The Book of Atlantean Palace Guards

[IAmBatman]

[johnny139]

They're a Unique Squad too - it's a finite limit on the lifespan of that boost. You can't just grab 2-3 squads and keep them at +4 all the time.

[IAmBatman]

Sure and that helps. They just shouldn’t each be a giant burddn to kill. I suppose auto wound powers help, though.

[Zettian Juggernaut]

Even with 5 defense their staying power wasn't super great, and I never played them against auto-wounds, and looking at LV's, it looks like he didn't either other the Batwoman. Like johnny mentioned, they are a Unique Squad meaning their is only ever 4 of them, so throwing auto-wounds or some solid attacks their direction, their go down.

And like I've already said, I'm not against making changes, but I feel the initial and LV's test isn't enough, so I would like to see another set of tests before making changes.

[japes]

Originally Posted by Yodaking

Yeah, I'm fine with the idea they can boost up the King & Queen's defense pretty high, that just means you have to target the guards first and thus they are serving their purpose. The guards just need to be easier to take down though. Even at one attack per guard, they would absorb 4 attacks that might have been directed at the King or Queen.

Good points.

Originally Posted by johnny139

They're a Unique Squad too - it's a finite limit on the lifespan of that boost. You can't just grab 2-3 squads and keep them at +4 all the time.

Also good point.

Originally Posted by Zettian Juggernaut

Even with 5 defense their staying power wasn't super great, and I never played them against auto-wounds, and looking at LV's, it looks like he didn't either other the Batwoman. Like johnny mentioned, they are a Unique Squad meaning their is only ever 4 of them, so throwing auto-wounds or some solid attacks their direction, their go down.

And like I've already said, I'm not against making changes, but I feel the initial and LV's test isn't enough, so I would like to see another set of tests before making changes.

Sounds fair enough to me.

[IAmBatman]

Sounds like a plan.

[Arkham]

My first question would be, are these guys as strong defensively as Aquaman? If so, I'd just bump points to 170. Both Aquaman I and II end in a 30, so they'd make a nice block either way. Otherwise, you could shoot for 150 or 160 if you want them to make a nice block with either Aquaman combo'd with Mera(who together end in a 40) or either Aquaman, Mera, and Tempest, who end in a 50.

I like the design though, very cool.

[IAmBatman]

I've got the tests all set up. Won't be able to run them tonight, but hopefully by Saturday night at the latest.

[IAmBatman]

C3G STANDARD PLAYTEST FEEDBACK FORM

NAME OF THE PLAYTEST UNIT: ATLANTEAN PALACE GUARDS

Army Test
Map: Custom (About 20% water, none on height)
Units: Aquaman (I) (230), Mera (210), Aqualad (60), Atlantean Palace Guards (140), Sub-Mariner (250), Oracle (110) (1,000) vs Fantastic Four (1,000)

Spoiler Alert!

Round 1: Initiative Atlanteans. Namor leads out, moving to a water space to the side. Aqualad moves up to a water space next to a Jungle Piece. Two Atlanteans move up, with both flanking Namor on water, while the other two move to the front of Aquaman, both on land spaces.

Mister Fantastic hits his full Fantastic Leader roll and the Fan Four comes up strong. Thing moves up near Namor (about five spaces away and on height). Invisible Woman moves adjacent to Thing and blasts a Palace Guard from height, but whiffs. Sub-Mariner doesn’t use Water Avenger, because he can’t reach Invisible Woman that way and doesn’t want to lose height. Human Torch moves up next to Invisible Woman, attacks Aqualad from height, and scores a wound. Mister Fantastic trails behind, moving adjacent to Thing.

Mera moves up next to Aqualad and chooses Human Torch and Invisible Woman for Aquakinesis. She hits Human Torch for a wound and just misses her roll on Invisible Woman. Aqualad leaps up into engagement with all four Fan Four members, but whiffs his attack on Invisible Woman. Two Palace Guards move to flank Mera, one moving to water.

Mister Fantastic only manages to activate one Fantastic Adventurer. He chooses Thing, who KO’s Aqualad. Since the Fan Four are bunched up, Namor skips a Water Avenger movement that wouldn’t result in a wound on Thing. Mister Fantastic KOs the first Palace Guard, but takes a Water Avenger wound for his trouble.

Aquaman follows Oracle’s Secret Attack Plan and takes the space between two Palace Guards vacated by Namor, then attacks Mister Fantastic, netting 7 skulls. Mister Fantastic has height and Invisible Woman’s aura, and blocks 5 of those skulls. No Aqualad around for an activation and no Waterbearer Hand targets and nowhere for the Atlanteans to move to improve their positioning, so there’s no further movement.

Mister Fantastic rounds things out, activating Thing first. Thing takes height next to Namor, who is out of water to have hit Mister Fantastic with Water Avenger. Namor does still have +2 defense from an adjacent Palace Guard and Mera. Thing has +4 attack from height and Clobberin’ Time (3 wounds on Mr. F.). Namor takes three wounds. Mister Fantastic attacks Namor as well, but can’t crack the King’s defense.

Round 2: Initiative Atlanteans (thanks to Oracle). Mera moves forward two spaces, keeping all Atlanteans in her range and keeping one Palace Guard adjacent to her. She can now get the entire Fan Four into her Aquakinesis. She hits Mister Fantastic for a fourth wound this way and Invisible Woman for a first. Two Palace Guards shuffle to leave a water space nearby Mera open and both get adjacent to the wounded Namor.

Mister Fantastic gets his full Fantastic Leader activation. Human Torch tries to catch two Palace Guards and Aquaman in a Supernova, but rolls 2 skulls and nullifies himself for naught. Thing KOs Mera, but takes a Water Avenger wound. Oracle moves Mera’s OM3 to Aquaman. Thing then goes again, for Clobberin’ Time, and KOs Namor. Invisible Woman fails to hit a Palace Guard. Finally, Mister Fantastic fails to hit a Palace Guard.

Aquaman risks a swipe from Human Torch (which fails) to blast Mister Fantastic from water, and KO the Fantastic Leader, taking out OM2. He then moves the last three Palace Guards adjacent to himself.

Aquaman goes again, Water Leaping up to Invisible Woman on land, but failing to hit her. Palace Guards swarm to keep up with him, but only two can move without risking swipes.

Thing goes, and his 3 skulls on 8 dice (height + 1 for Clobberin’ Time) are enough to KO a Palace Guard on a Shadow Tile.

Round 3: Initiative Atlanteans. Aquaman goes, and KOs Invisible Woman by following the Secret Attack Plan. Palace Guards shuffle to keep Thing locked in engagement.

Thing KOs a Palace Guard who is on a Shadow Tile.

Aquaman uses the Power of the Deep to hit Thing for a wound, even from height disadvantage. Then the last Palace Guard blocks Thing’s path to engage Aquaman from height.

Thing rolls 1 skull on his attack and the Palace Guard shrugs it off.

Aquaman rolls 7 skulls and KOs Thing, killing the Fan Four’s OM3. The Palace Guard moves out in front of Aquaman.

Round 4: Initiative Atlanteans. Aquaman hits Human Torch for 3 wounds thanks to Power of the Deep, then the last Palace Guard engages the nullified Human Torch, occupying water.

Human Torch takes height on the Palace Guard, but can’t KO him.

Aquaman uses the Secret Attack Plan to KO Human Torch and end it.

Unit Summary: Great defensive figures. Between their passive defensive boost, their passive movement, and their ability to tie down attackers to force them to attack the Palace Guards instead of the Kings and Queens, the Atlantean Unique Heroes are really freed up to do damage here. A weak Supernova by Human Torch hurt here, but the Fantastic Leader rolls were solid. The Atlanteans just proved too tough. When combined with Water Avenger and Love of Atlantis on a water heavy map, the Atlantean Palace Guards are very, very good. I’d say 160+ based on this test.

• Damage Done (Normal Attack): N/A
• WATER STRENGTH 1: Relevant throughout.
• LOYAL TO THE THRONE: This was awesome for passive movement and getting the Atlanteans into place without formal activations.
• PROTECT THE THRONE: The threat of this mattered more than it, as it made it undesirable to attack any of the Kings or Queens. Combined with Love of Atlantis from Mera, this made the Atlanteans a defensive force.
• Damage Taken: 3 of 4 are taken out.

Who won? List figures remaining in the winning army (include life remaining for heroes): Oracle and Aquaman, each with Full Life, and one Palace Guard survive.

Army Test
Map: Custom (About 20% water, none on height)
Units: Aquaman (I) (230), Mera (210), Aqualad (60), Atlantean Palace Guards (140), Sub-Mariner (250), Oracle (110) (1,000) vs X-Men First Class (1,000)

Spoiler Alert!

Round 1: Initiative Atlanteans. Namor moves up, Aqualad follows, then Water Leaps ahead, in front of a Jungle Piece. All four Palace Guards move up. All the figures just moved except two Palace Guards are now on water.

Professor X activates Cyclops, who Optic Blasts Aqualad for one wound. Iceman attacks Aqualad as well and KOs him. Aqualad, notably, had boosts from water and a Jungle Piece and rolled 2 shields on 10 defense dice over those two attacks. Namor chose not to take any chances to advance, because he didn’t want to give up his water placement.

Mera advances and Palace Guards shuffle around her. Two are adjacent to Namor and all four are adjacent to her. Two Palace Guards and Mera and Namor are on water. One Palace Guard is on land and one on shadow.

Professor X has Cyclops Optic Blast two Palace Guards and Mera. Mera and one Palace Guard block. The other Palace Guard whiffs on 8 defense. Namor moves adjacent to the front-most Palace Guard, staying on water, and still far from Cyclops. Jean throws Mera away from her escort, jungle piece, and water, but can’t wound Mera either through the throw or her attack. Jean’s Psionic Grip stops Water Avenger.

Namor is stymied by Psionic Grip and can’t move to engage any X-Men.

Professor X has Jean fail to throw Mera, but then attack and wound her for one wound. Namor manages to engage Jean with Water Avenger and put one wound on Jean. Cyclops catches Namor and Mera away from their Palace Guard and blasts them for 4 skulls on Optic Blast. Mera falls, Namor takes two wounds, and Jean Psionic Grips Water Avenger to stop it.


Round 2: Initiative Atlanteans. Namor puts two wounds on Jean, bringing her down to one life. She can’t stop all three Palace Guards from moving adjacent to Namor.

Professor X has Jean and Scott go again. Jean throws one Palace Guard away from Namor and in a line for Cyclops. She can’t wound it this way. Fearing an inevitable Water Avenger death, she attacks and fails to hit a well-guarded Namor. Cyclops backs up to full range, and blasts for 4 skulls on Optic Blast, putting 2 wounds on Namor and KOing two Palace Guards.

Namor can’t move, but KOs Jean.

Professor X has Cyclops and Iceman attack now, with Optic Blast failing to net any wounds on Namor or the last Palace Guard, and Iceman failing to hit Namor with a special attack.

Namor flies in and KOs Cyclops. The Palace Guard can’t stay up and stays stationary.

Professor X has Beast and Iceman go after Namor, with Beast whiffing and Iceman KOing Namor.

Round 3: Initiative X-Men. Professor X has Beast and Iceman pursue the stranded Palace Guard. The stalwart sentry holds up well, though, blocking both attacks.

The Palace Guard gets an activation now (the plan was to hope for initiative and move him back to join up with Aquaman, but now that he’s double engaged, he has to attack instead). He attacks Iceman, who blocks.

Beast KOs the last Palace Guard, then Angel moves Professor X up to the middle of the map.

Aquaman moves up quickly on water and tosses a 4 skull attack at Professor X. Psychic Defense X ends the turn.

Professor X sends Iceman and Beast against Aquaman. Using his water bonuses, Aquaman blocks both attacks, despite height disadvantage.

Aquaman uses Water Leap to disengage from Beast and to engage Professor X, then follows the Secret Attack Plan to KO Professor X.

Round 4: Initiative Atlanteans. Aquaman Water Leaps adjacent to Iceman and uses the Secret Attack Plan to score two wounds on the Mutant.

Beast has to go down to Aquaman’s level, but can’t get a wound.

Aquaman hits Beast for two wounds.

Beast hits Aquaman for two wounds.

Aquaman KOs Iceman, stealing OM3, then Aquaman heals a wound.

Round 5: Initiative X-Men. Angel engages from height and puts a wound on Aquaman.

Aquaman follows the Secret Attack Plan to put a third wound on Beast, then heals a wound.

Beast can’t hit Aquaman.

Aquaman can’t hit Beast, but heals a wound.

Angel hits Oracle for a wound.

Aquaman can’t hit Beast.

Round 6: Initiative X-Men. Beast Negotiates an OM off of Oracle, then fails to hit Aquaman.

Aquaman KOs Beast.

Angel can’t hit Oracle.

Aquaman hits Angel for three wounds.

Angel can’t hit Oracle.

Aquaman can’t finish Angel.

Round 7: Initiative Atlanteans. Aquaman follows the Secret Attack Plan to KO Angel.

Unit Summary: This felt like it was going to go in a different direction for a while with Cyclops and Jean countering well and the Palace Guards themselves less effective. But the Palace Guards helping keep the heat off of Atlanteans until they could chip away at key pieces helped push them over the top here. This was a pretty water heavy map, which certainly favored them, but they rolled a lot of poor defense and still came away with a solid victory. Also, this is the type of map that’d warrant using them.

• Damage Done (Normal Attack): N/A
• WATER STRENGTH 1: Useful here, but some poor rolls hurt.
• LOYAL TO THE THRONE: Great for keeping them nearby, but they got stranded when Kings and Queens weren’t activating or out-moved them (like Namor).
• PROTECT THE THRONE: Jean is a great counter to this, throwing them around, and Cyclops hitting multiple targets at once hurts their effectiveness.
• Damage Taken: All four Palace Guards are taken out by the middle of round three.

Who won? List figures remaining in the winning army (include life remaining for heroes): Aquaman with Full Life and Oracle with 3 Life win.

___________________________________________________________

Army Test
Map: Custom (About 10% water, none on height)
Units: Aquaman (I) (230), Mera (210), Atlantean Palace Guards (170), Sub-Mariner (250), Tempest (210), Oracle (110), Healing Energy Spell (20) (1,200) vs Fantastic Four (1,000), Wasp (50), Iceman (150) (1,200)

Spoiler Alert!

Round 1: Initiative Atlanteans. Tempest leads out, using Mystical Tempest to place a water tile on height.

Mister Fantastic hits a 20 for Fantastic Leader, sending Invisible Woman, Wasp, and Human Torch out to height and following behind. Tempest is just out of Human Torch’s range.

Tempest goes again, leaving Mera’s aura but moving to a water tile next to a Jungle Piece and using Mystical Tempest to place another water tile on height next to Wasp and Invisible Woman. He misses both unblockable die rolls, though.

Mister Fantastic rolls a 3 and engages Tempest himself, getting a 3 skull attack. Tempest can’t block, even with Water Strength 2, but does hold it to a single wound thanks to Magical Defense. Water Avenger is just in range, but Namor isn’t on a water space yet, so it doesn’t activate.

Namor advances to the nearer water tile on height Tempest placed. Since they can’t fly the uneven terrain is too much for the Palace Guards and they merely shuffle around to the front of Mera and Aquaman (about 2 spaces each).

Mister Fantastic activates one other figure, choosing Wasp, who locks Tempest into a Daring Decoy situation and also stings him for one wound. Mister Fantastic tries and fails to hit Tempest and then Namor flies in and gives Mister Fantastic one Water Avenger wound.

Round 2: Initiative Atlanteans. Mera moves up and tries Aquakinesis. It fails on Mister Fantastic and may or may not have been able to target Wasp (rules questions there) so I will just say it can’t for now and continue on. The Palace Guards all move up and flank Mera.

Mister Fantastic rolls terribly for leadership again and, stuck by himself, fails to hit Namor from height.

Tempest goes, dropping a water tile next to Invisible Woman, Human Torch, and Mister Fantastic. Human Torch and Mister Fantastic both take wounds.

Mister Fantastic hits a 13 and Wasp and Human Torch both try hitting Tempest. Wasp hits him for one wound. Mister Fantastic tries to finish Tempest off, but fails and takes another wound from Water Avenger.

Tempest places a fourth water tile, KOing Wasp and putting a fourth wound on Mister Fantastic.

Mister Fantastic moves up Thing, but fails to hit Namor with his own attack.


Round 3: Initiative Atlanteans. Tempest places a fifth water tile, finishing Mister Fantastic and hitting Human Torch for a second wound.

Thing goes, but is too slowed by water to reach Tempest, and hits Namor for two wounds.

Namor climbs to height and water, following Oracle’s Secret Attack Plan, and punches Invisible Woman down to one life.

Thing goes full Clobberin’ Time on Namor (10 attack to 9 defense) and KOs him on the first attack.

Mera advances, but fails Aquakinesis on Thing, Human Torch, and Invisible Woman. The Palace Guards surround her.

Thing has height and full Clobberin’ Time and unleashes on the two Palace Guards that just engaged him. Despite their rolling 6 and 7 defense dice, Thing easily KOs both.


Round 4: Initiative Fantastic Four. Thing goes full Clobberin’ Time on Mera and KOs her.

Tempest places his final water tile, KOing Invisible Woman and putting a third wound on Human Torch.

Thing gets +3 attack from Clobberin’ Time due to Human Torch’s 3 wounds and he KOs Tempest and a Palace Guard.

The remaining Palace Guard takes height on Thing and wounds him.

Human Torch flies forward, landing on the water tile on height near the enemy start zone, and attacks Aquaman from height. He can’t hit Aquaman.

Aquaman Water Leaps into engagement with Human Torch, and follows the Secret Attack Plan, but without any water boosts, can only put one wound on Human Torch.


Round 5: Initiative Fantastic Four. Human Torch goes Supernova, but only rolls 3 skulls. He KOs the last Palace Guard and puts one wound on Aquaman.

Aquaman follows the Secret Attack Plan and just KOs Human Torch. Then he heals his wound.

Thing advances towards Oracle.

Aquaman rolls 6 skulls from height, water, and range on Thing and takes Thing down to 1 Life.

Thing engages Oracle and puts a wound on her.

Aquaman just sneaks in a wound to KO Thing, but fails to heal Oracle.


Round 6: Initiative Atlanteans. Aquaman advances.

Iceman advances.

Aquaman takes height on Iceman and hits Iceman for 2 wounds.

Iceman blasts Aquaman for 3 wounds but fails to Deep Freeze him and steal an Order Marker.

Aquaman follows the Secret Attack Plan, but can only put one more wound on Iceman, and then fails to heal himself.

Iceman only rolls 2 skulls but Aquaman somehow whiffs, and is threatening to choke this game away as he is KOed. It’s down to one life Iceman versus 3 Life Oracle.

Round 7: Initiative Iceman, despite Oracle’s +12 to initiative! Iceman Ice Slides forward.

Oracle advances.

Iceman attacks Oracle from range and height and KOs her.

Unit Summary: Despite only having one attack and inflicting one wound, the Palace Guards made their presence known here. Tempest, Aquaman, Thing, and the improbable Iceman were all the shining stars here. The Palace Guards felt fine and worthwhile in their bit part. Some bad luck haunted the Fantastic Four early with a few botched Fantastic Leader rolls, but later gaffs by Aquaman evened out the luck. I’d say the Palace Guards are feeling about right here. They make some already very good figures slightly better and give you more of a reason to play them together.

• Damage Done (Normal Attack): 1 Wound on Thing.
• WATER STRENGTH 1: Useful throughout.
• LOYAL TO THE THRONE: They moved passively throughout again.
• PROTECT THE THRONE: They made a good escort for Mera until they ran into the Clobberin’ Time buzzsaw.
• Damage Taken: KOed by the start of Round 5.

Who won? List figures remaining in the winning army (include life remaining for heroes): Iceman with 1 Life wins.

[IAmBatman]

Got one done. I'll update with the second, but I wanted to give you a chance to respond. They're coming in very strong to me at this point. I could see trying them at a higher point level if you want. I'm not sure their actual stats matter all that much, as even making you waste the attack on them frees up the Atlanteans in a big way.

[Arkham]

Lower defense and range by 1 and raise points by 10?

[IAmBatman]

Originally Posted by Arkham

Lower defense and range by 1 and raise points by 10?

Not sure range is relevant. I know I never attacked with them (or even took a turn with them).