C3G Doctor Who Workshop

[Lazy Orang]

Originally Posted by tcglkn

I don't know how I missed this thread but I like a lot of what you are doing here MrNobody. Keep up the great designing.

Yeah, I actively dislike Dr. Who, but he's getting me a little intrigued on mechanics alone.

[MrNobody]

Originally Posted by tcglkn

I don't know how I missed this thread but I like a lot of what you are doing here MrNobody. Keep up the great designing.

Originally Posted by Lazy Orang

Yeah, I actively dislike Dr. Who, but he's getting me a little intrigued on mechanics alone.

Thank you! Obviously I’m biased, but I just think this universe has so much cool stuff to bring to the game.

[MrNobody]

Since Tickle mentioned them, here's where we were with Weeping Angels.

My (incomplete) take

Spoiler Alert!

NAME = WEEPING ANGEL

SPECIES = WEEPING ANGEL
UNIQUENESS = UNCOMMON HERO
CLASS = HUNTER
PERSONALITY = ???

SIZE/HEIGHT = MEDIUM 5

LIFE = 3

MOVE = 0 (Might need to be raised just for gameplay purposes)
RANGE = 1
ATTACK = 5
DEFENSE = 5

POINTS = ???

DON'T BLINK
After an opponent reveals a numbered Order Marker on an Army Card that opponent controls, you may immediately move this Weeping Angel up to 8 spaces. After moving each space with this power, if this Weeping Angel is within clear sight of any figure on that card (The one that an order marker was revealed on) they must immediately end their movement. (maybe a way to ignore elevations so they can't be thwarted by just standing on a hill and looking at them?) If this Weeping Angel ends this move engaged with one or more enemy figures, you may immediately choose one figure this Weeping Angel is engaged with and roll 1 unblockable attack die against that figure. When moving with Don't Blink, this Weeping Angel will not take any leaving engagement attacks.

TOUCHED BY AN ANGEL
Whenever this Weeping Angel would inflict 1 or more wounds on a figure, instead you may choose to remove 1 wound marker from this army card and the player who controls that figure must place it in their start zone. Figures moved with Touched By An Angel will not take any leaving engagement attacks.

A DEFENSIVE POWER

Dysole's take

Spoiler Alert!

Life 2
Move 4
Range 1
Attack 5
Defense 5

100 points

ANGELS
UNCOMMON HERO
LONELY ASSASSINS
MENACING

QUANTUM LOCK
After an opponent takes a turn, you may move all Weeping Angel you control up to 8 spaces. If at any point during this movement, if any figure has clear sight on this Weeping Angel, that Weeping Angel must immediately end its movement. If this Weeping Angel ends its movement next to a figure after using Quantum Lock it may attack that figure roll an unblockable attack die against that figure. You may not place order markers on this Weeping Angel unless Weeping Angels are the only figures in your army. every figure in your Army is a Weeping Angel.

TIME TRANSPORT
If this Weeping Angel inflicts a wound on a figure but does not destroy it, you may remove one wound marker from this Army Card. If you remove a wound marker from this card, you must place the figure in its original start zone. Figures moved by Time Transport never take leaving engagement attacks.


LIVING STATUES
When rolling defense dice against a normal or special attack, this Weeping Angel always adds one automatic shield to whatever is rolled. This Weeping Angel may not receive wounds or be destroyed by any special power which requires a d20 roll.

I like the idea of Quantum Lock but I am afraid it might not be balanced. I also don't like the idea of them being able to be destroyed or wounded by special powers, but I am not sure if that is completely thematic. It could be interesting to treat them as destructible objects.

Karat's take

Spoiler Alert!

Originally Posted by Karat

Well, it is just an example. It of course, can be fine tuned.
It was just a decent metric.

But I could see something kind of like this:

Then I'd probably reuse Stoneskin and then do something like this for their offensive ability.

Or something of the kind. Of course the wording will need some fine tuning, I'm a bit rusty.

I think we're all generally in agreement to ignore all the weird extra rules established in Time of Angels/Flesh And Stone, right? Most in-universe material does anyways.

I think it would be really cool if it was really hard for a Weeping Angel to get close to enemy figures, but if they did, they could do massive damage, maybe even auto-destruction, to represent sending a target back in time.
I like the idea of them being able to move a large amount of spaces every time the opponent reveals an OM, but only 1 space if they're within clear sight of the opponent, like a more extreme version of what Jason does. Maybe make it placement instead of movement so they don't get hung up on height. (It makes sense, a Weeping Angel would be fast enough to climb up a small cliff in the blink of an eye.)

With all of this in mind, how about this take that blends a bunch of our elements?

NAME = WEEPING ANGEL

SPECIES = WEEPING ANGEL
UNIQUENESS = UNCOMMON HERO
CLASS = HUNTER
PERSONALITY = ???

SIZE/HEIGHT = MEDIUM 5

LIFE = 3

MOVE = 0
RANGE = 1
ATTACK = 5
DEFENSE = ?

POINTS = ???

DON'T BLINK
After an opponent reveals a numbered Order Marker on an Army Card that opponent controls, you may immediately place this Weeping Angel within 1 space of it current placement. After placing this Weeping Angel with Don't Blink, if this Weeping Angel is not within clear sight of any enemy figure, you may use Don't Blink again, up to a maximum of 6 times per turn. After using Don't Blink, if this Weeping Angel is engaged with one or more enemy figures, you may immediately choose one figure this Weeping Angel is engaged with and roll 1 unblockable attack die against that figure. When being placed with Don't Blink, this Weeping Angel will not take any leaving engagement attacks.

TOUCHED BY AN ANGEL
When rolling attack dice against a figure for either this Weeping Angel's normal attack or for Don't Blink, if a roll a blank, the targeted figure is destroyed and you may place that figure on this card. At the start of any round, you may remove a figure from this card to remove a Wound marker from this card.

QUANTUM LOCK
You may not place order markers on this Weeping Angel unless every figure you control in play is a Weeping Angel. This Weeping Angel is considered a Destructible Object in addition to what is listed on its card. When defending against a normal or special attack, this Weeping Angel adds 1 automatic shield to whatever is rolled.

The wording sounds pretty customy but hopefully that's something that can be worked on. Are the mechanics at least sound?

[tcglkn]

That's three very wordy powers I'd start to get concerned about card space when reading that design.

[MrNobody]

Originally Posted by tcglkn

That's three very wordy powers I'd start to get concerned about card space when reading that design.

Hmmm...let me have another go through to see what I can cut out.

Spoiler Alert!

DON'T BLINK
After an opponent reveals a numbered Order Marker on an Army Card that opponent controls, you may immediately place this Weeping Angel within 1 space of it current placement. After placing this Weeping Angel with Don't Blink, if this Weeping Angel is not within clear sight of any enemy figure, you may use Don't Blink again, up to a maximum of 6 times per turn. After using Don't Blink, if this Weeping Angel is engaged with one or more enemy figures, you may immediately choose one figure this Weeping Angel is engaged with and roll 1 unblockable attack die against that figure. When being placed with Don't Blink, this Weeping Angel will not take any leaving engagement attacks.
Basically the same, but with one bit of text cut.

TOUCHED BY AN ANGEL
When rolling attack dice against a figure for either this Weeping Angel's normal attack or for Don't Blink, if a roll a blank, the targeted figure is destroyed and you may place that figure on this card. At the start of any round, you may remove a figure from this card to remove a Wound marker from this card.
Instant healing instead of beginning of round healing, makes sense to simplify here

QUANTUM LOCK
You may not place order markers on this Weeping Angel unless every figure you control in play is a Weeping Angel. This Weeping Angel is considered a Destructible Object in addition to what is listed on its card. When defending against a normal or special attack, this Weeping Angel adds 1 automatic shield to whatever is rolled.
Their defensive capabilities could just be represented by a higher base defense. Honestly this whole power could go if absolutely needed.

So that puts us at this;

NAME = WEEPING ANGEL

SPECIES = WEEPING ANGEL
UNIQUENESS = UNCOMMON HERO
CLASS = HUNTER
PERSONALITY = ???

SIZE/HEIGHT = MEDIUM 5

LIFE = 3

MOVE = 0
RANGE = 1
ATTACK = 5
DEFENSE = 7

POINTS = ???

DON'T BLINK
After an opponent reveals a numbered Order Marker on an Army Card that opponent controls, you may immediately place this Weeping Angel within 1 space of it current placement. After placing this Weeping Angel with Don't Blink, if this Weeping Angel is not within clear sight of any enemy figure, you may use Don't Blink again, up to a maximum of 6 times per turn. After using Don't Blink, you may immediately choose one figure this Weeping Angel is engaged with and roll 1 unblockable attack die against that figure. When being placed with Don't Blink, this Weeping Angel will not take any leaving engagement attacks.

TOUCHED BY AN ANGEL
When rolling attack dice against a figure for either this Weeping Angel's normal attack or for Don't Blink, if a roll a blank, the targeted figure is destroyed and you may remove a Wound marker from this card.

QUANTUM LOCK
You may not place order markers on this Weeping Angel unless every figure you control in play is a Weeping Angel. This Weeping Angel is considered a Destructible Object in addition to what is listed on its card.

There's certainly more that could get cut, but this gets them closer to being reasonable.

Don't Blink is certainly still convoluted but I can't really think of a way of dealing with it better.

[MrNobody]

NAME = ACE
SECRET IDENTITY = DOROTHY MCSHANE

SPECIES = HUMAN
UNIQUENESS = UNIQUE HERO
CLASS = REBEL
PERSONALITY = CONFLICTED
SIZE/HEIGHT = MEDIUM 5

LIFE = 4

MOVE = 5
RANGE = 1
ATTACK = 4
DEFENSE = 3

POINTS = ???

NITRO-9 SPECIAL ATTACK
Range 5. Lob 12. Attack 3.
Choose a figure to attack. No clear line of sight is needed. Any figures adjacent to the chosen figure are also affected by the Nitro-9 Special Attack. Roll 3 attack dice once for all affected figures. Each figure rolls defense dice separately. You can only use this special attack once per round.

OMEGA BAT
If Ace rolls at least 2 skulls with her normal attack, Ace may attack again with her normal attack. Ace may continue attacking with her normal attack until Ace rolls fewer than 2 skulls. Ace cannot attack more than 3 times in a single turn.

COMPANION
After revealing an Order Marker on the Army Card of a Unique Gallifreyan Hero you control and taking a turn with that Gallifreyan, if Ace is within 6 clear sight spaces of that Gallifreyan, you may take an immediate turn with Ace, and you may not take any additional turns with other figures you control.

Bio

Spoiler Alert!

Dorothy Gale "Ace" McShane was a companion of the Seventh Doctor.

Initially a brash and reckless teenager, Ace matured significantly into a strong, independent adult over her many years of TARDIS travel and other experiences, who was capable of surviving on her own.

Born on Earth, Ace eventually attended the Academy on Gallifrey, becoming a Time Lord. With this, she was given a TARDIS of her own and she became an agent of the Celestial Intervention Agency.

Nitro-9 was a powerful explosive created by Ace: "just like ordinary nitroglycerin, except it's got a bit more wallop". Ace mixed it herself, and put it inside deodorant cans. Once activated, it had a fuse time of less than 10 seconds.

An early version for her was homemade gelignite, which more resembled plasticine. She used this to blow up the art room at her secondary school, an act for which she was suspended.

Original Post

Spoiler Alert!

NAME = ACE
SECRET IDENTITY = DOROTHY MCSHANE

SPECIES = HUMAN
UNIQUENESS = UNIQUE HERO
CLASS = REBEL
PERSONALITY = CONFLICTED
SIZE/HEIGHT = MEDIUM 5

LIFE = 4

MOVE = 5
RANGE = 1
ATTACK = 4
DEFENSE = 3

POINTS = ???

NITRO-9 SPECIAL ATTACK
Range 5. Lob 12. Attack 3.
Choose a figure to attack. No clear line of sight is needed. Any figures adjacent to the chosen figure are also affected by the Nitro-9 Special Attack. Roll 3 attack dice once for all affected figures. Each figure rolls defense dice separately. You can only use this special attack once per round.

OMEGA BAT
If Ace rolls at least 2 skulls with her normal attack, Ace may attack again with her normal attack. Ace may continue attacking with her normal attack until Ace rolls fewer than 2 skulls. Ace cannot attack more than 3 times in a single turn.

COMPANION
After revealing an Order Marker on the Army Card of a Unique Gallifreyan Hero you control that is adjacent to Ace and immediately after moving that Hero, you may move with Ace. Ace must end this movement adjacent to the chosen Hero.

Bio

Spoiler Alert!

Dorothy Gale "Ace" McShane was a companion of the Seventh Doctor.

Initially a brash and reckless teenager, Ace matured significantly into a strong, independent adult over her many years of TARDIS travel and other experiences, who was capable of surviving on her own.

Born on Earth, Ace eventually attended the Academy on Gallifrey, becoming a Time Lord. With this, she was given a TARDIS of her own and she became an agent of the Celestial Intervention Agency.

Nitro-9 was a powerful explosive created by Ace: "just like ordinary nitroglycerin, except it's got a bit more wallop". Ace mixed it herself, and put it inside deodorant cans. Once activated, it had a fuse time of less than 10 seconds.

An early version for her was homemade gelignite, which more resembled plasticine. She used this to blow up the art room at her secondary school, an act for which she was suspended.

Just a porting over of my design for one of the most combat-oriented companions. I used a Companion keyword power on all my companions that some Doctor cards could reference.

What other companions would people want to see? Here's my short list of the ones I can think of off the top of my head that could fit in the game;

Spoiler Alert!

Susan
Jamie
Sarah Jane (feels like a must-have)
Leela
K9
Frobisher (comics only character, a shapeshifter that usually insists on being in the shape of a penguin)
Ace
Benny Summerfield (extended universe character, archaeologist from the future)
Rose (again, feels like a must-have)
Jack Harkness
Martha
John Jones (a David Bowie parody)
ARC (comics only character, big shapeshifting blob creature)

These are just the ones that I could think of powers for. I also left out any characters that didn't have a presence in either the show or the comics, or ones that I think would have a hard time fitting in to the combat-based system of Heroscape. It would be pretty cool to one day have at least 1 companion for each Doctor.

[Yodaking]

You may need to start posting some bio info on some of these characters. My Who knowledge is pretty limited as is and it covers just parts of the modern Who show. The modern companions aren't really anyone special in terms of training and skill set prior to meeting the doctor as far as I know, just regular humans that step up when thrust into a remarkable situation. As such, unless this companion is much different and was some kind of bad ass military vet prior to meeting the doctor, base attack 4 is too high for her. We have quite a few regular human figures with cards with the base attack of 3 so that would be her ceiling as far as I'm concerned. Just to keep things in perspective, we aren't too far along on the G.I. Joe units yet, but I don't expect too many of them having a base attack higher than 4 and they are the best of the best soldiers trained by the U.S. Government. With a lower attack of 3, I'd then change the multiple attack bat swing to 1 skull required. Or maybe even change it to 1 shield, then if she scores a solid 3 skull hit that's it for the round, but if she rolls less than 3 skulls then their is a pretty good chance for another swing of the bat.

In general terms, I was thinking most of the Companions would be falling in the 60 point Jubilee range, give or take 10-20 points. We're looking at April O'Neil from TMNT to fill a 40 point slot right now and several sidekick types fall in that same 50-80 point range. If this one is one of the more combat oriented ones, then she's be at the top of that range with a card around 80 points or so I would think. With that in mind, I'd advise you just give all the Companions full unrestricted bonding with their Doctors. I recently tried a limited bonding approach for a ~60 point figure of my own and after doing the initial I came to realize it was a bad idea and ended up changing it to full bonding. With small point figures, you are better off just not requiring an OM be placed on them to have an impact. They aren't going to stick around long with Thor & Superman types flying around the board so let them get their swings in while they can.

[MrNobody]

Originally Posted by Yodaking

You may need to start posting some bio info on some of these characters. My Who knowledge is pretty limited as is and it covers just parts of the modern Who show.

That is a good idea. Anything to help make all of this nonsense more accessible to everybody can only be beneficial, and maybe it will allow more people to be engaged. I'll try to either start writing stuff up or copying a brief summary off of a wiki.

Originally Posted by Yodaking

The modern companions aren't really anyone special in terms of training and skill set prior to meeting the doctor as far as I know, just regular humans that step up when thrust into a remarkable situation. As such, unless this companion is much different and was some kind of bad ass military vet prior to meeting the doctor, base attack 4 is too high for her. We have quite a few regular human figures with cards with the base attack of 3 so that would be her ceiling as far as I'm concerned. Just to keep things in perspective, we aren't too far along on the G.I. Joe units yet, but I don't expect too many of them having a base attack higher than 4 and they are the best of the best soldiers trained by the U.S. Government. With a lower attack of 3, I'd then change the multiple attack bat swing to 1 skull required. Or maybe even change it to 1 shield, then if she scores a solid 3 skull hit that's it for the round, but if she rolls less than 3 skulls then their is a pretty good chance for another swing of the bat.

The bat in question was souped up by Gallifreyan technology. There's a semi-famous scene where she wails on a Dalek with it until it blows up, and that's what I was trying to capture. I'd say it's pretty iconic but it only really lasted for 1 story so I'd be fine with ditching the power if it was needed to keep her power level down.

As for Ace herself, she's pretty good at fighting but she's no GI Joe. She spends a very long time with the Doctor, and she's possibly more combat-proficient than your average soldier, but probably not as physically strong. If there's no baseball bat she's probably a 3 attack character.

Originally Posted by Yodaking

In general terms, I was thinking most of the Companions would be falling in the 60 point Jubilee range, give or take 10-20 points. We're looking at April O'Neil from TMNT to fill a 40 point slot right now and several sidekick types fall in that same 50-80 point range. If this one is one of the more combat oriented ones, then she's be at the top of that range with a card around 80 points or so I would think.

I agree with you here. I think there are a few that could break 100 (Jack Harkness for example) but 40-80 is kind of where I'm imagining them too. Ace should be somewhere near the top of that range, so 80 is probably a good target. It would be cool if some of them could serve as cool filler figures outside of Doctor Who armies.

Originally Posted by Yodaking

With that in mind, I'd advise you just give all the Companions full unrestricted bonding with their Doctors. I recently tried a limited bonding approach for a ~60 point figure of my own and after doing the initial I came to realize it was a bad idea and ended up changing it to full bonding. With small point figures, you are better off just not requiring an OM be placed on them to have an impact. They aren't going to stick around long with Thor & Superman types flying around the board so let them get their swings in while they can.

The reason I started with just movement is so multiple companions could all move with a single Doctor, but you have a good point that they wouldn't be too safe to put OMs on. I think it would be cool to do something different from traditional sidekick bonding that would still allow multiple companions to "team up" with a single Doctor.

[MrNobody]

COMPANION
After revealing an Order Marker on the Army Card of a Unique Gallifreyan Hero you control and taking a turn with that Gallifreyan, you may either;

• Take an immediate turn with a figure you control with the Companion special power within 6 clear sight spaces of that Gallifreyan.
• Move up to 3 figures you control with the Companion special power. Any figures moved in this way must end their turn adjacent to that chosen Gallifreyan.

You may not take any additional turns with other figures you control.

How does this 2nd draft of the Companion special power? I'm sure the wording isn't perfect, but this would allow a duo Tardis Team where the companion functions like a standard sidekick, or for a larger Tardis Team where each companion can't do as much every turn, or anywhere in-between.

[Lazy Orang]

Originally Posted by MrNobody

How does this 2nd draft of the Companion special power? I'm sure the wording isn't perfect, but this would allow a duo Tardis Team where the companion functions like a standard sidekick, or for a larger Tardis Team where each companion can't do as much every turn, or anywhere in-between.

Seems very complex for a standard power for the lot of them.

[MrNobody]

Originally Posted by Lazy Orang

Seems very complex for a standard power for the lot of them.

I was afraid of that...I guess it could just always be a standard sidekick power, but that would be a shame IMO. In the show, the Doctor often has two or three companions that travel with him at the same time, unlike Batman and the Robins, where there's usually only 1 Robin at a time. The Doctor, Amy, and Rory (or whoever) should be able to act as a team fairly effectively without the finicky aspects of running two sidekicks.

One alternate possibility could be to simplify the Companion power down to a simpler sidekick bond;

COMPANION
After revealing an Order Marker on the Army Card of a Unique Gallifreyan Hero you control and taking a turn with that Gallifreyan, if Amy is within 6 clear sight spaces of that Gallifreyan, you may take an immediate turn with Amy, and you may not take any additional turns with other figures you control.

and then throwing in extra powers on a few of the appropriate cards. So in this Doctor, Amy, and Rory example, maybe Amy and Rory would both have the Companion power, but Rory would also have some sort of power that tied him in with Amy and maybe even let him take a pseudo-turn when she takes a turn.

I naturally want to plan ahead to be able to run every combination of characters that's ever been in the Tardis together, but I admit most of that is just my blatant fanboyism for the franchise. Not every character would even fit in Heroscape, as much as I may want them to. Maybe it will just be easier for them to be standard sidekicks and worry about the multi-companion scenarios if they ever actually happen.

[Yodaking]

Yeah, I'd worry about the size of the text taking up a lot of room you want to use for individual powers. Is the group of companions thing something that happens in the show or comics? I only know of the 1 doctor, 1 companion dynamic.


*edit* question answered