Occupy Opinions?

[Son of Arathorn]

Originally Posted by Darth Vader

One of the local radio stations went down one morning a couple weeks ago to the "Occupy Toledo" protest, which really hasn't amounted to much yet.

The radio guy interviewed one of the lead protesters. It went something like this:

Q: "So, what's "Occupy Toledo". What are you guys doing out here?"

A: "We're just trying to get out and spread our message"

Q: "And your message is?"

A: "Ahaha, good question. It has something to do with money...or jobs...or...something. I honestly don't exactly know for sure."

Q: "So, you've been out here for a week or so, what are you doing about work?"

A: Yea, I'm kinda not doing the whole 'work' thing anymore, that's why I'm hanging out here."

Q: How many people do you guys have out here now?"

A: "Lemme see, 5...6...7, yea 7 people. We had a lot more, but I don't know where they went. Oh, I forgot to count the people under the tarp. We're up to 11 right now."

Q: "Really, what are you doing out here?"

A: "To be honest, free food. I walked by one day and they were frying up some bacon, and I've been here ever since."

Not being a fan of the whole occupy thing to begin with, then hearing this on the radio about the local one, I can't say I support the whole movement. The time and resources can be spent a lot better in my opinion.

Now that is appalling. There are a few major things that the Occupy Movement Stands for. None of them are free bacon. For those of you that don't really understand, or just plain dislike it, here they are.
1) The rising gap between the incomes of the poor and rich. In the past few decades, after-tax income for the relative middle-class has gone up about $20,000. Whereas the rich after-tax income has more than doubled, going from about $160,000 to more than $350,000. (By the way, these numbers are approximated as I don't have them in front of me right now, probably off by at most, $300.
2) The growing power that companies and corporations have over our political system, ranging from lobbying to large campaign donations.
3)... Geez, the third one, what is it? Ummmm... huh... there's income, there's power over politics, what is the last one, um... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cmi_p1iLs3g
Oops.

[Son of Arathorn]

Double post, ignore.

[Rich10]

Originally Posted by Son of Arathorn

There are a few major things that the Occupy Movement Stands for. None of them are free bacon. For those of you that don't really understand, or just plain dislike it, here they are.
1) The rising gap between the incomes of the poor and rich. In the past few decades, after-tax income for the relative middle-class has gone up about $20,000. Whereas the rich after-tax income has more than doubled, going from about $160,000 to more than $350,000. (By the way, these numbers are approximated as I don't have them in front of me right now, probably off by at most, $300.
2) The growing power that companies and corporations have over our political system, ranging from lobbying to large campaign donations.
3)... Geez, the third one, what is it? Ummmm... huh... there's income, there's power over politics, what is the last one, um... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cmi_p1iLs3g
Oops.

This is something that happens during recessions and difficult economic periods, the poor, uneducated and the young take the bigger hit. The rising income inequality also contains an age inequality. Whether we wish to define this as a recession (I suppose we are stagnant, not in a contraction), we are still in a very difficult economic situation. Many blue collar jobs have been lost and I worry about them coming back. Feel free to correct me if I am wrong, but I haven't seen any suggestions from the Occupy movement to correct this outside of some very socialist ideas that are pretty much a non starter in this country at this time.

That corporations, unions and groups have political power isn't exactly news. For what its worth, President Obama has more money ready for this election (and had more money in the last election) than the "big money" conservatives.

Since there seems to be no central leadership to the movement; it seems to be all over the place. There was a blog in the Washington Post as to why people went to an Occupy event.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/...wprss=blogpost
Some of the reasons to attend the Occupy movement included:

1. Photographing the event.
2. Wanting to be President.
3. Not wanting to be judged for someone's past.
4. Pursuing nothing.
5. Organizer - reason not mentioned.
6. The president hasn't delivered on his promises.
7. Doesn't blame the 1% but thinks the country needs a lot of help.
8. Wants to go to Occupy Miami to hit the beach.
9. Quit her job because she she wasn’t content to sit around and be “cattle.”
10. To fight against austerity measures in the city.

People I know in NY who went to Occupy Wall Street said that it just seemed like a giant pot smoking party. I give them another month or so until it gets cold. The only possible outcome may be to give the Democrats more support for a tax increase on the wealthy.

For what its worth, I'm part of the 53% who works, pays taxes (federal, state, local, property, sales and a few I forgot), and doesn't have the time or inclination to not work, hang out in a park, and smoke pot. I do feel for people who have lost their jobs during this tough time and feel that the government should support people during this time. But, if you lost your job, I am very confident that you will not find one at an Occupy event.

[jschild]

I'm part of the 53% who works, pays taxes

Hate to tell you, but everyone who works pays taxes, there isn't a magical 53% who pays taxes and the rest don't unless you cheat and don't consider sales taxes, payroll taxes, city and state taxes, etc don't exist. It's a BS % that works only by pretending the only tax in the world is federal income tax.

[Agent Minivann]

The groups are all over the place on what they are protesting and why. Apart from the odd bonehead moves by one side or the other in some places, mostly Oakland, it is a whole lot of nothing going on. That said, I like bacon.

[Rich10]

Originally Posted by jschild

Hate to tell you, but everyone who works pays taxes, there isn't a magical 53% who pays taxes and the rest don't unless you cheat and don't consider sales taxes, payroll taxes, city and state taxes, etc don't exist. It's a BS % that works only by pretending the only tax in the world is federal income tax.

Originally Posted by Rich10

I'm part of the 53% who works, pays taxes (federal, state, local, property, sales and a few I forgot)

If you read the next few words, you would have seen that I included the other taxes and specified that there were other taxes that I hadn't even considered. I'm sure you weren't trying to take my words out of context.

Edit: My apologies, upon a reread, I seem to have taken your words out of context. You were questioning whether only 53% of people paid taxes. Obviously, that is not correct and I was not trying to suggest otherwise.

I am surprised that only 53% of people pay federal income taxes. I would have guessed that it was higher. I wonder what that figure is on a historical basis.

[Mombo101]

Here's the main problem, the Occupy movement could theoretically work if there was some form of leadership and some national stance (which includes an idea/plan/suggestion for improving the current state of the economy). But, there's none and until there's those two things all it is, is a news grabbing attention grabber.

Here's the thing, the economy has been rough on a number of us....my family included. Our house went into foreclosure and due to my full time teaching job paying barely anything...I'm stuck living with my dad until I can find something better. I'm currently on the hunt for a second job that'll work with my current teaching position to make ends meet and get out on my own. If you want to talk about a "99%" I'm it.

That being said, when I see many of the Occupy Providence protestors, I see many (and I know I'm generalizing) hippies, Brown students and trust fund kids. These are generally people who do not have to work to begin with, and who already have plenty of money to do whatever the heck they want. Do I think the spreading gap needs to be fixed? Yes. Do I think the banks hold too much power within our government? Yes. Do I believe that our government hasn't done enough to help create jobs and pull ourselves out of this mess? Yes. Do I have the ability or resources to sit outside for a month chanting and beating a drum in an attempt to coerce the government for a stance that's ambiguous? No.

The thing of it is, I have bills to pay. I have my career to think about. Right now the only thing that's going to pull me out of this mess is hard work on my part. That's what people don't get. The road is hard, I know, I truly know. But, if we're going to improve our economic stance it takes work, lots and lots of work. Sitting around in a park sleeping in a tent isn't going to solve anything. It's been a month, these Occupy protestors remain where they are. How are they paying their debts? How are they paying for food? As much as I support the right to protest and what these people are protesting, I'm not going to risk utter bankruptcy for it.

They are truly not the 99%, people like myself and my dad are.

[cavebehr]

Isn't it great to live in a country where you can protest the government and military, and it is provided by the government and the military.!?

Mostly these protests are just saying, "Hey we exist, we are not happy, and there are alot of us."

If it were not for the pot smokers, all of these would get totally organized, totally grow, and become mob scenes where we take our own white house back by force, and any other rich areas. Sure some people might die but they would then be martyrs. Even if they died doing something wrong like looting from what everyone thinks are the rich.

Never underestimate the power of pot to keep a crowd under control, and to help dull the senses enough to kill a moot to begin with movement.

Now had they been doing crack, meth , or giving away free starbucks expressos, it would have become the big nasty thing everyone should fear.

Oh and as for occupy movements go, we still occupy other nations at this moment, our guys live in tents, and if they did get high now and then, I would be just as proud of them, because they are doing a thankless job that can get them killed.

[jschild]

If you read the next few words, you would have seen that I included the other taxes and specified that there were other taxes that I hadn't even considered. I'm sure you weren't trying to take my words out of context.

The only possible 53% you can be referring to is the 53% that pays federal income taxes. Unless there is some other 53% you are referring to. Because a ton more than 53% pay taxes. Indeed the number is 100% of all adult pay taxes.

They are truly not the 99%, people like myself and my dad are.

How about people like Scott Olson? A veteran with a job who also fully supported and protested and got shot with a "non-lethal" round and almost died? Pretending they are just lazy bums is no different than pretending all tea partiers are racists. Are some of them that in both groups? Yes. Are they all? No.

[Onacara]

Perhaps if people spent more time occupying their own streets things would be better. Go buy your groceries and goods from the independent stores rather than the big chains...oh wait then you would have to pay a little more and people don't want to do that.

[Son of Arathorn]

See, I noticed that people are saying that this time could be better spent trying to get a job. The thing about Occupy Taos is, most of these people have a job, they're just in poverty. And at this point, the movement is too small to have any freeloaders, which is why I like it.

EDIT: Wow, this poll is pretty split. 9 against, 8 for, and 5

[jschild]

One of the best things coming from this is the huge amounts of people leaving big banks and moving their money to credit unions and neighborhood banks.