Valiant Bonus & AE Drop

[Sweetcurse]

Originally Posted by Aldin

nether,

I'm a Bruce Campbell fan, too! (thanks, Homba, for pointing out the sig)

All,

I called WotC on this and the guy on the phone said that the best thing to do is take any army cards you have without the word "VALIANT" on it and white out whatever is there and write in "VALIANT". I'd never considered it, but he pointed out that there is nothing in the rules preventing the modification of army cards. So I said, "Does that mean I can give DW9k a life of nine?" and he said "Who? Listen, I'm just joshing ya - I work in payroll. I was just walking past Pete's desk when I heard the phone ringing..."

~Aldin, joshingly

Scary...

[Eclipse]

Originally Posted by Aldin

nether,

I'm a Bruce Campbell fan, too! (thanks, Homba, for pointing out the sig)

All,

I called WotC on this and the guy on the phone said that the best thing to do is take any army cards you have without the word "VALIANT" on it and white out whatever is there and write in "VALIANT". I'd never considered it, but he pointed out that there is nothing in the rules preventing the modification of army cards. So I said, "Does that mean I can give DW9k a life of nine?" and he said "Who? Listen, I'm just joshing ya - I work in payroll. I was just walking past Pete's desk when I heard the phone ringing..."

~Aldin, joshingly

well played, sir, well played

[netherspirit]

Originally Posted by Homba

(now how fast can you correct the two grammar errors in your sig?)

I follow "Netherspirit's Grammar Rule," (yes, there is only one) and according to that rule there are no grammar errors in my signature.

Netherspirit's Grammar Rule - 1. Netherspirit can punctuate sentences however he wants, but by all means feel free to point any any mistakes you think there are, if you do so netherspirit will feel free to stab you in the eye.

[dnutt99]

How's this for a WOTC question email?
Any Suggestions? Did I cover it all?

Originally Posted by dnutt99

The community at herscapers.com has decided to seek clarification on a matter regarding the 4th Massachusetts Line and the Airborne Elite.

Background Info:
Airborne Elite
The Drop
Airborne Elite do not start the game on the battlefield. At the start of each round, before you place Order Markers, roll the 20-sided die. If you roll a 13 or higher you may place all 4 Airborne Elite figures on any empty spaces. You cannot place them adjacent to each other or other figures, or on glyphs.

4th Massachusetts Line
Valiant Army Defense Bonus
If every Army Card you control has a valiant personality, each soldier in the 4th Massachusetts Line receives 1 additional defense die.

From the heroscape.com FAQ section
If my non-Valiant figures are destroyed, and only Valiant figures are left on the battlefield, can the 4th Massachusetts Line use their Valiant Army Defense Bonus?
Yes.

The question at hand is this.
If you have an army consisting of ALL valiant units EXCEPT for the Airborne Elite, do the 4th Massachusetts Line receive the Valiant Army Defense Bonus if the Airborne Elite have not "dropped" yet.

GROUP A
This group beleives that the 4th Massachusetts DO receive the Valiant Army Defense Bonus. Before the Airborne Elite "drop", there are only valiant units on the board that you control. You do not control the Airborne Elite until they physically are placed on the battlefield.

GROUP B
This group beleives that the 4th Massachusetts DO NOT receive the Valiant Army Defense Bonus. Though they have not "dropped" they are still part of your army and have not been destroyed.

We would appreciate input concerning this matter. We would love for the designers to be contacted at some point to clarify this issue. However we would also like "something to hold us over" until the designers have made a final decision and/or the FAQ on the official site has been updated to reflect an answer to this question.

Thank you in advance for your help in this matter and we at heroscapers.com look forward to your response.

[ej]

Originally Posted by dnutt99

We would appreciate input concerning this matter. We would love for the designers to be contacted at some point to clarify this issue. However we would also like "something to hold us over" until the designers have made a final decision and/or the FAQ on the official site has been updated to reflect an answer to this question.

This part sounds like "we know you're new to this and we will only listen to what Craig says, but it'd be fun to know what screwed up response you could give us until then." Of course, I tend to read into things.

Other than that, well done. Well done indeed.

[Doc_Savage]

I would put the question at the top...

"believe" not "beleive"...


Good work dnutt!

And every time I see your avatar I am reminded how I miss reading Boondocks in the paper every day...

[Homba]

Originally Posted by ej

This part sounds like "we know you're new to this and we will only listen to what Craig says, but it'd be fun to know what screwed up response you could give us until then." Of course, I tend to read into things.

Other than that, well done. Well done indeed.

I think a little more force is needed here. I'll post later, super busy right now. No rush is there?

H

[Homba]

Valiant Army Defense Bonus
If every Army Card you control has a valiant personality, each soldier in the 4th Massachusetts Line receives 1 additional defense die.

GROUP A
This group beleives that the 4th Massachusetts DO receive the Valiant Army Defense Bonus. Before the Airborne Elite "drop", there are only valiant units on the board that you control. You do not control the Airborne Elite until they physically are placed on the battlefield.

GROUP B
This group beleives that the 4th Massachusetts DO NOT receive the Valiant Army Defense Bonus. Though they have not "dropped" they are still part of your army and have not been destroyed.

We would appreciate input concerning this matter. We would love for the designers to be contacted at some point to clarify this issue. However we would also like "something to hold us over" until the designers have made a final decision and/or the FAQ on the official site has been updated to reflect an answer to this question.

I don't like the "something to hold us over" - Wizards hasn't shown the expertise, nor have they the authority, to give us anything worthy of substituting for our own judgment. If we need "something to hold us over," for tourneys or whatnot, let's just post the best arguments for both sides and have a well-advertised formal roll-call vote on it (not a poll) for a sufficient duration that interested persons have the opportunity to vote, and create our own interim ruling.

I'd change your last paragraph to:

Please forward this question to Craig & Rob for a ruling on this issue, and notify us of their reply. We look forward to the Heroscape.com FAQ being updated to reflect the designers' resolution of this matter. Thank you for your assistance.

For your groups A & B, I'd put the statements of belief in terms of the ability text, and highlight the conflicting interpretations of "you control." You are aiming for this I think, I your concluding sentences of A & B, but your language becomes too general. It crystallizes the issue to be very precise:

Gp. A
This group believes that the 4th Massachusetts DO receive the Valiant Army Defense Bonus, because the Airborne Elite Card IS NOT an "Army Card you control" until the Airborne Elite have dropped onto the board. "Army Card you control" means tactical "control" of the card, for example the ability to place order markers on it, and this was the meaning the phrase was intended to convey.

Gp. B
This group believes that the 4th Massachusetts DO NOT receive the Valiant Army Defense Bonus, because the Airborne Elite Card IS an "Army Card you control" until its constituent figures are destroyed. "Army Card you control" means a Card belonging to YOUR army, excluding Cards belonging to a team mate's friendly army, and this was the meaning the phrase was intended to convey.

-------

H

[Omega]

On the very top, in the first line, you spelt this website herscapers.com, you are missing the "o" in heroscapers.com. Also, Doc_Savage was correct, you spelt believe incorrectly ("i" before "e" except after "c" ) also, but other than that that is a very good write up and explains both groups views.

[Cavalier]

Good work dnutt. I also like Homba's suggestions.

[InfinityMax]

Man, six pages for this? I can't even see how this is an issue.

If you play the whole game and the AE never drop, you still lose because you don't control any figures. If you control figures, you can order them. You can't order the AE before the drop, because you don't control them.

So for those people who want to negate Valiant if the AE haven't dropped, I have a question. Namely, if you control them, do you want to rewrite the game so that the game can't end until the AE are gone? Because if you can argue that you control figures you can't use, then you don't lose if you still have undropped AE, because you still control figures.

I don't even see why this necessitates a written question to Wizards. I call for a common sense over-rule.

[zombie prime]

Originally Posted by InfinityMax

Man, six pages for this? I can't even see how this is an issue.

If you play the whole game and the AE never drop, you still lose because you don't control any figures. If you control figures, you can order them. You can't order the AE before the drop, because you don't control them.

So for those people who want to negate Valiant if the AE haven't dropped, I have a question. Namely, if you control them, do you want to rewrite the game so that the game can't end until the AE are gone? Because if you can argue that you control figures you can't use, then you don't lose if you still have undropped AE, because you still control figures.

I don't even see why this necessitates a written question to Wizards. I call for a common sense over-rule.

since when has common sense amounted to anything? if it wasn't for lack of common sense we would have never had suck wonderful discoveries such as, i'm going to eat the white thing that comes out of that chicken!

i think that it is a good idea to send in questions to WotC that are easy so they can gain some credit, cause right now in my opinion they don't have alot of it.

on the other hand, after KMS and the Ninja calls i don't know how much common sense WotC has.