The Book of Master Splinter

[Arkham]

Running some 1 on 1 tests.

Game 1 against Leo:

R1T2: Leo attacks Splinter and takes 1 wound from BB. Attacks again, Splinter uses auto-shield to only take 1 wound.
R1T3: Splinter kills Leo after rolling 3 skulls, Leo botches defense, and takes an additional wound from BB, killing him.

Splinter with 1 wound.

Game 2 against Leo:

R1T3: Leo attacks Splinter, Splinter uses auto-shield to block attack. Splinter then blocks 2nd attack.
R1T3: Splinter attacks Leo, causes 1 wound, and then 1 addiitonal wound from BB.
R2T1: Splinter attacks Leo for 2 wounds, using the auto-skull.
R2T1: Leo attacks Splinter for 1 wound, but then Leo is killed by BB.

Splinter with 1 wound.

Game 3 against Leo:

R1T2: Leo puts 2 wounds on Splinter with Splinter using auto-shield, then Leo takes 1 wound from BB. Attacks Splinter again, kills him.

Leo with 1 wound.

Game 4 against Leo:

R1T2: Leo attacks Splinter for 1 wound, Splinter used auto-shield, Leo takes 1 wound from BB. Attacks Splinter again for 1 wound, and takes 1 wound from BB.
R2T1: Leo attacks Splinter, Splinter it's blocked. Attacks again for 1 wound on Splinter, but takes 1 wound from BB.
R2T1: Splinter attacks Leo, it's blocked, but puts 1 wound on with BB.
R2T2: Leo attacks Splinter but it's blocked, attacks again and Splinter uses auto-shield to block.
R2T2: Splinter attacks Leo, it's blocked, but finishes him off with BB.

Splinter with 3 wounds.

Game 5 against Leo:

R1T2: Leo attacks Splinter, Splinter uses auto-shield to block. Leo attacks again for 2 wounds, but takes a wound from Splinter's BB as well.
R1T2: Splinter attacks Leo for 2 wounds on a botch, and an additional wound from BB.
R1T3: Leo attacks Splinter but it is blocked. Attacks again for 1 wound, but then is destroyed by BB.

Splinter with 3 wounds.

That's 5 games, where Splinter went 4-1. That's without his Father's Devotion power coming into play at all. It's also worth noting, Splinter won initiative in almost every game, which led to him being attacked by Leo first due to not getting close enough to attack yet. So with Leo getting the first jump on Splinter first in 4 out of 5 games, which is ideal for him, he still lost 4 out of 5 games.

You should have nothing to worry about in the current version as it pertains to how often he's beating the Turtles.

I think with the latest version suggested(not the added MMA stuff), with the once per round dice manipulation, you've got a decent design that accomplishes what you want. No reason to endlessly search for more stuff to tack on or change.

[Lazy Orang]

Originally Posted by Arkham

Running some 1 on 1 tests.

That's 5 games, where Splinter went 4-1. That's without his Father's Devotion power coming into play at all. It's also worth noting, Splinter won initiative in almost every game, which led to him being attacked by Leo first due to not getting close enough to attack yet. So with Leo getting the first jump on Splinter first in 4 out of 5 games, which is ideal for him, he still lost 4 out of 5 games.

You should have nothing to worry about in the current version as it pertains to how often he's beating the Turtles.

I think with the latest version suggested, with the once per round dice manipulation, you've got a decent design that accomplishes what you want. No reason to endlessly search for more stuff to tack on or change.

Excellent! That assuages my big concern remaining - thank you so much chap. I'm good with that latest version now then.

I would like to apologise if I've been difficult lately - I'm stressed about some other things, have felt as though this design has been like wading through treacle and really want to see one of my favourite characters done justice to. I'm sorry if I've been a pain in the arse.

[Arkham]

I just think you're psyching yourself out by trying to make things 100% perfect all the time, as if you can control something like that in a game with a heavy reliance on luck. There's no way to guarantee win percentages etc. I've had Oracle beat Volstagg before.

Just rest assured that the design as-is, has Splinter easily pulling his own weight combat wise, and will make a solid support figure. No reason to overthink it to such minute levels of thematic detail.

[quozl]

Ah, good! Glad to see I was wrong about the 1 on 1 battles.

[Lazy Orang]

Originally Posted by Arkham

I just think you're psyching yourself out by trying to make things 100% perfect all the time, as if you can control something like that in a game with a heavy reliance on luck. There's no way to guarantee win percentages etc. I've had Oracle beat Volstagg before.

It's not really that - I have no issue with Leo beating Splinter, I just didn't want to see us back to those first few tests I ran where Splinter won about 2 out of 10 duels. I've had occasions where characters have won battles they really shouldn't (I remember one time a custom Sherlock Holmes beat the crap out of Hasbro Thanos, much to my brother's chagrin ... and now I feel I can confirm that yes, the Superman story in my Codex interview is absolutely real...). I think you might be right about the thematic minutiae, though - I feel like this is possibly a character I care too much about. I can see what Tornado meant about feeling as though he didn't trust himself to design Judge Anderson now... Still, I feel like we're homing in on something good now, and as though I'll be really happy when he's done - for more than one reason!

[japes]

Originally Posted by quozl

I think everyone thinks it's overpowered but they're tired of arguing with you about it.

Not sure if I think it's OVERpowered but as I've stated at least 5 times in this thread, I think, I think it's got more power than people are giving it. If Splinter doesn't roll a single skull on any attack he still has the potential to lay down several wounds.

[Tornado]

I can see what Tornado meant about feeling as though he didn't trust himself to design Judge Anderson now...

I am glad my folly has been insightful for someone else.

You came around a lot faster than I. It took years for me to come to that conclusion.

[Lazy Orang]

Originally Posted by Tornado

I am glad my folly has been insightful for someone else.

You came around a lot faster than I. It took years for me to come to that conclusion.

I wouldn't say you were foolish at all - I'm just seeing I now know what you mean about it being possible to care too much about a character.

That being said, now I'm here, I certainly don't want to abandon this or hand it over, particularly since it seems like we're finally getting somewhere good. Hopefully this will be a learning experience for me in case I ever design another character I'm this attached to (not sure who that would be, though ). I'd also like to say that, as frustrating as this has been, it has been an immense honour to be able to design for C3G such an iconic character and one who I loved back when I was a kid, and I just hope that I've been/I'll be able to do him justice.

That being said, this is what I think we're moving forward with now, which people seem to be happy with:

MASTER SPLINTER

RODENT
UNIQUE HERO
SENSEI
WISE
MEDIUM 4

4 LIFE
MOVE 5
RANGE 1
ATTACK 4
DEFENCE 6

230 Points?

THE WAY OF NINJITSU

Once per round, after any attack dice, defense dice, or the 20-sided die is rolled for Master Splinter or a Ninja Turtle you control, you may add or subtract a skull, shield, or 4 from that roll.

FATHER'S DEVOTION

Once per round, when either an Order Marker is removed from the card of a Ninja Turtle you control or when a Ninja Turtle you control is destroyed, you may place any unrevealed Order Markers from that card on this card. When a Ninja Turtle you control is destroyed, for the rest of the round, when Splinter attacks, he may attack one additional time.

BREAKING BALANCE

When attacking an opponent's adjacent figure with a normal attack, or when defending against a normal attack from an adjacent figure, if the opponent rolls more skulls than shields and Master Splinter is not destroyed, you my inflict a wound on that figure. Tiny and Huge figures are not affected by Breaking Balance.

[Tornado]

Looking good.

[Lazy Orang]

@Arkham , if I run a test for this guy on Monday to make sure he's feeling right to me, could you finish the Initial? I'll hit this guy properly in the public, just feeling a bit drained by him at the moment. Might take a little while off, actually, catch up with personal customs and recharge myself a bit.

[Arkham]

I still have to do the initials for Mera. I can commit to a game for him. You can of course throw in my Leo solos as well.

[Lazy Orang]

Originally Posted by Arkham

I still have to do the initials for Mera. I can commit to a game for him. You can of course throw in my Leo solos as well.

Thanks, chap!