The Book of Nightwing (Chris Kent)

[tcglkn]

Need to drop normally from Nightwing's Avatar. Moving normally is only the "movement phase" during a figure's turn. Anything other than that is not moving normally.

[LordVenoc]

I've got the SP's updated here. Just didn't want to ping Ark yet as I'm concerned Nightwing here doesn't actually work as intended. The no stat change was supposed to represent the increased resistance to normal Green Kryptonite, but I forgot about the "can't use their special powers" clause on Green Kryptonite that may just negate that power anyway.

[LordVenoc]

Ok putting it up here for some second opinions. Chris's power here doesn't really work as intended. He's supposed to have increased resistance to Kryptonite, but the Glyph negating powers makes the power not function as intended so that leaves with 2 options:

NIGHTWING'S AVATAR
After revealing an Order Marker on Nightwing and instead of either moving or attacking with Nightwing, you may either move or attack with a figure with the Flamebird's Avatar special power. When Nightwing would be affected by a glyph or special power, you may ignore his species of Kryptonian.

And then doing the same on Flamebird, who is really only immune to Gold Kryptonite (wipes out powers of Kryptonians).

Or just cutting the immunity/resilience stuff entirely a la:

NIGHTWING'S AVATAR
After revealing an Order Marker on Nightwing and instead of either moving or attacking with Nightwing, you may either move or attack with a figure with the Flamebird's Avatar special power.

And again, doing the same on Flamebird. Probably would run a test or two here on Chris with either of them as I know the no defense reduction did come up in his testing (whereas power negating really didn't in Flamebird's).

Thoughts, opinions, preferences?

[tcglkn]

Fine with either option, it's one of those things that to get exactly right would be way too wordy for something that will rarely come up anyways so I am ok slightly improving the ability or just ignoring it.

[Lord Pyre]

I slightly like the first option more. Gives you the thematic immunity in an elegant way. But both are good.

[tcglkn]

Also I would change this Nightwing to just say "this card", I couldn't quite place why this read so weird and I think that's most of it.

After revealing an Order Marker on Nightwing and instead of either moving or attacking with Nightwing, you may either move or attack with a figure with the Flamebird's Avatar special power.

[IAmBatman]

I like the change to ignoring his species. I think that communicates the intended theme better anyway.

[LordVenoc]

Seems like people are on board. I can hopefully try and run a test or two with the change this weekend if people are feeling like that would be a good idea for the change on the two of them. Chris may be losing some effectiveness here and looking back on his win/loss record may actually almost merit a point drop as he was up against stat reducers in 3/4 public games (and still lost those, but that was at 270 vs the current 260). But obviously open to other thoughts there.

[LordVenoc]

Ran 2 quick games with the lost effectiveness against most defense reducers that he was tested against. 2 strong blood baths of Kryptonians getting rocked with him at 250.


C3G STANDARD PLAYTEST FEEDBACK FORM
NAME OF THE TEST UNIT Nightwing Update
Army Test
Map: Conflict Chernobyl
Units: Superman (Family), Flamebird, Nightwing (250), Kelex (40) (1000) Cyclops II, Nightcrawler II, Angel, Jean Grey, Wolverine (1000)
Unit Summary
Damage: Nightwing 6 wounds total (2 with ST).
Abilities: OM removed once with ST, missed 2 attempts with it. 2 attacks from Wolverine, 1 of which original version would have helped.

Spoiler Alert!

General Flow:
R1: Early Optic destruction puts 2 on Supes and 1 on Flamebird. Nightwing shows up and gets a rare 20, costing Mutants a turn. They get locked down to mess with ability to pursue Cyclops.
R2: Kal is thrown into the water and later gripped in place. Nightwing one-shots a whiffing Angel. Jean throws Nightwing low, and then he is killed by Wolverine (old Nightwing would have taken 2 wounds here, leaving him with 2 life left). Kelex pulls his OM to Superman, but Supes is stuck in place. Flamebird can’t get a shield with 2 die rerolled and is killed by Wolverine. Kal botches a punch on Cyclops.
R3: Supes gets a hit on Cyclops (taking a swipe in the process. Cyclops barely kills Superman.
R4: Wolverine kills Kelex.
General thoughts: Trying against a team where the change to Nightwing made a difference. Their movement shenanigans keeps you reminded of how easy Flamebird and Nightwing can be to stymie. Nice when things are hot, but attention leaves them a bit undercooked.

Who won and how many wounds did they have? X-Men win. Wolverine with 1 wound, Jean with 2 wounds, Cyclops with 4 wounds, Nightcrawler unwounded.

_____________________________________________________________

Army Test
Map: Conflict Chernobyl
Units: Superman (Family), Flamebird, Nightwing (250), Kelex (40) (1000) Cyclops II, Nightcrawler II, Angel, Jean Grey, Wolverine (1000)
Unit Summary
Damage: Nightwing 1 auto on Nightcrawler, 1 bonus on Wolverine, 1 with Normal.
Abilities: No OM removal, all wounds came from Wolverine.

Spoiler Alert!

General Flow:
R1: Early move up, not much success for either team.
R2: The Kryptonians get some wounds on Wolverine, but can’t finish him, leaving it open for Wolverine to kill Nightwing and put 1 on Flamebird (Flamebird saved by the extra reroll from the Kelex pull of Nightwing’s revealed marker., additionally throwing Superman.
R3: Cyclops gets 5 wounds, plus 1 from a tree on Superman with Optic Destruction. Superman buts some on Wolverine, but Flamebird gets a bad Flames roll. Rerolls miraculously help Flamebird survive a Wolverine onslaught. She botches it a tad again the next round, setting her up to be offed by Wolverine. Superman finally manages to kill Wolverine, but…
R4: Superman ultimately rolls 6 skulls and 1 blank, dying to Cyclops. Kelex is killed shortly afterward.
General thoughts: Quick rematch again looking at the impact of the change to Nightwing. Blood bath again, this time they just couldn’t crack Wolverine fast enough, so focusing in on him didn’t do much to help the effort.

Who won and how many wounds did they have? Mutants win. Nightwcrawler 3 wounds, Jean, Angel, and Cyclops unwounded.

_____________________________________________________________

[LordVenoc]

I propose we Update Flamebird and Nightwing's Avatar powers to the new text here (Swapping Nightwing/Flamebird as necessary on her):

NIGHTWING'S AVATAR
After revealing an Order Marker on Nightwing and instead of either moving or attacking with Nightwing, you may either move or attack with a figure with the Flamebird's Avatar special power. When Nightwing would be affected by a glyph or special power, you may ignore his species of Kryptonian.

and subsequently propose we update Nightwing's cost to 250 to reflect losing the effectiveness against defense reducers he once had.

@Arch-vile
@Arkham
@Lord Pyre
@MrNobody
@Ronin
@Soundwarp SG-1
@tcglkn

[tcglkn]

Sure

[Arch-vile]

Yea