Heroscape Counting Coup

[legoboy]

I was reading a thread in another area and came to the realization that massive FFA battles aren't always won by the player who "kills" more of his opponents than the other players. Frequently, the player who wins a FFA is just the one who sat back and let everyone else do the killing. I wanted to come up with a method of playing FFA games that prevents that. I'm going to outlibe it below, and revise that based on my own experiences and on any opinions I feel make sense. I would love your feedback, actually, I hope you offer some. If you like this idea, feel free to try it out yourself.

Heroscape Counting Coup

Instead of playing using traditional kill 'em all rules, or scenario specific rules, keep track of the points that you kill. You can play whole card, which is scored only after all the figures on a given card are destroyed (when the final wound is put on a hero) or partial card, where each figure is worth the total of the card divided by the number of figs on the card. Glyphs if used count as 25 points. Wiping an opponent out would receive a bonus, perhaps 50 points.

I think I'll try this out using a hybrid model, where each figure destroyed is worth a value, but the final figure is awarded a bonus. For example, each of the first two Krav Maga score 30 points to the figure who destroys them, but the third scors as 40, the total point value of the card.

I think one advantage of this method is that it forces players to seek out battle while a second is that the game can be set to run a certain time or round limit. You can see who accumulates the most points in an hour and a half.

I don't know. Has anyone else tried something like this? Anyone have other opinions on this style of play?

[personwholives]

Yes. This is pretty much how I always play 3 player. The only weird thing in it is what to do with "regenerating" squads (dividers, anything marro with the hive around). Except (unlike yours) I just do a straight up 1/X of the card value per figure, so we don't have to think a lot about "who killed what last" and such. Works really well, keeps the game moving. Forces my opponents into the fray.

Some things we decided:
When playing regenerating units (I played dividers last), you take the points from an opponent and put them back on the field. My opponents thought it should be random, I liked the idea of using it to pick on the leader. Decide for yourself which you prefer (we all agreed that having them count repeatedly just penalized me for having them, while rewarding my opponents for no good reason. Since we play these types of games with a random draft deck, we agreed this was the most fair approach).
When suiciding a figure, you get no points for it. When killing your own figures with flail hurricane or whatever, you get no points. Otherwise, you just go dive in the lava and take the free points to your score, especially at the end if it'll give you the win. This also counts for accidents, like when a stinger drain roll fails (the points are simply lost).

[infectedsloth]

I like the emphasis on being offensive, but I'm not so keen on getting more points for finishing off a squad or hero it seems to encourage the use of commons, which already have an advantage. I do like your suggestion for getting extra points for finishing off someone.

My suggestion would be that you get more points for finishing in an higher position, for example if you finished first you would get 100 extra points, second 50 extra, third 25 extra and fourth 0 extra points. Adding that ruling helps guards against the possibility off someone dieing first but still getting the win, which I don't think should happen if at all possible. If would also force you to not only kill figures but also survive for awhile (or at lest longer then some other people).

[akden]

Dad_Scaper ran a recent multiplayer tournament in Maryland using similar scoring rules:

Multiplayer Madness

ClanCampbell has also run a couple of tournaments prior to that one, with a similar format.

The rounds consisted of 3- or 4-player matches with partial card scoring. When time was called (each match ran an hour or so), you tallied up the points of damage you inflicted and were given a certain amount of "victory points" based on who had the highest total points. The tournament winner was based on the highest number of victory points. Even if you were eliminated from a match completely, you could win the match if you inflicted more damage or destroyed more units than your opponents. This really encouraged players to go out and attack rather than sitting back and waiting for their opponents to knock each other off.

The way we played there, healing/regenerating units just offered more points to players (you could end up getting more points than the unit initially cost if it kept healing and you kept damaging it). Also, units that destroyed themselves (ie., wolves of Badru) offered no points if they died as a result of their special ability.

The format was a lot of fun and made people think twice about bringing their high-cost units (Q9 was worth a lot of points per wound inflicted ). It also reduced turtling because the object was to outscore your opponent, rather than outlast him/her.

It was my first experience with a multiplayer format that seemed to work well. I'm used to two players unofficially ganging up on one player or someone sitting back while the other two destroy each other. I'd definitely recommend giving it a try.

[lefton4ya]

Nice idea, just takes a lot of effort to mark down what you kill after every turn, and that just seems like too much work for my taste.

Some other ideas:
Three-player free-for-alls: how to structure them
End game dragging....

Originally Posted by lefton4ya

See Three-player free-for-alls: how to structure them. My advice (what I do in multiplayer games):

• In FFA games at the end of the round if you attacked at least one figure in the round, roll a 20-sided die to try to either bring back a squad member or remove a wound from a hero (but not resurrect a hero).
• In 4+ player games, if you attack one player the round you need 16 or higher, if you attack figures from two players you need a 11 or higher, and if you attack figures from three players you need a 6 or higher.
• In 3-player games (or after a 4+ player is down to 3 players), if you attack one player the round you needed 16 or higher, if you attack figures from two players you need a 11 or higher.
• Once it is down to 2 players, the resurrection/heal roll goes away.
• It makes the game last longer but stops turtling, and people go out of their way to attack 2 or 3 different players a round. Truces still form between 2 players but they don't last long (say until a dragon or Q9 from another player is dead).
• You could also try instead of requiring someone to just attack an opponent, they must wound them, because sometimes people would attack knowing they wouldn't wound just to get the bonus. But even making people attack others still prevents turtling.

Ideas from Official Scenarios:

Spoiler Alert!

A Toxic Mist:
At the end of every round, the deadly gas is one level higher. (At the end of Round 1, the gas covers level 1 and all water spaces on the board. At the end of Round 2, it also covers all of level 2, and so on.) The gas cannot rise above level 5.
At the end of each round, all figures in the gas take 1 wound. Figures are not affected by the gas during the round, only at the end.
- OPTIONALLY add:
Water is still toxic. If a figure is left in the water at the
end of the round, it takes 1 wound automatically.
All Sand spaces are Quicksand. Figures must roll 11-20
on one die roll to move out of any quicksand space
otherwise it becomes stuck in that space until another
turn. If a figure is left in a Quicksand space at the end
of a round, it takes 1 wound automatically. Figures with
double-hex bases are too heavy to travel through
quicksand and will sink and die crossing any quicksand
space.

Searing Pass:
Special Rules: At the beginning of the 2nd round, the player
who wins initiative immediately places a molten lava tile on
any space within 5 spaces from the center molten lava tile.
This space cannot contain a glyph, a water tile, a molten lava
tile, or a figure with the “Lava Resistant” special power. Molten
lava tiles are placed at the beginning of every round thereafter,
until all 10 lava tiles have been used. Any figure occupying the
space where a molten lava tile is placed is instantly destroyed
and removed from the battlefield.
- OR
Special Rules: At the begining of round 2, each player rolls
three combat dice in intiative order. For each skull rolled, place
a molten lava tile adjacent to any Lava Field Tile or Molten
Lava Tile. This space cannot contain a glyph, a water tile, a
Molten Lava Tile, a Lava Field Tile or a figure with the “Lava
Resistant” special power. Molten Lava Tiles are placed at the
beginning of every round thereafter in intitiative order, until all
10 lava tiles have been used. Any figure occupying the space
where a Molten Lava Tile is placed is instantly destroyed and
removed from the battlefield.

The Gawds Must be Crazy:
SPECIAL RULES: At the end of the round, after the
last order marker is revealed and the turn taken,
remove the entire high level of the battlefield. Any
figures, ruins, and glyphs on this level are
destroyed.
The only tiles that will not be removed are water
and sand tiles on level 1. When these are the only
tiles remaining, players fight to the death on the
remaining tiles. No more tiles are removed.

Deadly Wall of Water:
At the end of Round 3, and at the end of every round afterwards until the Deadly Wall of Water floods the Montiqua Ledge, the last player to take a turn rolls the 20-sided die. The Deadly Wall of Water floods the Montqua Ledge if:
At the end of round 3, a 1-4 is rolled
At the end of round 4, a 1-8 is rolled
At the end of round 5 and every round afterwards, a 1-10 is rolled
If the water floods the ledge, all figures on level 1 are destroyed. At the end of any following rounds all figures that accupy these spaces will also be destroyed.

[akden]

Originally Posted by lefton4ya

Nice idea, just takes a lot of effort to mark down what you kill after every turn, and that just seems like too much work for my taste.

Agreed. That was the biggest downside.

In some of the games we played, we just kept the figures we destroyed until the end of the match. The only thing you had to really keep track of was the number of wounds you put on the heroes. At the end of the match you just added everything up and gave the figures back.

I also wrote down the cost of each of my individual units/wounds for everything in my army and carried it with me from match to match. That way, I could tell my opponents what each unit was worth at the end.

The math did get a little long sometimes, but it was still a pretty fun time.