The Pre-SoV Workshop

[Shadowking]

Hello again,
Have this hero I’ve been working on recently and potentially would like to submit to the SoV:

Mostly wondering if the movement ability may cause any issues. An alternate along the lines of “after attacking, you may move a number of spaces equal
to your move minus the number of spaces you already moved” also works, but is less clean overall.
Thanks!

[Scytale]

Yeah, Smoke Rider does not work; adding an attack into the middle of movement will cause all sorts of problems. You also cannot change it to the way you suggested later, as normal movement distances are not set and can be modified by things like roads, whereas special movements (which this extra movement must be) are set distances.

If you want this to work, you need to do a special attack like Ninjutsu Barrage Special Attack. I don't like how that would play with Parting Shot, though, nor do I like it on the unit as-is. Just allow for multiple attacks with the special attack to make up for it. It simplified the card nicely.

[Myriadite]

Just an idea, would using PASSING BLOW, DISENGAGE, and making her base attack ranged create a similar effect?

PASSING BLOW
Once while moving normally, Yaseiha may choose a small or medium figure that she was not engaged to at the start of this turn. When Yaseiha leaves engagement with that figure, you may roll the 20-sided die. If you roll an 11 or higher, the chosen figure receives one wound. Yaseiha cannot attack the chosen figure on this turn.

I realize that it basically becomes Arthur of Sherwood 2.0, but perhaps it's another direction that can be modified for this design.

[Shadowking]

Originally Posted by Scytale

Yeah, Smoke Rider does not work; adding an attack into the middle of movement will cause all sorts of problems. You also cannot change it to the way you suggested later, as normal movement distances are not set and can be modified by things like roads, whereas special movements (which this extra movement must be) are set distances.

If you want this to work, you need to do a special attack like Ninjutsu Barrage Special Attack. I don't like how that would play with Parting Shot, though, nor do I like it on the unit as-is. Just allow for multiple attacks with the special attack to make up for it. It simplified the card nicely.

I misworded it in the original post but you can make the value equal to the base move on the card and have it work right? “Move a number of spaces equal to 8 minus the amount of spaces you moved this turn”. I did actually do a search to see if I could find anything that obviously messed up the ability to attack in the middle of moving and somewhat surprisingly didn’t actually turn up anything (though I can certainly believe I missed some interactions, and I think it would have the potential to “break” a lot of potential future designs that could otherwise work). But yeah a special attack replacing both powers would work and retain 95% of the same gameplay I think - something along the lines of Halushia’s Ride By Special Attack with some modifications seems pretty good for this?

EDIT: I think using the route similar to Arthur could also work, but I think the melee wants to be the harder-hitting so may cause more issues with a d20 power bypassing defence/wouldn’t really be able to safely inflict more than a single wound.

[Shadowking]

OK, largely based on Halushia, think I have mostly figured it out with this? (don’t have access to the renderer right now):

Yaseiha
Utgar

5 Life
8 Move
4 Range
2 Attack
3 Defense
110 points

SMOKE RIDER SPECIAL ATTACK
Range 1. Attack 4.
Instead of moving and attacking normally with Yaseiha, you may move Yaseiha up to 8 spaces. Yaseiha can attack an adjacent figure with Smoke Rider Special Attack at any point before, during, or after this move as long as Yaseiha is on a space where she can end her movement. After attacking a figure with Smoke Rider Special Attack, figures from that Army Card cannot make leaving engagement attacks against Yaseiha this turn.

PARTING SHOT
After using Smoke Rider Special Attack, if Yaseiha moved at least one space this turn and isn't engaged, she may attack one additional time with her normal attack.

ROLLING MOVEMENT
(same)

[Scytale]

Yeah, that works. Though it does feel unnecessarily complex to have both Smoke Rider and Parting Shot.

[Shadowking]

Originally Posted by Scytale

Yeah, that works. Though it does feel unnecessarily complex to have both Smoke Rider and Parting Shot.

Do you think there is a viable/easy way to roll the two into one power/SA? The “fantasy” of her being able to ride in, strike, and then throw a “parting shot” kunai/knife into the enemy as she goes is I think something fun to try and retain capturing with her card.

[kolakoski]

Well met!

After some back and forth with Scytale, this is the nerfed version of Captain Xue that seems acceptable for a Bonding Hero:

Pathfinder Battles Iconic Heroes #4,
Lirianne, Half-Elf Gunslinger

CAPTAIN XUE
General: Utgar
Race: Human
Uniqueness: Unique Hero
Class: Captain
Personality: Ruthless
Size: Medium 5
Life: 5
Move: 5
Range: 5
Attack: 3
Defense: 3
Points: 120

DOUBLE ASSAULT
When Captain Xue attacks an adjacent figure or destructible object, she may attack one additional time.

HAND CANNON
When Captain Xue attacks an opponent's figure, you may choose an opponent's Common figure adjacent to that figure. If the defending figure receives any wounds from Captain Xue, the chosen Common figure receives 1 wound.

My question is whether this design is unique enough and contributes enough to be considered for the SoV. What we have come up with looks a lot like my last SoV submission:

Kha and Captain Xue look like they'd have similar play styles. Captain Xue may be a bit overpriced . . .

[Blue Trails]

Originally Posted by Shadowking

Do you think there is a viable/easy way to roll the two into one power/SA? The “fantasy” of her being able to ride in, strike, and then throw a “parting shot” kunai/knife into the enemy as she goes is I think something fun to try and retain capturing with her card.

You might be able to achieve your desired fantasy by tweaking Smoke Rider SA as follows.

SMOKE RIDER SPECIAL ATTACK
Range 1 + Special. Attack 4.
Instead of moving and attacking normally with Yaseiha, you may move Yaseiha up to 8 spaces. Yaseiha can attack up to 2 times with Smoke Rider Special Attack at any point before, during, or after this move as long as Yaseiha is on a space where she can end her movement. When attacking with Smoke Rider Special Attack, Yaseiha may add 3 to her Range if she has previously attacked the defending figure this turn. After attacking a figure with Smoke Rider Special Attack, figures from that Army Card cannot make leaving engagement attacks against Yaseiha this turn.

[Scytale]

That version of Captain Xue doesn't look balanced. In melee she can kill four figures a turn, and then bond with good squads.

[kolakoski]

Well met!

@Scytale et al., I give up on Xue being a Captain or a Pirate. I think Inherited Loyalty links her to the figures I want it to without requiring a nerf of Empress Xue.

Pathfinder Battles Iconic Heroes #4,
Lirianne, Half-Elf Gunslinger

EMPRESS XUE
General: Utgar
Race: Human
Uniqueness: Unique Hero
Class: Empress
Personality: Ruthless
Size: Medium 5
Life: 5
Move: 5
Range: 5
Attack: 3
Defense: 3
Points: 120

HAND CANNON
When Empress Xue attacks an opponent's figure, you may choose an opponent's Common figure adjacent to that figure. If the defending figure receives any wounds from Empress Xue, the chosen Common figure receives 1 wound. When Empress Xue attacks, she may attack 1 additional time.

INHERITED LOYALTY
If any Monk, Ninja, or Samurai figure you control within 4 spaces of Empress Xue rolls attack dice for a normal attack, you may reroll 1 die that was not a Skull. If any Monk, Ninja, or Samurai figure you control within 4 spaces of Empress Xue rolls defense dice, you may reroll 1 die that was not a Shield. If any Monk, Ninja, or Samurai figure you control within 4 spaces of Empress Xue rolls a 20-sided die, you may add 1 to your roll.

[Scytale]

Taking away bonding removes the balance concern, but I just can't see a half-elf gunslinger as an Empress of historical Asian figures.