The Book of Yellow Lantern (Mongul II)

[IAmBatman]

That cheesy bonding chain is possible with the SCS as well, so it'd have to be shut off if it were an every turn thing.

I'm leaning towards keeping it once per round and 1 unblockable per marker and seeing how it goes. If someone's full life, they probably don't worry about it, but if they're close to dead and you're rolling 2 unblockables, they might let you. I think that feels about right in terms of theme and power level. You're also getting an attack of 7-8+ with him afterwards and probably a bonding turn with the SCS or someone else.

If it's once per round still, I also don't mind the bonding chain. If it were more than once per round, that'd be a problem, of course.

[IAmBatman]

Updated the SP with this:

Originally Posted by johnny139

YELLOW LANTERN
MONGUL II

WARWORLDER
UNIQUE HERO
WARLORD
CRUEL

MEDIUM 6

LIFE 6

MOVE 5
RANGE 3
ATTACK 6
DEFENSE 6

320 POINTS

YELLOW RING THIEF
Start the game with one yellow Batter Marker on this card. When an adjacent figure is destroyed, you may move one yellow Battery Marker from that figure’s card onto this card. Add one to Yellow Lantern’s Move, Range, Attack, and Defense numbers for each yellow Battery Marker on this card, to a maximum of +2 to each number.

SERVE MONGUL OR DIE
Once per round, before attacking with Yellow Lantern, you may choose an adjacent figure. The player who controls that figure may let you take temporary control of that figure to take an immediate turn with them. If they do not, roll 1 unblockable attack dice against that figure for each yellow Battery Marker on this card.

YELLOW POWER SHIELD
Anytime Yellow Lantern is attacked by an opponent’s figure and at least 1 skull is rolled, instead of rolling defense dice normally, you may remove one yellow Battery Marker from this card and ignore that attack.

SUPER STRENGTH
FLYING

I also like keeping it at one unblockable per, because you could kill multiple SCS (or benefit from multiples of them dying next to him) which both powers up his Power Shield and adds to his unblockables. If you had like 3-4 battery markers on him, the unblockables start getting really over the top, IMO.

Since the design has changed significantly, I want to run the checklists, then I'll put up a new proposal for initial playtesting.

[Karat]

The way I'm reading it you can still have 3+ markers on him but he only benefits from 2 of them.

[MrNobody]

Yep, that’s how it works currently.

[Karat]

Ok cool. Just sounded like Bats was implying a max of 2 markers so wanted to make sure it was working as intended

[IAmBatman]

Originally Posted by Karat

The way I'm reading it you can still have 3+ markers on him but he only benefits from 2 of them.

He only benefits from two of them *in the first power*. He can benefit from having more in uses from the second and third power. That's what I was pointing out.

[IAmBatman]

COMPETITIVE REVIEW BOARD CHECKLIST

Spoiler Alert!

Efficiency- Check to see if your design is providing armies with turns/moves/etc. to a degree that would make it difficult or impossible for an opponent to keep up with your output.

1. Does your design allow itself or figures to move/attack/take a turn/etc. instead of/in addition to your normal turn for revealing an Order Marker? Is it granting these benefits to too broad a range of units? Does it combine with other powers to create overly long or powerful chains of actions?
¬Yes, once per round. It is with a wide array of figures and it can and will create a power chain. We can either cut that off, or let it go as a once per round thing and factor it into his cost. It will be tested for sure.
2. Does your design allow you to take actions during an opponent's turn? Can it combine with other powers to create tediously long reactions to enemy actions or a restrictive environment?
No concerns.
3. Does your design allow you to rearrange your Order Markers or otherwise bypass the costs of Order Marker requirements on the special powers of other figures?
No concerns.
4. Is your design doing anything outside of a player's turn, at the start or end of the round? Is the effect too powerful by itself or when combined with other powers?
No concerns.
5. Does your design have any powers that trigger anytime it moves as opposed to only when it moves normally on its turn? Will it be too efficient when combined with figures that grant extra moves to figures?
No concerns.
6. Is your design adding or subtracting from initiative rolls? Will it pair too easily with other figures that alter initiative or have powers triggering on the results of initiative rolls?
No concerns.

Potency- Check to see if your design is wounding/removing/etc. enemy figures, increasing the chances of other figures in your army doing so, or otherwise directly effecting the number of figures available to players to a degree that would make it difficult or impossible for an opponent to recover from.

1. Does your design have a chance to inflict wounds or destroy figures? Is it getting these chances too frequently or having to high a chance of success? Is the power balanced against expensive targets that can cause a massive swing in the game when destroyed?
Yes, but it’s one unblockable per round per Battery Marker (and you only start with one, but can get more). It also gives the enemy a choice to give you temporary control to avoid the unblockables.
2. Is your design adding to the stats or 20-sided die rolls of other figures in your army? Is it a boosting a broad enough range of units effectively enough to become a 'mandatory' draft or inhibit future design space? Can it be combined with other boosts too easily?
No concerns.
3. Will your design benefit from stat boosts or other enhancement to an overpowering degree? Will it restrict future growth within its faction or point cost by limiting available boosts to others?
No concerns.
4. Does your design take control of enemy figures permanently or temporarily? Is it too difficult to for your opponent to regain control of their figure or recover from the losing the figure? Does the method of taking control expose the enemy figure to the powers of other figures in your army that can easily destroy it?
Temporarily, yes. Control goes back immediately. No exposure concerns that I can think of.
5. Can your design heal itself or others or revive itself or others? Is it doing so in a way that an opponent cannot hope to overcome in certain scenarios?
No concerns.
6. Does your design place enemy figures on its card or otherwise have an unconventional method of temporarily removing enemy figures from play? Will it guarantee your victory against a single remaining enemy figure?
No concerns.

Chicanery- Check to see if your design is preventing your opponent from taking actions with too much ease or is otherwise causing negative play experience through tactics that make your opponent feel you're 'not playing fair'

1. Does your design restrict the movement of enemy figures, or allow you to move enemy figures? Can it do so in a way that results in an unwinnable scenario for your opponent if they are down to one figure, posses only figures with a range of 1, etc.? Can your design easily combine with other figures to greatly impede enemy figures or otherwise gain an excessive advantage?
No concerns.
2. Does your design effect/change the placement of an enemy's Order Markers, or remove their Order Markers entirely? Can it force Order Markers to go onto cards that have no figures on the battlefield? Can your design easily combine with other figures to completely dictate the placement of an enemy's Order Markers or remove all of their Order Markers?
No concerns.
3. Does your design inhibit your opponent from attacking your figures or make attacking a losing proposition? Are there scenarios or combinations that make your opponent totally unable to harm your figures through attacking?
He can potentially build up a few markers for Yellow Power Shield, but that’s a fairly vetted power and getting more than one marker takes work.
4. Does your design directly negate the powers of enemy figures or otherwise ignore them in a way that can completely disrupt the opponent's strategy or leave them feeling like they are stuck playing figures without special powers?
No concerns.
5. Does your design become overly powerful in a podded group of figures, or provide significant benefit to your army without leaving your Start Zone?
No concerns.
6. You can attack your own figures in Heroscape, does your design have any powers that will trigger off of doing so or otherwise wounding/destroying your own figures? Is this intentional on your part? Will the design be too efficient or potent when doing so?
Yes, it’s intentional, no it shouldn’t be too potent.

CONSISTENCY CHECKLIST (SHORT FORM)

Spoiler Alert!

Consistency Concerns
Name and Identity
Verify character is named in a way that is clear, accurate and feels consistent with the way other characters are named.
No concerns.
Uniqueness and Type
Verify that the power text reflects the listed uniqueness and type, that the uniqueness fits the character, and that squad size is listed for squads.
No concerns.
Left Box
If the character's species, class or personality is reused, verify that the character feels thematically consistent with other figures that have that species, class or personality. If they are not reused, verify that there is no pre-existing species, class or personality that would make more sense.
No concerns.
Size and Height
Verify that the listed size and height are accurate. Standing the mini up next to a stack of tiles, and a few other minis of various sizes, is encouraged.
No concerns.
Super Strength and Flying
Verify that these special powers are present if they make sense, and not if they don't.
No concerns.
New Powers - Names
Verify that any new powers are not using power names identical to, or very similar to, pre-existing powers. Verify that any new powers are actually new and not old powers with new names.
No concerns.
New Powers - Effects
Verify that the effect and timing of all new powers is clear. Verify that any logical immunities, benefits, or weaknesses (whether those be necessary for thematic or mechanical reasons) are implemented: consider whether defensive powers that work against normal attacks should also work against special attacks, whether or not a power has an elemental component that some figures should resist, and whether or not unliving figures (such as Undead and Androids) should be affected.
No concerns.
Reused Powers
Verify that the design is reusing special powers in place of creating new ones (and, where relevant, reusing power markers in the place of creating new ones), where reused special powers (or power markers) could implement the same theme and mechanics with no differences or only trivial differences. Verify that any reused special powers have the correct text.
No concerns.
Power Level
Verify that the character's movement, attack, range, and defense (in conjunction with any special powers that enhance those stats) feel consistent with the capabilities of characters with analogous powers and abilities. Verify that the character falls into a similar point range to characters with comparative powers and abilities.
No concerns.

[IAmBatman]

I went ahead and added language to cut off turn chains. I don't really want that to be what this is about.

I think his power level has significantly increased compared to what was in the SP before, when his powers were mostly negative. Toying with the calculator, I want to start him at 390 and go from there.

I propose we move back to Initial Playtesting.

[MrNobody]

Yea

Personally it seems fine w/o the "no additional turns" language. All that slapping that boilerplate on there does is make me want to use him with SCS slightly less, which kinda feels against the point here.

[tcglkn]

Yea, glad we added no additional turn language here. Seems like an important thing to stay on top of.

[IAmBatman]

Originally Posted by MrNobody

Yea

Personally it seems fine w/o the "no additional turns" language. All that slapping that boilerplate on there does is make me want to use him with SCS slightly less, which kinda feels against the point here.

You'll want to use him with any figures likely to generate Battery Marker sources for you. You could just restrict yourself to other Unique Heroes like Sinestro who can give you a nice turn of two, but it's not like having an SCS die near him is bad at all. And they're easier to fit in, in terms of points.

[Tornado]

Yea