled Ranger Aragorn or pre RotK Aragorn.

[caps]

Thematically, WK, I would consider Boromir dead in Heroscape terms by the time Aragorn found him.

infectedsloth, I don't remember if it was ever officially stated anywhere, but as far back as I can remember two versions of Aragorn have been at least on the table if not assumed. I think many of us feel it will be easier to capture Aragorn as a Ranger as separate from Aragorn as King.

[Son of Arathorn]

Originally Posted by White Knight

On the other hand, if you can show me one passage in the book where Aragorn heals in the middle of combat, I'll reconsider.

The Fellowship's just come out of Moria, orcs on their tails, and he heals Frodo's bruises from the Cave Troll. Not quite the middle of combat, but they're sure not resting for the night. Maybe add an "Aragorn must be unengaged to use Athelas Healing" stipulation?

[Heroscaper Guy]

Originally Posted by Son of Arathorn

The Fellowship's just come out of Moria, orcs on their tails, and he heals Frodo's bruises from the Cave Troll. Not quite the middle of combat, but they're sure not resting for the night. Maybe add an "Aragorn must be unengaged to use Athelas Healing" stipulation?

Right, trying to remember if that was in Decipher's RPG or not.