Movies: What did You Watch Last Night?

[japes]

Originally Posted by Tornado

The casino represented a bigger picture. The rise of the little of guy.

What happened in the moment is secondary to what it sparked.

I missed this last line and admittedly...sure I could buy that given what the last scene showed but seriously...probably could have been done differently without the extra 45 minutes of "story".

Admittedly I've been one of those people that proclaimed that every "really rich" person got that way by doing something at least shady at some point to get ahead...but I grew up extremely poor and I was young. As an adult I know that it is possible to be successful without being a bad guy. The whole portrayal that every one of the rich people on this resort planet were dirty was a little black and white 80's cartoon for me and the reality is that there is no black or white...it's all grey...heck even ole Ben Solo has his reason's for who he is, they at least didn't come out and say I'm Kylo Ren because I want to be evil. Maybe no one else gets his reason but it is a reasonable thing to him.

Spoiler Alert!

In his mind Luke tried to kill him...and then someone tells him you can't trust the Jedi...of course he's going to join the Dark Side since in his experience that guys telling the truth...because he did trust a Jedi once and he almost killed him.

There aren't many "bad guys" in the world that decide they want to be bad. Most think at least in their mind they are doing something that needs to be done...Are you a Rebel or a Freedom Fighter? Depends on what side you are on.

Republic breaks down and the Empire emerges...some people oppressed feeling people decide to form a rebellion. Eventually the win and take things back. Now you have the New Republic and there are a generation of people that don't actually remember the old Republic as they were born well after the Empire was started and their family was on the Emperors good side. Now they are the ones feeling oppressed and remembering the good ole days of the Empire so the First Order starts it's own "rebellion" against the New Republic...

that's the way it goes...

[quozl]

Originally Posted by japes

There aren't many "bad guys" in the world that decide they want to be bad.

I guess that depends on how you define bad. If bad is caring only about yourself, there are quite a few people in this world who decide they want to be bad.

But anyways, that discussion should be in another forum.

[Grimnak]

Originally Posted by quozl

Grimnak is not talking about tracking the Falcon. He's talking about tracking the ship Leia is on at the end of Rogue One and at the beginning of Star Wars. I think it's a Corellian Corvette.

Didn’t think I’d spark so much conversation! But yes, I was referring to the Corellian Corvette (Tantive IV). There is no way this ISN’T a plot hole. The Empire tracked through hyperspace, so this wasn’t “new technology.”

I can’t find it right away, but someone also tried to pass the kamikaze off as “taxing” for the Resistance because it was a larger ship. Large ship or not, it destroyed an entire fleet - that’s completely ridiculous and Johnson should have known better.

Finally, someone mentioned that Canto Bight should have used Podracers instead of horses. I 100% agree, and I was even thinking along those lines in the theater. Another missed opportunity to make Canto Bight at least somewhat relevant.

[Raider30]

Just a quick two cents here. While I found I had multiple problems with the movie I didn’t actually see anything wrong with the kamikaze scene. I guess I rationalized it as working because the big rebel ship didn’t just crash into the fleet while at cruising speed, it had ramped up and was jumping into lightspeed. Thus the extra oomph when it came to the damage done.

Force equals mass X acceleration and all that physics stuff.

- Raider30

[Hahma]

I watched Bright on Netflix last night. It was enjoyable for the most part.

I don't know what they spent $90 million on though, that cost seems excessive for what it was.

I thought the cussing was excessive. I don't mind swearing in movies, but sometimes it can be excessive to the point of not making its use meaningful. It's like in how some types of music is laced with swearing, which to me is lazy and uncreative writing.

I think that Bright would have been well served to have about 5 to 10 minutes at the very beginning, dedicated to giving background to how this world came to be, kind of like at the beginning of the Fellowship of the Ring.

But I do like the world they created, in taking fantasy elements and make them part of the modern world, as in being part of our world from the beginning and not like it "just" happened in recent years.

[quozl]

Originally Posted by Grimnak

I can’t find it right away, but someone also tried to pass the kamikaze off as “taxing” for the Resistance because it was a larger ship. Large ship or not, it destroyed an entire fleet - that’s completely ridiculous and Johnson should have known better.

It didn't. They still had plenty of ships to attack the planet with.

[Yodaking]

Originally Posted by Hahma

I watched Bright on Netflix last night. It was enjoyable for the most part.

I don't know what they spent $90 million on though, that cost seems excessive for what it was.

I thought the cussing was excessive. I don't mind swearing in movies, but sometimes it can be excessive to the point of not making its use meaningful. It's like in how some types of music is laced with swearing, which to me is lazy and uncreative writing.

I think that Bright would have been well served to have about 5 to 10 minutes at the very beginning, dedicated to giving background to how this world came to be, kind of like at the beginning of the Fellowship of the Ring.

But I do like the world they created, in taking fantasy elements and make them part of the modern world, as in being part of our world from the beginning and not like it "just" happened in recent years.

I enjoyed Bright as well. It didn't knock my socks off, but it wasn't a disappointment at all either. I also agree that a 5 minute history of this world lesson to start the movie would have been a good idea. They sprinkle in some references here and there about some distant past event that is still relevant to the current events but we still don't really know what happened or when (did the orcs side with the dark lord in WWII, WWI, Civil War, Dark Ages?). Maybe they haven't fully fleshed out the backstory yet and wanted to leave it vague for a possible prequel at some point. An orcs as nazi's movie with the Hitler role being filled by an evil magic using elf could be a fun riff on a WWII movie.

[Yodaking]

Originally Posted by Grimnak

I can’t find it right away, but someone also tried to pass the kamikaze off as “taxing” for the Resistance because it was a larger ship. Large ship or not, it destroyed an entire fleet - that’s completely ridiculous and Johnson should have known better.

I'm honestly still not following your issue here with the scene. Unlike the ridiculous Star Killer Base, the science behind the move is sound. Is it the question of why it has never happened before?

Since the X-wing is a pretty small one manned fighter with a hyperdrive system I do now wonder why they don't have hyperdrive powered unmanned missiles. But that issue dates back to the original trilogy, I always thought it was strange they gave such a small ship a hyperdrive. It made the hyperdrive seem less special and complex to not require a larger ship to preform deep space travel.

[Grimnak]

I suppose my issue with the scene is that it opens up the possibility for numerous other times in the timeline where that would have been more effective than fighting. Why not just suicide a ship into the Death Stars, any star destroyers in your way, or things of that nature. It opens up too many plot holes. (Plus, I don’t think it’s realistic either, but that’s a different matter.)

[japes]

Originally Posted by Grimnak

I suppose my issue with the scene is that it opens up the possibility for numerous other times in the timeline where that would have been more effective than fighting. Why not just suicide a ship into the Death Stars, any star destroyers in your way, or things of that nature. It opens up too many plot holes. (Plus, I don’t think it’s realistic either, but that’s a different matter.)

But telekinetic guys in cloaks with laser swords that's realistic...I don't think anyone has every accused Star Wars of being Hard Sci-Fi.

But yeah hyperdriving into the Deathstar does feel like one of those times where it would have been a good idea...but how about this argument against it...No very many battle commanders ever think to suicide bomb their vehicle...it's just not a tactic that is taught. They did allude to Admiral Purple Hair as being some outside the box or aggressive type of commander so maybe she was just the type of person with the opportunity to be in command of a ship capable of doing this. Heck maybe she didn't even know if it would work. She was beyond desperate...I have lots of issues with this movie but this isn't one of them.

[Yodaking]

Well outside of Islamic Terrorist and Japanese Kamikazi's, warriors generally adhere to the 'live to fight another day' mantra. So taking a fully staffed capital ship and killing everyone on board just to take out one bigger Empire ship wouldn't really be a go to option for most fighters. Furthermore, it becomes a question of resources. The Rebel Alliance has perhaps 10-15% of the total number of ships and troops the Empire has, so even if you managed a 3 to 1 return on each ship sacrificed the Empire would still have over 50% of their fleet in play once all the Rebels were all gone along with the means to replace those ships lost.

Japes brings up a good point on the Death Star though, if Luke had failed to destroy it with a couple of photon torpedo's, having Admiral Akbar hyperdrive his big capital ship into the Death Star would have been an acceptable solution to the problem.

[Spidey'tilIDie]

You are getting your references crossed. I am pretty certain that the X-Wing is an exception, Tie Fighters do not have Hyperdrives, nor do A-Wings, I believe. Remember in Star Wars (episode 4 is Star Wars, not a New Hope, IMO), only the best pilots were even able to get close enough to hit the Death Star with their ship. The sheer scope of that would not have worked as several X-Wings fly into the Death Star and nothing. In that movie they scramble the fighters from the Yavin IV base, there are no Cruisers, Corvettes, or Battleships in the sky.

In Return of the Jedi, there is no nearby base, the Rebellion comes to the Death Star. Akbar and Co. could have tried to ram the Death Star, but a) does the Rebellion strike you as beings who would condone that kind of loss of life (their own crews) and b) there was still the matter of the invisible shield that Han and Co. had to turn off.

One of the things that made this stratagem a viable option was that
1) there were no Alliance ships in the way,
2) there was no longer a crew on board,
3) it was literally a last gasp effort.

Also, contrary to what others have said, Vader was not chasing Leia in Star Wars through Hyperspace. Leia's Hyperdrive was no longer working. Think of the slow crawl overhead as the movie started. Also, not hard to believe they had ship problems after seeing their narrow escape in Rogue One.

All in all, I thoroughly enjoyed The Last Jedi. Was it like the other movies in the series? No, but after the criticism they received for Force Awakens being too similar, I can't believe the same people are complaining about this one too. My opinion is that this one gets better with further viewing. I have enjoyed more each time I've seen it. But I also go to see these movies with my critic lens turned off. Star Wars was the first movie I ever saw in a theater and I go with the expectation of having that same sense of wonder each time. Have they done some things I wouldn't do? Sure. But I love Star Wars the franchise Gungan warts and all. I didn't love the minutae of the prequels, but the overarching redemption of Darth Vader is one of the best things I've ever seen on film. I firmly believe that Kylo Ren lied to Rey. She is someone important. The previous 8 movies have programmed us to believe that the Empire may deceive, but they don't lie. Tarken told Leia he would destroy Alderan, but lead her to beleive that if she gave away the location he'd stop, he didn't but he did destroy her planet. Vader told Luke he was his father, he was. The Emperor told Luke that the Death Star was fully operational, it was. I could go on and on, but I think you get the point.
On the flipside, what if Rey is "no one"? Wasn't Anakin "no one" when Quigon happened upon him? Who is to say she isn't the one to bring balance to the Force. All the prophecy stuff holds true for her too. I'm really looking forward to how the third trilogy finishes out. I also hope that Disney finds ways to augment the between films periods as they did with Rogue One. How did the Empire end up searching the Hoth System? Maybe we could see some of the Clone Wars, or the Order 66 being carried out as they hunt down the Jedi? I think they should take a page from Rogue One and realize that these stand-alones are stand-alones, because the main characters aren't as lucky as Han, Luke and Leia.