Race for the presidency political discussion thread - Page 238

Aldin · #**2845** November 5th, 2008, 05:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bannister

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drumline3469

Being gay is just as sinful as murder which is just as sinful as lying. They are all the same and we all are guilty of sinning. We have to love each other and support each other so that we can turn away from the sin and live the fulfilled life that God intended... I am not discriminating against anyone, yet I am an extremely religious person. Yeah, I don't condone what the homosexuals do, nor do I condemn them. They are still people and no less or more than I. But I still want to help them see that what they do is wrong. If they don't accept my help, then so be it, I tried. I'm not going to force by beliefs on anyone, but never will I hesitate to share them.

Then you are a bigot.

Bannister

Bannister,

Did you both read the definition of bigot which you posted and the post Drumline just made? Where's the intolerance?

~Aldin, wondering if an intolerance for bigots makes one bigoted

Bannister · #**2846** November 5th, 2008, 05:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drumline3469

Then you are a bigot.

Bannister

As is everyone according to you, especially yourself... *sigh*[/quote]

Please, Do tell.

Bannister

Fourshadow · #**2847** November 5th, 2008, 05:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gulp

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drumline3469

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roland

Your argument relies on one believing in a God though Drumline, I am looking at this solely from the states perspective on the matter.

With no God, any action can be easily tolerated as there is no universal belief... It is absurd to look at issues out of the context of the world we live in today. There are no anti-homosexual movements that are going that do not involve some form of God. Religion is where we get our basic morals. Who said it was wrong to kill? Who said it was wrong to steal? Survival of the fittest, correct? If you want to ignore God's set morality in some aspects, why not make laws to ignore it in all aspects?

Sigh, if you stay in this thread long enough it just starts repeating itself.

Religion got its morality from people. People weren't nonchalantly killing and stealing from each other for fun. There would have been no cities.

If we got our morality from the Bible, this country would look like Pakistan, not the good parts either.

Nope, from God--that's why it's called 'religion'.

Roland · #**2848** November 5th, 2008, 05:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aldin

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roland

As far as the state is concerned a marriage should be a union between two peoples that decide that they wish to take on the economic burden of living in America together.

As far as a church is concerned marriage should be between two people who love each other and wish to spend their lives together in happiness and raise a family.

What does the State get out of that arrangement? It already allows for Partnership entities formed as businesses. Also, why should the State confine the relationship to two people?

Should a church promote unions of persons who are not members of that church or do not adhere to its doctrine? Should it accept a family structure that violates the precepts of the religion?

~Aldin, probingly

A church, as a private sector can and does determine who it will and will not marry, and it's members, and what it recognizes as a family according to the Bible, and should continue to do so. The state gets the knowledge that it is treating all peoples equally, no matter race, religion, or sexual preference.

I say between two people because the state sees a marriage as between two persons, not two or more, if a time comes about, or hypothetically if laws were in place defining marriages between more than two people, along with the benefits gained from such a union, then I would support it as well.

Drumline3469 · #**2849** November 5th, 2008, 05:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bannister

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drumline3469

Then you are a bigot.

Bannister

As is everyone according to you, especially yourself... *sigh*

Please, Do tell.

Bannister[/quote]

Well, your intolerance for bigotry makes you a bigot as Aldin pointed out. As well as your seemingly high intolerance for religious beliefs. You don't have to have a religion to be a bigot. Atheists can sometimes make the biggest bigots of them all.

Bannister · #**2850** November 5th, 2008, 05:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aldin

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bannister

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drumline3469

Being gay is just as sinful as murder which is just as sinful as lying. They are all the same and we all are guilty of sinning. We have to love each other and support each other so that we can turn away from the sin and live the fulfilled life that God intended... I am not discriminating against anyone, yet I am an extremely religious person. Yeah, I don't condone what the homosexuals do, nor do I condemn them. They are still people and no less or more than I. But I still want to help them see that what they do is wrong. If they don't accept my help, then so be it, I tried. I'm not going to force by beliefs on anyone, but never will I hesitate to share them.

Then you are a bigot.

Bannister

Bannister,

Did you both read the definition of bigot which you posted and the post Drumline just made? Where's the intolerance?

~Aldin, wondering if an intolerance for bigots makes one bigoted

I am sorry?

Last time I checked no one was using their religious beliefs to stop them from worshipping and or believing whatever their religous tome tells them is truth.

It takes a biblical twist to now start calling me a bigot for pointing out the bigotry in their statments.

Bannister

Roland · #**2851** November 5th, 2008, 05:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drumline3469

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roland

The basic laws are based off the Ten Commandments sure, but in the crimes you list their is a victim, who is the victim of homosexual marriage? You? Me?

There isn't one.

Who is the victim in lust? Who is the victim in envy (as long as it doesn't end in robbing or murder)? There are several sins in which there is no victim outside of yourself.

Did I ever say lust and envy were illegal? No they are not, because they are victimless. If you see them as being such, more power to you, but keep your religion out of my government, and I will keep my government out of your religion.

SuperflyTNT · #**2852** November 5th, 2008, 05:23 PM

Imax, there is a victim in gay marriage provided they have children. My best friend was married to a woman whose 2 best friends are lesbians. They have a daughter and she is a MESS because of all of the ridicule she's had to endure.

There is indeed bigotry in the world, not just the US, and the one thing that a majority of people can agree on being bigoted about is this: They all don't like homosexuality, en masse.

Bannister · #**2853** November 5th, 2008, 05:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drumline3469

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bannister

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drumline3469

Then you are a bigot.

Bannister

As is everyone according to you, especially yourself... *sigh*

Please, Do tell.

Bannister

Well, your intolerance for bigotry makes you a bigot as Aldin pointed out. As well as your seemingly high intolerance for religious beliefs. You don't have to have a religion to be a bigot. Atheists can sometimes make the biggest bigots of them all.[/quote]

I don't care what religion you are or are not.

What you are saying is biggotry. If you want to call me a bigot for pointing it out go right ahead.

Bannister, Who goes to church with his wife every sunday.

InfinityMax · #**2854** November 5th, 2008, 05:24 PM

Churches can do whatever the want. If a church wants to say gay is illegal, then gay dudes can go to a different church. That's called freedom of religion.

But marriage is a legal arrangement, and using your religion to block another person from freedoms you enjoy is bigotry. You can hoot and holler about how you're protecting the moral integrity of the nation, but that's a high-handed justification for disgusting bigotry. Your morality is different from another person's morality. What you think is sin is not a sin to another person, and you have no right to dictate your religion to that person.

We shake our heads and are sad that not 50 years ago, people honestly believed that black kids should not have been allowed to go to school with white kids. Fifty years from now, everyone will be amazed that this country ever allowed open bigotry to block gay marriage.

Aldin · #**2855** November 5th, 2008, 05:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bannister

I am sorry?

Last time I checked no one was using their religious beliefs to stop them from worshipping and or believing whatever their religous tome tells them is truth.

It takes a biblical twist to now start calling me a bigot for pointing out the bigotry in their statments.

Bannister

Hunh? I wasn't calling anyone a bigot - if anything, that comment was directed at myself, not you. I simply couldn't see any intolerence in the particular post you used to label Drumline a bigot.

~Aldin, twisting in the wind

Drumline3469 · #**2856** November 5th, 2008, 05:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roland

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drumline3469

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roland

The basic laws are based off the Ten Commandments sure, but in the crimes you list their is a victim, who is the victim of homosexual marriage? You? Me?

There isn't one.

Who is the victim in lust? Who is the victim in envy (as long as it doesn't end in robbing or murder)? There are several sins in which there is no victim outside of yourself.

Did I ever say lust and envy were illegal? No they are not, because they are victimless. If you see them as being such, more power to you, but keep your religion out of my government, and I will keep my government out of your religion.

I found a better one for you... Who is the victim in prostitution?