HoME Brainstorming Thread

[Son of Arathorn]

I'm not sure Glamdring as a Treasure Glyph is necessary. The difference between the other potential TG's and Glamdring is that Glamdring never changes hands, at least in the LotR and most of the Hobbit. The Ring goes from Gollum to Bilbo to Frodo to Sam and back to Gollum. Sting goes from Bilbo to Frodo to Sam, the mithril coat from the dwarve's treasure to Bilbo to Frodo, but the only two places Glamdring goes is the troll treasure hold, and Gandalf's belt. Then again, if we're going to cover the Goblin Wars and Gondolin, keeping Glamdring mobile between characters could be useful. To the best of my knowledge, only Turgon, elven ruler of Gondolin, and Gandalf ever used the sword.

I suppose we could feasibly make it a Treasure Glyph. Nothing too fancy, but this could be a place to start:

BLUE GLOW
If your opponent controls at least 1 Orc or Goblin figure, you may add 3 to your initiative roll.

FOE-HAMMER
When this figure attacks an Orc or Goblin figure, add 1 automatic skull to whatever is rolled.

[caps]

Originally Posted by Son of Arathorn

I'm not sure Glamdring as a Treasure Glyph is necessary. The difference between the other potential TG's and Glamdring is that Glamdring never changes hands, at least in the LotR and most of the Hobbit. The Ring goes from Gollum to Bilbo to Frodo to Sam and back to Gollum. Sting goes from Bilbo to Frodo to Sam, the mithril coat from the dwarve's treasure to Bilbo to Frodo, but the only two places Glamdring goes is the troll treasure hold, and Gandalf's belt. Then again, if we're going to cover the Goblin Wars and Gondolin, keeping Glamdring mobile between characters could be useful. To the best of my knowledge, only Turgon, elven ruler of Gondolin, and Gandalf ever used the sword.

I suppose we could feasibly make it a Treasure Glyph. Nothing too fancy, but this could be a place to start:

BLUE GLOW
If your opponent controls at least 1 Orc or Goblin figure, you may add 3 to your initiative roll.

FOE-HAMMER
When this figure attacks an Orc or Goblin figure, add 1 automatic skull to whatever is rolled.

I'll think on it some more. My main complaint had to do with thinking the overall interpretation of Gandalf was boring. Now that I've looked at it in more detail, I think you're on the right track.

[boromir96]

I'd prefer to see a ranged SA than just a range of "X"

[caps]

Originally Posted by Son of Arathorn

Suppose we tried this for Gandalf:

NAME = GANDALF
GENERAL = AQUILLA
PLANET = ARDA
SPECIES = MAIAR
UNIQUENESS = UNIQUE HERO
CLASS = WIZARD/ISTARI
PERSONALITY = PERCEPTIVE
SIZE/HEIGHT = MEDIUM/5

LIFE = 7
MOVE = 5
RANGE = 1
ATTACK = 4
DEFENSE = 3
POINTS =

POWER OF NARYA
When a Unique Hero you control that is adjacent to Gandalf rolls defense dice against a normal attack, the most wounds that figure may take for that attack is 1.

GLAMDRING
When Gandalf attacks an Orc or Goblin figure, you may add 1 automatic attack to whatever is rolled.

WISE COUNSEL
At the start of each round, immediately after rolling for initiative, you may choose to switch any two unrevealed order markers on any two Army Cards you control.

I think I'm okay with giving Gandalf a Glamdring-based ability, but that one seems bland. Maybe that's okay, but I haven't warmed to it yet.

Here's a different idea for Wise Counsel

After revealing an order marker on Gandolin you may swap that order marker with any other order marker on a figure you control to take a turn with the swapped figure instead.

[White Knight]

About Narya, from the Tolkien wiki:

"For this is the Ring of Fire, and with it you may rekindle hearts in a world that grows chill." - Círdan the Shipwright.

It is described as having the power to inspire others to resist tyranny, domination and despair.

This sounds more like a Valiant bonus. Example:

Narya
All figures within 4 clear sight spaces of Gandalf are considered to have Valiant personalities.

Thoughts on Gandalf
We know from the books that Gandalf can kindle blue fire--and hurled the flaming pine cones at the wolves. He also kindled fire in the trees against the wolves. And he created fireworks.

He also used a Lightning Strike (or at least a flash of light) to kill several goblins in the Misty Mountains.

We also know that he broke the bridge with his staff.


Some possible special attacks:

Blue Fire Special Attack (or Flame of Anor Special Attack)
Range: Special. Attack 3.
You may choose up to 3 trees within 5 clear spaces of Gandalf. All figures adjacent to those trees are affected by Blue Fire Special Attack. Roll once for all affected figures. Roll defense dice separately.

Blazing Strike Special Attack (or Wrath of Anor Special Attack)
Range: Special. Attack: 3.
Blazing Strike Special Attack affects all figures within 2 spaces of Gandalf. Roll once for all affected figures. Roll defense dice separately.

Flame of Anor Special Attack (or Fireworks Special Attack)
Range: 5. Attack: 2.
Gandalf may attack up to four different figures with Flame of Anor Special Attack.

[Yodaking]

Gandalf is a character with so much potential that I could see two version of him getting done. Gandalf the Grey and the White Gandalf.

I like the idea of having significant items all be treasure glyphs, but you will need to make a rule book for HoME that allows UH to hold onto more that one treasure glyph at a time. Otherwise, Bilbo could never have Sting, his armor, & the ring all at one time. Maybe limit it to 3 items in total at a time just to keep it from getting too out of control.

As for the ring, I would not bother trying to represent the corrupting influence of the ring. That transformation occurs by prolonged exposure to the ring and we are talking about representing a small and relatively short battle. How long the people involved were exposed to the rings influence prior to the battle will vary.

[caps]

Originally Posted by White Knight

About Narya, from the Tolkien wiki:

"For this is the Ring of Fire, and with it you may rekindle hearts in a world that grows chill." - Círdan the Shipwright.

It is described as having the power to inspire others to resist tyranny, domination and despair.

This sounds more like a Valiant bonus. Example:

Narya
All figures within 4 clear sight spaces of Gandalf are considered to have Valiant personalities.

I don't feel a strong need to represent Narya in Heroscape if we can't find something that is useful. Having the Valiant personality is not very useful most of the time, so I like SoA's idea better, but we should consider tweaking it some more. Maybe limiting it to attacks from figures who follow Utgar and Valkrill?

[White Knight]

Originally Posted by capsocrates

Having the Valiant personality is not very useful most of the time, so I like SoA's idea better, but we should consider tweaking it some more. Maybe limiting it to attacks from figures who follow Utgar and Valkrill?

I like SoA's Wise Counsel, but I'm not very excited about his Narya ability. It just doesn't seem to match the description of Narya, and it doesn't seem to fit with Gandalf to me. Most of the time, Gandalf fought alone, or told the others to stand back. Narya would force them to cluster around him.

[Joseph Sweeney]

Originally Posted by White Knight

I like SoA's Wise Counsel, but I'm not very excited about his Narya ability. It just doesn't seem to match the description of Narya, and it doesn't seem to fit with Gandalf to me. Most of the time, Gandalf fought alone, or told the others to stand back. Narya would force them to cluster around him.

I personally think Wise Counsel needs work, it definitely has the right idea I just think it isn't powerful enough.

Narya I don't like all that much either, although right now I can't think of an alternative.

Glamdring however, I thought fit in rather well.

Blazing Strike SA: I really like this idea, it gives Gandalf an abiltity to take out a bunch of squadies in one attack, making him both potent and interesting, plus it fits in with the story.

Maybe a Hobbit bonding ability. After all he did manage to get Bilbo on his quest as well as Frodo.

[boromir96]

Some ideas from the previous LotR Project,

Spoiler Alert!

Gandalf-
Follows- Jandar
Species- Maiar
Class- Unique Hero
Type- Wizard
Personality- Inspiring/Tricky
Size- Medium 5

Basic Stats-
Life- 4
Move- 5
Range- 1
Attack- 4
Defense- 5
Points- ???

Special Powers-
Light of the Valar
After moving and before attacking, roll the 20-sided die. If you roll a 16 or higher, all opponents figures within 2 clear sight spaces of Gandalf recieve 1 wound. Figures that follow Utgar and Valkrill affected by Light of the Valar recieve 3 wounds. You may not use Light of the Valar if you use Protection of the Pilgrim this turn.

Protection of the Pilgrim
Before moving, roll the 20-sided die. If you roll a 16 or higher, you may remove up to 2 wound markers from any Unique Hero you control within 3 clear sight spaces of Gandalf.

Careful Planning
When revealing an order marker on Gandalf, you may instead take a turn with one Hero or Squad you control within 6 clear sight spaces of Gandalf.

Gandalf the Grey
Aquilla/Ullar
Maiar
Unique Hero
Wizard
Wise
Medium 5

5 Life
6 Range
5 Move
4 Attack
3 Defense

Arcane Shielding
Gandalf the Grey is unaffected by powers that do not affect large or Soulborg figures.

Glamdring
When Gandalf attacks an adjacent figure who follows Utgar or Valkrill, add 2 to his attack.

Lightning Strike SA
Range 4 Attack 4
If Gandalf inflicts a wound wit3 Lightning Strike, you may chose up to two other figures adjacent to the targeted figure. They are also affected by Lightning Strike. Roll attack dice once, each figure rolls defense dice seprately.

Gandalf the Grey
Aquilla/Ullar
Maiar
Unique Hero
Wizard
Wise
Medium 5

5 Life
6 Range
5 Move
4 Attack
4 Defense

120 points

Arcane Shielding
Gandalf the Grey is unaffected by powers that do not affect large or Soulborg figures.

Glamdring
When Gandalf attacks an adjacent figure who follows Utgar or Valkrill, add 2 to his attack.

Fireball Special Attack
Range 6 Attack 3
When Gandalf attacks with Fireball Special Attack he may attack two additional times

Gandalf the Grey
Jandar

Life- 5
Move- 5
Range- 1
Attack- 4
Defense- 4
120

Human
Unique Hero
Wizard
Wise
Medium 5

Shield of Istari-
When Gandalf rolls defense against special attacks, add 2 to his defense dice.

Glamdring-
Before attacking with a normal attack, roll the 20-sided die. If you roll a 13 or higher, add 1 die to Gandalf the Grey's attack.

Fireball Special Attack-
Range 5. Attack 2.
Choose a figure to attack with Fireball Special Attack. All figures adjacent to the chosen figure are also affected by Fireball Special Attack.

Gandalf-
Follows- Aquilla
Species- Maiar
Class- Unique Hero
Type- Wizard
Personality- Inspiring/Tricky
Size- Medium 5

Basic Stats-
Life- 4
Move- 5
Range- 1
Attack- 4
Defense- 5
Points- 140???

Special Powers-

Protection of the Pilgrim
Before moving, roll the 20-sided die. If you roll a 16 or higher, you may remove up to 2 wound markers from any Unique Hero you control within 3 clear sight spaces of Gandalf.


Light Beam Special Attack
Range special. attack 4
Choose 5 spaces in a straight line from Gandalf,
all opponents figures are affected by Light Beam Special Attack
Roll attack dice once for all affected figures

What about
Lightning Strike Special Attack.
Range 4+ Special Attack 4
If Gandalf inflicts a wound with lightning Strike Special Attack, you may choose up to 2 other figures within 3 clear sight spaces of the targeted figure to be affected by Lightning Strike Special Attack. Roll attack dice for each figure separately.

[Yodaking]

Originally Posted by capsocrates

I don't feel a strong need to represent Narya in Heroscape if we can't find something that is useful. Having the Valiant personality is not very useful most of the time, so I like SoA's idea better, but we should consider tweaking it some more. Maybe limiting it to attacks from figures who follow Utgar and Valkrill?

I didn't realize you guys were planning on shoehorning Middle Earth into the Heroscape cannon. For some reason I just assumed it would be a stand alone game built around the Heroscape gaming format. Making the units and power text compatible with classic scape is fine, but I'd strongly recommend you guys don't put the figures on Heroscape general cards or include any powers that reference the Heroscape storyline. I'd just focus on making a great set of units based on Middle Earth characters, intended for the sole purpose of recreating Middle Earth battles and scenarios. Then mixing them up with Classic scape figures would be a nice bonus.

[caps]

Originally Posted by Yodaking

I didn't realize you guys were planning on shoehorning Middle Earth into the Heroscape cannon. For some reason I just assumed it would be a stand alone game built around the Heroscape gaming format. Making the units and power text compatible with classic scape is fine, but I'd strongly recommend you guys don't put the figures on Heroscape general cards or include any powers that reference the Heroscape storyline. I'd just focus on making a great set of units based on Middle Earth characters, intended for the sole purpose of recreating Middle Earth battles and scenarios. Then mixing them up with Classic scape figures would be a nice bonus.

We've already had a pretty long discussion on this topic and our goal is to be as compatible with Classic 'Scape as C3V.

We will have "alternate generals" that correlate to the 'Scape generals so that we can offer some alternate, LotR themed cards, but we will be designing within the Classic 'Scape context.