Sports: NFL

[Dignan]

Originally Posted by Xael Raymand

Last I checked going to 10 Super Bowls was better than going to 8

Cowboys fan here, so I hate both teams in question, but this is a terrible statement. Are you honestly saying you would rather be the Bills (4 super Bowl Appearances) than the Saints (1 with 1 win)? I'm willing to bet people would rather take the championship. The number of times you win is the key, appearances is just a tie breaker (IMO).

[dok]

Wins definitely trump appearances, but sustained excellence trumps isolated championships most of the time. Even before this January I'd have rather have spent the last 35 years as an Eagles fan than a Bucs fan, even if the Bucs did win 1 championship and had a 5-year run of being pretty good.

I suspect that both of the people in this argument were not alive and aware for the first four Steelers championships, and probably not for the first Pats loss, so I'd give the edge to the Pats for their modern run.

(FWIW I'm a fan of none of the four teams mentioned above.)

[Dignan]

Originally Posted by dok

Wins definitely trump appearances, but sustained excellence trumps isolated championships most of the time. Even before this January I'd have rather have spent the last 35 years as an Eagles fan than a Bucs fan, even if the Bucs did win 1 championship and had a 5-year run of being pretty good.

I suspect that both of the people in this argument were not alive and aware for the first four Steelers championships, and probably not for the first Pats loss, so I'd give the edge to the Pats for their modern run.

(FWIW I'm a fan of none of the four teams mentioned above.)

That's a one to really crack. As both a Rangers and Mavs fan, I feel pretty good with the Mavs, and completely heartbroken with the Rangers. The isolated Mavs championship really heals a lot of wounds. It's tough to say if the Rangers have really had more long stretches of being good, but that championship looms large.

[dok]

Sure, it's tricky. "The flag flies forever" and all that. But rooting for a team that is consistently bad is pretty soul-crushing. The Eagles have the 5th best record over the last 30 years, with 17 playoff appearances and no more than 3 losing seasons in a row. The Bucs are 28th (ahead of only the Rams, Lions, Cardinals, and Browns) with long stretches of mediocrity.

[japes]

Growing up I was always a Raiders fan despite living in the Eastern US...and that was because my first Superbowl memory was the 1980 Super Bowl followed by my favorite athlete of all time Bo Jackson. I sort of followed the Eagles after that as well and was a huge Cunningham fan. Growing up military and never having a true home team my football allegiances were never deeper than that. 1999 I decided to move to Florida and I had an actual local team in Tampa and I fell in love with the idea of talk radio and local teams. So I enjoyed the Bucs and their lead-up to their Super Bowl win. But even that wasn't enough to stomach the years that followed...I'd say I would feel better having a consistent winner than just that one win.

[Spidey'tilIDie]

Originally Posted by dok

Wins definitely trump appearances, but sustained excellence trumps isolated championships most of the time. Even before this January I'd have rather have spent the last 35 years as an Eagles fan than a Bucs fan, even if the Bucs did win 1 championship and had a 5-year run of being pretty good.

I suspect that both of the people in this argument were not alive and aware for the first four Steelers championships, and probably not for the first Pats loss, so I'd give the edge to the Pats for their modern run.

(FWIW I'm a fan of none of the four teams mentioned above.)

You'd be wrong. I was born exactly 7 months after the 1975 Super Bowl win, the Steelers first ever. The first Super Bowl I ever watched was the Chicago Bear's annihilation of the New England Patriots. I saw Neil O'Donnell have the worst game of his career when he threw 2 interceptions to the same no name Cowboy. I watched Drew Bledsoe try fruitlessly to lead the Pats against the young gunslinger Brett Favre and a few years later lose his starting job to an upstart rookie who was a part time college starter at Michigan. (At this point I actually liked Tom's underdog pedigree) Then I watched as they went to a few more Super Bowls and win them on the leg of a historic kicker. Then it came out that they had cheated my Steelers out of a shot at the big game (and at that time ring number 5). I was angry, but willing to chalk up the idea that everyone does it and move on. Then a few years later, they get caught again. And Ironically it happens to be in an area where they held a significant statistical advantage over the entire rest of the league. For several years. Always leading the league. With a bunch of no-name rejects at the position in question. (I'm talking fumbles here. Their fumble ration was a full half a fumble less per game than any other team over the same span.) Ironically, if they hadn't been caught with Deflategate, they might have have won the Super Bowl this year since Tom might not have fumbled in the fourth quarter. Basically, my thought is this: If a team is caught once cheating, can I believe that they were caught the first time and give them the benefit of the doubt? Begrudgingly, yes. But caught multiple times, breaking multiple rules? Then I get skeptical. My work with teens and my own life as a young person makes me believe that if you get caught twice, you got away with something multiple times too. I firmly believe that one day it will come out that there were multiple other instances that Belichick and the Patriots "bent" the rules. And I firmly believe it has soured Tom and Bill's legacy as much as Steroids did Barry Bonds and Roger Clemens' legacies.
Lastly, I have seen every Steelers' Super Bowl (wins and losses) multiple times. I take pride in my franchise and the Steeler way. For the record, I believe the Ravens and Cowboys hate us for our success, but I also believe that, to some degree they have tried to emulate the model we have adopted and to a degree found success because of it. (The drafts of Chuck Noll and Jimmy Johnson that set up the respective dynasties of the 70s and 90s are eerily similar, and one would have a hard time convincing me that Raven's recipe of hard-nosed defense, good running game, and capable quarterback is not inspired by their rival Steelers' success. They never had that model as the prior Cleveland Browns.)

[dok]

Originally Posted by Spidey'tilIDie

You'd be wrong. I was born exactly 7 months after the 1975 Super Bowl win, the Steelers first ever. The first Super Bowl I ever watched was the Chicago Bear's annihilation of the New England Patriots.

Well, I did say "probably" on the last part. I was correct that you don't have any real memories of the 1979 championship.

(Truth be told, I didn't look at usernames when asserting that; if I'd seen it was you I might have been a bit more careful, but I got under the wire. You're a couple years older than me. I remember Bears/Pats, but more for the Super Bowl shuffle than for the actual game.)

Originally Posted by Spidey'tilIDie

I saw Neil O'Donnell have the worst game of his career when he threw 2 interceptions to the same no name Cowboy. I watched Drew Bledsoe try fruitlessly to lead the Pats against the young gunslinger Brett Favre

Funny story about that game. There was an over/under contest on ESPN.com (or ESPNet Sportzone or whatever it was back then) that was free to enter. It had 15 or 20 questions, from game-related stuff like "Favre Touchdown Passes" to trivial stuff like "Cajun References in the broadcast" (the game as in New Orleans) or "Number of times Madden says boom". If you won, you got tickets to the next Super Bowl.

I filled it out and didn't think much of it, only to come back and realize I had gotten all but one question right. The winner was the only person to get a perfect score (and I beat him on the tiebreakier, margin of victory). The one question I missed? I took the under on John Madden saying "Boom". Yeah, I'm an idiot. They actually had a little interview with the guy who won on the site, and he said something like "a bunch of them were just random guesses really. There were only a few obvious ones, like the over on John Madden saying boom." Yes, he really said that.

Anyway, that's why I didn't get tickets to see the Elway Helicopter game.

[Spidey'tilIDie]

Originally Posted by dok

Anyway, that's why I didn't get tickets to see the Elway Helicopter game.

Wow. What a game to miss!

[Yodaking]

Originally Posted by dok

Funny story about that game. There was an over/under contest on ESPN.com (or ESPNet Sportzone or whatever it was back then) that was free to enter. It had 15 or 20 questions, from game-related stuff like "Favre Touchdown Passes" to trivial stuff like "Cajun References in the broadcast" (the game as in New Orleans) or "Number of times Madden says boom". If you won, you got tickets to the next Super Bowl.

I filled it out and didn't think much of it, only to come back and realize I had gotten all but one question right. The winner was the only person to get a perfect score (and I beat him on the tiebreakier, margin of victory). The one question I missed? I took the under on John Madden saying "Boom". Yeah, I'm an idiot. They actually had a little interview with the guy who won on the site, and he said something like "a bunch of them were just random guesses really. There were only a few obvious ones, like the over on John Madden saying boom." Yes, he really said that.

Anyway, that's why I didn't get tickets to see the Elway Helicopter game.

That is a great story even if you missed out on the tickets.

[japes]

Originally Posted by dok

Funny story about that game. There was an over/under contest on ESPN.com (or ESPNet Sportzone or whatever it was back then) that was free to enter. It had 15 or 20 questions, from game-related stuff like "Favre Touchdown Passes" to trivial stuff like "Cajun References in the broadcast" (the game as in New Orleans) or "Number of times Madden says boom". If you won, you got tickets to the next Super Bowl.

I filled it out and didn't think much of it, only to come back and realize I had gotten all but one question right. The winner was the only person to get a perfect score (and I beat him on the tiebreakier, margin of victory). The one question I missed? I took the under on John Madden saying "Boom". Yeah, I'm an idiot. They actually had a little interview with the guy who won on the site, and he said something like "a bunch of them were just random guesses really. There were only a few obvious ones, like the over on John Madden saying boom." Yes, he really said that.

Anyway, that's why I didn't get tickets to see the Elway Helicopter game.

Dang...that's a great story regardless.

[Hahma]

Originally Posted by japes

Dang...that's a great story regardless.

Wow, that's a neat story! So close


I once told Tony Dorsett that he couldn't sit next to me while at a Sunday brunch bikini contest in Waikiki........
It was the spring of '89 and I was meeting some friends for the bikini contest at this hotel bar. I got there first and it was crowded, so I grabbed a table at the back, near a bar. This guy wearing shorts, a Polo and a white visor walks up and asks if he could sit at my table. I told him that I was saving it for friends that were on their way. He was cool and said he understood, and then walked over to the bar 10 feet away and leaned on it while waiting for the show. Well it wasn't a couple minutes later that I saw a couple guys go up to him and say "Hey, Tony D, I loved watching you play." Etc. Then I pieced it together and felt like a dork. I told my friends when they came and they laughed. I would never have expected him to walk up and ask to sit at my table. I had watched him play all the time, but didn't expect to see him in shorts, Polo and visor.

I had also gone to 3 Pro-Bowls at Aloha Stadium. The first one, we didn't have tickets for, but tailgated in the parking lot from 8 am to 5pm. One of them I was part of the huge dragon that ran around the field at halftime because it was the year of the dragon. Another one, I got the see Walter Payton's last Pro-Bowl, and got into a massive brawl after the game.

Good times

[Xael Raymand]

Originally Posted by Dignan

Cowboys fan here, so I hate both teams in question, but this is a terrible statement. Are you honestly saying you would rather be the Bills (4 super Bowl Appearances) than the Saints (1 with 1 win)? I'm willing to bet people would rather take the championship. The number of times you win is the key, appearances is just a tie breaker (IMO).

Ehhh the Bills, the Bills don’t even want to be he Bills.

In all seriousness though I was really only kidding with that statement and really was only trying to highlight their sustained success and I think the 10 AFC titles with 14 appearances shows that, Super Bowl wins or not. And if your question is would I rather be the Steelers or the Patriots, the answer is simple I would rather be the Patriots, and I would fully expect someone who grew up loving the Steelers to say they would rather be the Steelers.