The Book of Wonder Twin (Zan)

[tcglkn]

I did err on slightly stronger forms for Jayna because she's so easy to negate and has no defensive powers to go with her attack and movement powers.

[tcglkn]

Also she transforms into more strange creatures and I want her options to be different from Changeling. I don't think comparing Python to Sea Serpent is accurate either, as one is massively bigger. The only one that seems off to me is +3 vs +2, but it's an Ostrich vs Rabbit.

[LordVenoc]

Originally Posted by tcglkn

Also she transforms into more strange creatures and I want her options to be different from Changeling. I don't think comparing Python to Sea Serpent is accurate either, as one is massively bigger. The only one that seems off to me is +3 vs +2, but it's an Ostrich vs Rabbit.

Oh my issue is by no means the damage or the dice roll. Merely similar effects happening in different phases with a trade off happening on one and a potential boon happening on the other.

[IAmBatman]

Oof, I played Griffin wrong as I definitely let her attack after using it. So I'd lean towards their cost going down as is.

[tcglkn]

Yea that was another change I made after my pre-initial change because I found that quickly became the default and always gave her height.

[IAmBatman]

I didn't think it was the default with that just because you'd rather have the extra movement initially (at times at least) and you'd often rather have the Sea Serpent (especially once you already have height) in order to try to sneak an auto-wound in.

[tcglkn]

Originally Posted by LordVenoc

Oh my issue is by no means the damage or the dice roll. Merely similar effects happening in different phases with a trade off happening on one and a potential boon happening on the other.

I see what you mean about the tradeoff and them being in different phases. Both myself and Bats liked the option to do that before moving. I could make it an instead of moving power.

• Sea Serpent: instead of moving, choose an adjacent figure and roll the 20-sided die, adding 4 to the roll if the chosen figure is on or within one space a water space. If you roll 14 or higher that figure receives a wound.

[IAmBatman]

Yeah, I'm down with it as instead of moving. It makes no impact on my tests, because she's low life enough that if she's already engaged, you usually are locked in position when choosing to use Sea Serpent, so you're unlikely to move after using it unless it hits and ends the engagement (and I never hit on it).

[tcglkn]

SP updated. Do you think we can test them at 80 points each (160 total) moving forward @IAmBatman ?

[IAmBatman]

Yeah they felt close before (though I misplayed Griffin). With the changes, 80 each seems worth a shot.

[tcglkn]

Cool, I'll roll with that for the next test and see how they perform

[MrNobody]

C3G STANDARD PLAYTEST FEEDBACK FORM

NAME OF THE PLAYTEST UNIT: Wonder Twins

Army Test 1
Map: Conflict Chernobyl (No Glyphs)
Units: Team 1 (800): Wonder Twins (160), Green Arrow II (210), Black Canary (190), Superboy (Kon-El) II (240)
Team 2 (800): Incredibles

Pre-game thoughts: N/A

Summary of the game:

Spoiler Alert!

Round 1: T2 wins initiative
-Canary inflicts a wound on Bob
-GA inflicts 2 wounds on Bob with 2 attacks

Round 2: T1 wins initiative
-Zan launches himself like a missile at Bob and Helen, dealing no damage but turning himself into a Glacier
-Superboy inflicts a wound on Violet with Something To Prove (off of Jayna’s attack)
-Canary inflicts a wound on Violet with a Cry
-Bob inflicts 2 wounds on Canary
-Zan turns back to human form

Round 3: T1 wins initiative
-Jayna accidentally inflicts a wound on Zan with fire
-Bob inflicts a wound on Canary
-GA inflicts a wound on Bob
-Bob takes out Canary
-T1 had OM3 on Canary, so they lose a turn
-Bob takes out Zan

Round 4: T1 wins initiative
-Superboy takes out Violet
-GA inflicts a wound on Bob
-Bob inflicts a wound on Superboy
-Superboy takes out Bob
-GA inflicts 2 wounds on Helen
-GA and Superboy combine attacks to inflict 2 wounds on Helen
-Helen inflicts a wound on Superboy

Round 5: T2 wins initiative
-Dash inflicts a wound on Superboy
-GA takes out Helen
-T2 had OM2 and OM3 on Helen, so they lose those turns

Round 6: T2 wins initiative
-GA inflicts a wound on Dash
-Superboy inflicts a wound on Dash

Round 7: T2 wins initiative
-GA takes out Dash


Special power usages:
Jayna’s Normal attack: 0 wounds inflicted
Movement (Ostrich): 1 uses
Movement (Griffin): 1 uses
Movement (Sea Serpent): 0 uses
Attack (Elephant): 0 uses
Attack (Gorilla): 1 uses
Attack (Yeti): 0 uses

Zan’s Normal attack: 0 wounds inflicted
Ice Missile: 0 wounds inflicted
Form of Water: Turned into a Glacier using Ice Missile in R2

Who won? List figures remaining in the winning army (include life remaining for heroes): Jayna (0/5 wounds), Green Arrow (0/4 wounds), Superboy (3/5 wounds)

Post-game thoughts: I think the Incredibles gave it their best shot, they’re just a grade below the JL as a faction currently. Elasti-Girl being able to tie down Superboy helped a ton, but they still were just outmatched. The twins didn’t do a huge amount here, but they did see some action and getting the cheap markers was really nice.

___________________________________________________________

Army Test 2
Map: Modified Grundy’s Grave
Units: Team 1 (840): Wonder Twins (160), Aquaman III (370), Wonder Woman III (310)
Team 2 (840): Grodd II (285), Joker IV (245), Bomb Queen (200), Heat Wave (110)

Pre-game thoughts: Trying something Super Friends-y here.

Summary of the game:

Spoiler Alert!

Round 1: T1 wins initiative
-Bomb Queen immediately takes out Zan, and inflicts 2 wounds on Jayna

Round 2: T1 wins initiative
-Wonder Woman burns a marker
-Aquaman inflicts 2 wounds each on Bomb Queen and Heatwave
-Bomb Queen inflicts a wound on Wonder Woman
-Bomb Queen inflicts a wound on Aquaman
-Aquaman inflicts a wound on Heat Wave
-Bomb Queen inflicts 2 wounds on Wonder Woman

Round 3: T2 wins initiative
-Wonder Woman burns a marker
-Bomb Queen takes out Heat Wave and inflicts a wound on Aquaman

Round 4: T1 wins initiative
-Wonder Woman burns a marker
-Aquaman inflicts 2 wounds on Bomb Queen
-Wonder Woman inflicts 3 wounds on Grodd
-Bomb Queen inflicts 3 wounds on Aquaman
-Aquaman is perfectly set up for an ultimate Kraken roll on all 3 remaining enemies…
-But he botches his roll and gets killed by Joker instead
-Bomb Queen inflicts 2 wounds on Wonder Woman

Round 5: T2 wins initiative
-Bomb Queen takes out Wonder Woman
-T1 loses their whole round with all their OMs on Wonder Woman
-Grodd takes out Jayna


Special power usages:
Jayna’s Normal attack: 0 wounds inflicted
Movement (Ostrich): 0 uses
Movement (Griffin): 1 uses
Movement (Sea Serpent): 0 uses
Attack (Elephant): 0 uses
Attack (Gorilla): 0 uses
Attack (Yeti): 0 uses

Zan’s Normal attack: 0 wounds inflicted
Ice Missile: 0 wounds inflicted
Form of Water:

Who won? List figures remaining in the winning army (include life remaining for heroes): Gorilla Grodd (3/6 wounds), Joker (0/6 wounds), Bomb Queen (4/5 wounds)

Post-game thoughts: Everything was so perfectly set up for Aquaman. 5 wounds, it’s his turn, and the enemy is clumped up enough that he can hit them all at once. Then...bam, he rolls a 5 on his first roll and gets killed. I laughed pretty hard. (NOTE: I played RTK! as stopping once Aquaman was killed.)

Also a pretty stellar performance for Bomb Queen here, who was punching way above her weight class with solid rolls.

Wonder Twins were definitely lame ducks here, but they’ll always provide some utility just as cheap marker additions.

___________________________________________________________

THOUGHTS ON THE TESTED UNIT'S COST, BALANCE, & DRAFTABILITY: I think they can probably come down a bit. They’re just not really sticking around long enough to do anything valuable.

GENERAL THOUGHTS ON THE TESTED UNIT: They're interesting. Lots of complexity and tricks for a pretty bargain price, but in both my games they died before they really could do anything worthwhile with those tricks.

Zan is definitely the more useless of the two - I really felt the lower defense in both games. Ice Missile is cool though.

Here you go!