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  #13  
Old October 17th, 2022, 07:10 AM
AMIS AMIS is offline
 
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Re: OCDJ’s Custom Concepts and Discussions ⭕️

I dislike going over more than three abilities...it`s not unheard of but it tends to make 1 unit overpowered. I know you can always increase the points but the army tends to need to revolve around that unit instead of that unit fitting into that army. Not something I look to do in my customs. Long way to say that if you like the Wild Reach skill (which I happen to do) you may want to drop the Dzu-Teh Enhancement. Wild reach is more unique and Enhancement is more an overused Orcish ability.

The smaller figure; I can see the Glacier Traverse and enhanced movement but you could also use a pure bonding (perhaps wild bonding) to let it keep up with the Dzu-Teh, Rhotaga and any other wild character out there. Because it's smaller, but still a hero how about something like:
Life 4
Move 5
Range 1
Attack 3
Defense 4

The attack of 3 shows it's smaller (if really a lot smaller go with 2) but the defense shows how tough a smaller figure needs to be to survive that climate (it also replaces camouflage but this reason is thematically better).

Just when you thought it was all right, someone made it alright.

Good trades with - Porkins / xraine69 / mac122 (x2) / frylock / Ztimster (x2) and probably others I forgotten to mention...sorry.

Last edited by AMIS; October 17th, 2022 at 07:14 AM. Reason: Always go for theme when possible...
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  #14  
Old October 17th, 2022, 03:41 PM
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Re: OCDJ’s Custom Concepts and Discussions ⭕️

I agree with AMIS regarding more than 3 powers on a card, and that the Enhancement ability is not worth keeping.

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  #15  
Old October 27th, 2022, 01:06 PM
OCDJ-scaper OCDJ-scaper is offline
 
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Re: OCDJ’s Custom Concepts and Discussions ⭕️

Thanks @AMIS and @caps this has been a long time coming! He’s been tested so many times and at times I’m the only one questioning the overpowered potential. I too agree that whatever doesn’t mesh with Rhotaga can just move to the smaller dzu teh guy. I also like the stats provided for him, they are practically the same as what I had. Now, did you have any insight on pricing?. If the Hydra has a quadruple attack with a defense of 6 and is 120, Iskra summons once a game for 50 and a traditional squad of 3 dzu teh is 75…where do you think is a good placement to start. At this point, I don’t see Rhotaga being more than 120 to 150.
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  #16  
Old October 27th, 2022, 01:10 PM
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Re: OCDJ’s Custom Concepts and Discussions ⭕️

Can you post the design we're currently discussing, with all current edits/updates?

Formerly known as capsocrates
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Remixed Master Sets - challenge yourself with new terrain combinations!
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  #17  
Old October 27th, 2022, 03:20 PM
AMIS AMIS is offline
 
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Re: OCDJ’s Custom Concepts and Discussions ⭕️

I tend to work against what would a unit do against Marcus and a squad of Lego's. If it would normally be a tie (last role of the die either way) then that's 150. If the Roman's would win every time then what would a unit of Legos do? What would Marcus by himself do?
Really this gives you a place to start where the range should be for testing because it's all strictly theoryscape until you play them against each other in testing. If bonding or enhanced effects are involved then you need to have another unit for the testing but, when testing use 1 custom unit at a time unless you're absolutely 100% convinced you are sure of the other's point value. If possible always use official units (preferably the same ones time after time so you know how they should be played).
It can get time consuming and I believe most custom creators (including myself) don't test well enough or often enough but it can actually be a lot of fun.

Just when you thought it was all right, someone made it alright.

Good trades with - Porkins / xraine69 / mac122 (x2) / frylock / Ztimster (x2) and probably others I forgotten to mention...sorry.

Last edited by AMIS; October 27th, 2022 at 03:24 PM. Reason: If the lego's always win...There's always Guilty...which is a pleasure of mine :)
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  #18  
Old October 27th, 2022, 04:56 PM
OCDJ-scaper OCDJ-scaper is offline
 
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Re: OCDJ’s Custom Concepts and Discussions ⭕️

Quote:
Originally Posted by caps View Post
Can you post the design we're currently discussing, with all current edits/updates?
Rhotaga
Jandar
Dzu-Teh
Unique Hero
King
Wild
Huge:9
Life:6
Move:6
Attack:5
Defense:3

Thaelenk Tundra King:
Rhotaga may Glacier Traverse more than once per movement phase instead of moving normally. To Glacier Traverse, move to any unoccupied space adjacent to a Glacier Mountain and continue moving if possible. Slippery Ice and Heavy Snow only count as 1 space.

Summoning Dzu-Teh Battlecry:
After revealing an Order Marker on this card, if Rhotaga is on a snow or ice space, you may roll the 20-sided die. Add the number of Dzu-Teh you control adjacent to Rhotaga to your die roll. If you roll a 14 or higher, immediately summon, one of your own previously destroyed Dzu-Teh figures within 4 clear sight spaces of Rhotaga.

And now -
Wild Reach:
If an opponent's figure is within 2 spaces of Rhotaga, and its base is no more than 3 levels above Rhotaga's height or 3 levels below his base, Rhotaga may add 1 to his Range when attacking that figure. Rhotaga must be adjacent to a friendly figure with the wild personality in order to use his Wild
Reach.
Or just an engagement strike?
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  #19  
Old October 27th, 2022, 05:35 PM
OCDJ-scaper OCDJ-scaper is offline
 
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Re: OCDJ’s Custom Concepts and Discussions ⭕️

Or scratch the adjacency to a friendly wild figure and give him a straight up reach
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  #20  
Old October 27th, 2022, 06:08 PM
OCDJ-scaper OCDJ-scaper is offline
 
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Re: OCDJ’s Custom Concepts and Discussions ⭕️

Quote:
Originally Posted by caps View Post
Can you post the design we're currently discussing, with all current edits/updates?
Quote:
Originally Posted by AMIS View Post
I tend to work against what would a unit do against Marcus and a squad of Lego's. If it would normally be a tie (last role of the die either way) then that's 150. If the Roman's would win every time then what would a unit of Legos do? What would Marcus by himself do?
Really this gives you a place to start where the range should be for testing because it's all strictly theoryscape until you play them against each other in testing. If bonding or enhanced effects are involved then you need to have another unit for the testing but, when testing use 1 custom unit at a time unless you're absolutely 100% convinced you are sure of the other's point value. If possible always use official units (preferably the same ones time after time so you know how they should be played).
It can get time consuming and I believe most custom creators (including myself) don't test well enough or often enough but it can actually be a lot of fun.
Unfortunately, as I eager as I am to get them, I don’t own any legos or Marcus xc
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  #21  
Old October 28th, 2022, 03:48 PM
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Re: OCDJ’s Custom Concepts and Discussions ⭕️

I would do just plain Reach there.

Formerly known as capsocrates
--
Remixed Master Sets - challenge yourself with new terrain combinations!
--
Colorado Fall 2023 Multiplayer Madness
--
caps's Customs Redux - caps's multiplayer maps - caps's maps - Seagate

--
Continuing Classic Heroscape: C3V SoV
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  #22  
Old October 28th, 2022, 04:23 PM
AMIS AMIS is offline
 
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Re: OCDJ’s Custom Concepts and Discussions ⭕️

Points wise, I think you're looking at roughly 180. He'd constantly be able to pummel Marcus and Lego's (you need to set up you're own usual suspects for comparison - a champion and Gruts - whatever you have and work from there) but I can't see him defeating Marcus and 2 Lego's consistently. A solid play test could be him and a squad of Dzu-Teh vs Grimnack and 2 Heavy Gruts...if you have them.

He's a heavy hitter who would be pretty unstoppable on snow and the semi-bonding with the Dzu-Teh really jazzes him up.

As for power names, I'd drop a lot of the extras - I know they're thematic but it makes them long; how about:

Tundra King:
Rhotaga may Glacier Traverse more than once per movement phase instead of moving normally. To Glacier Traverse, move to any unoccupied space adjacent to a Glacier Mountain and continue moving if possible.

Northern Battle-cry:
After revealing an Order Marker on this card, if Rhotaga is on a snow or ice space, you may roll the 20-sided die. Add the number of Dzu-Teh you control adjacent to Rhotaga to your die roll. If you roll a 14 or higher, immediately summon, one of your own previously destroyed Dzu-Teh figures within 4 clear sight spaces of Rhotaga.

Ice Reach:
If an opponent's figure is within 2 spaces of Rhotaga, and its base is no more than 3 levels above Rhotaga's height or 3 levels below his base, Rhotaga may add 1 to his Range when attacking that figure. Rhotaga must be adjacent to a friendly figure with the wild personality in order to use his Ice Reach.

Personally, I think the Ice Movement's too much and would add even more to the points.

Just when you thought it was all right, someone made it alright.

Good trades with - Porkins / xraine69 / mac122 (x2) / frylock / Ztimster (x2) and probably others I forgotten to mention...sorry.

Last edited by AMIS; October 28th, 2022 at 04:24 PM. Reason: With the movement add another 35 points.
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  #23  
Old October 29th, 2022, 01:39 AM
OCDJ-scaper OCDJ-scaper is offline
 
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Re: OCDJ’s Custom Concepts and Discussions ⭕️

Hmmm, @AMIS can you expand upon your thought process when choosing these as the names? For me, I would prefer thaelenk king if we had to concise. Strictly because I believe thaelenk is the actual name of the cold environment they are from and tundra is more like an adjective? Idk i guess either would work. However, I’m more curious as to how you came to northern battle cry. As for ice reach I feel as though that name would suit better an ability that actually had to do with ice in order to use it. So, if you think the requirement should be that he must be adjacent to a glacier mountain in order to reach. (Which thematically I’m ok with because I did have that as a concept before to signify him like hanging off one or if like his back was up against the wall he’d become more ferocious etc.) id be down with that.

Also, the idea is that he does in fact dominate the ice areas. This is the goal when drafting him. The downside is he should be extremely limited and at a disadvantage without it. Perhaps, what we should discuss here is his stats. I do have the orcs so I will test it now (depressing that I have to do it alone lol) but I would settle on decreasing his movement to 5 even 4 if it meant he could move on ice and snow for 1. We play very strategic competitive games and one thing we’ve always done was play with every type of terrain I currently own. Traditional terrain, swamp terrain, very little dungeon space sometimes castle walls, lava, and tundra. And when the game ends up on any specific terrain that just so happens to be the main focal point of the battle whether by fate or design. We ALWAYS take into account it’s affect. So, odds are I’ll never play a game without the ice and snow being specified as slippery or heavy. The issue with this for me is that the limitation it puts on other units is absolutely detrimental when covering ground. To limit Rhotaga in his own domain just doesn’t sit right with me. Perhaps, after limiting his base move, his defense can be nerfed to 2 since the ideal playstyle is that he will always be or should be played with dzu teh in his vicinity in order to be effective.
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  #24  
Old October 29th, 2022, 01:48 AM
OCDJ-scaper OCDJ-scaper is offline
 
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Re: OCDJ’s Custom Concepts and Discussions ⭕️

As for the limited bonding, I don’t think it to be so drastic it would jump him too far up in points in that at most he’ll get a free turn, the very least just get to move, but could not spawn a destroyed dzu teh due to the requirements stated in the power. That being you need to reveal the order marker on him specifically and you must be on a snow or ice space.
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