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The Book of Casual Rule: Knockback

IAmBatman

IAmBatman

Champ of C3G Con 2020, 2024, and mindless posting
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The Book of Knockback Casual Rules​

C3G DC MASTER SET
WORLD'S FINEST​

C3G-cover_KnockbackRules.jpg

Download PDF File Here​


This set of rules is not necessary to enjoy C3G customs, but it is designed to enhance your SuperHero Battles by allowing figures to knock other figures backwards as they attack each other.​

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Knockback Description- So you want to learn how to fly? Easy. Just anger the Hulk and let him punch you square in the jaw, then you will believe a man can fly...

-Rulings and Clarifications-
  • Casual Rules: Casual Rules are intended for casual play only, and may interact in unusual ways with other C3G designs. They are not allowed for C3G Playtesting.
  • Q- If any figure with Deadly Shot/Strike and SuperStrength roll 2 attack dice and roll two skulls for an adjacent attack, how many Knockback points do they receive, 2 or 4?
    A - 2. Knockback points are determined by each skull rolled, not each hit counted.
  • The C3G Knockback Optional Rule Set was designed to be played with the white combat dice found in the second edition of Rise of the Valkyrie Master set, Swarm of the Marro Master Set, Marvel Heroscape Master Set and Dungeons and Dragons Master Set and is fully compatible only with this set of combat dice. When using different dice, house rules are necessary to ensure full compatibility.
  • Q - Where do I place my figure if it has been moved by Knockback and falls over a cliff but its movement would end on a space that is occupied by a figure, destructible object, obstacle, etc.?
    A - You cannot move a figure onto an occupied space with these Knockback rules. So whether there's a tree or another figure down at the bottom of that cliff, you couldn't move the figure there and you'd have to stop and roll for Knockback damage since you couldn't move the figure.
  • Q - Who moves a figure that is knocked back? It doesn't say who specifically moves the figure.
    A - Unless otherwise stated, the only player that can ever move a figure, is the player that controls that figure.
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-Strategy, Tactics and Tips-
  • N/A
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-Heroscapers Community Contributions-
  • TBA
 
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Re: The Book of Knockback Optional Rules

Awesome work, Griff. Thanks for creating these books. :p
 
Re: The Book of Knockback Optional Rules

Can you clarify if you punch someone into a battlement on a castle and the circumstances in which they would go over it to fall to their doom. I know it takes 2 movement to jump over one. Does this mean that if I do 3 KB, they go over it and fall?

Thanks,
Cigarman
 
Re: The Book of Knockback Optional Rules

Cigarman said:
Can you clarify if you punch someone into a battlement on a castle and the circumstances in which they would go over it to fall to their doom. I know it takes 2 movement to jump over one. Does this mean that if I do 3 KB, they go over it and fall?

Thanks,
Cigarman
Click to expand...
Well technically, it takes a move of 3 to go over the inside of the battlement: 2 for its height and 1 for moving over it.

From the outside of the battlement it takes a move of 4 to go over it: 3 for its height and 1 for moving over it.

But to answer your question, the figure needs to move over the wall to avoid Knockback Damage against that wall. If the figure cannot move over the wall, then it takes Knockback Damage. You should use the same principal for all terrain, elevations, obstacles, etc.
 
Re: The Book of Knockback Optional Rules

I really love using "knockback" in the games we play. I have a question about how the "knockback rule was created. How did you decide to use the skulls to block skulls? Did you consider the the shields and blanks option? I think that was used in a previous Knockback rule. Do you know which way gives you a higher probability of knockback (I am not a real math guy) The only differences that I see is the that using the skulls you have more of a chance to take damage and not be Knocked back vs. the other way which increases knockback with damage taken. You would basically need a lot of blanks to stop the knockback but still take a lot damage. What do think? Also when knocked back into terrain or objects seems a little unclear. Do you count knockback points like movement points? That seems a little odd. Couldn't you say a figure will crash into any height or terrain elevation more than 1/2 it's height. So a figure large 6 could be knocked over a battlement but nothing shorter. I know technically its height is really 2 but it does take 3 to go over. Just some ideas...
 
Re: The Book of Knockback Optional Rules

I believe Necroblade and Balantai hashed out that particular quirk. I think it had to do with thematic reasons. A skull represents a hit, a shield represents a block, and a blank represents a whiff. So if you whiff completely, you shouldn't stop KB or damage. Whereas you can block an attack (like Cap with his shield) and still get thrown back. A skull represents sacrificing your body to go more on the offensive and stand your ground (thus it stops Knockback).
I'm not sure how the math works out on these. It does (in my playtesting) make it a nice, light touch, though, which I like.
 
Re: The Book of Knockback Optional Rules

I will try both methods and see the different effects on the games. I think your right though the "Skulls" method is a lighter touch and shields and blanks method is "Hulk Smash" as the figure goes into the next county.
 
Re: The Book of Knockback Optional Rules

IAmBatman said:
I believe Necroblade and Balantai hashed out that particular quirk. I think it had to do with thematic reasons. A skull represents a hit, a shield represents a block, and a blank represents a whiff. So if you whiff completely, you shouldn't stop KB or damage. Whereas you can block an attack (like Cap with his shield) and still get thrown back. A skull represents sacrificing your body to go more on the offensive and stand your ground (thus it stops Knockback).
I'm not sure how the math works out on these. It does (in my playtesting) make it a nice, light touch, though, which I like.
Click to expand...
Not only does the mechanic for this work well, but I love the thematic design. In Martial arts to just block an attack you are usually redirecting the impact of a strike, where as a "striking block" or "ken uke" is designed to resist and stop a thrusting attack that would otherwise cause Knockback.
In other words, to stop a thrusting attack, you must meet or exceed its power with your own offense. This is translated perfectly in our Knockback rules IMO.

Next week we will learn how to avoid the thrusting attack by rolling a 13 to Stray. :)
 
Re: The Book of Knockback Optional Rules

I prefer to avoid the thrusting attack and make your attacker hurt simultaneously by using Evasive Strike. ;)
 
Re: The Book of Knockback Optional Rules

Drewman-chu said:
You mean like Cunterstrike?
Click to expand...
Counterstrike is interpreted as being one of two different things, it can be a powerful thrusting block (usuru uke) that is designed to not only stop the attack, but to also specifically harm the limb that was attacking. This technique was popularized by Bruce Lee's Jeet Kune Do philosophy, attack the attacker. If someone kicks at you, block it so hard that it cripples that limb.
Or, counterstrike is interpreted as parrying an attack and following it up with one or more quick attacks in succession, and at a speed where the technique is one fluid motion in stead of just a block... then an attack.
 
Re: The Book of Knockback Optional Rules

Thanks Griff, you really know a lot about martial arts. What is your specialty?
 
Re: The Book of Knockback Optional Rules

I imagine it's Tae-kwon-doh! :p
 
Re: The Book of Knockback Optional Rules

Griffin said:
Drewman-chu said:
Thanks Griff, you really know a lot about martial arts. What is your specialty?
Click to expand...
Shotokan (striking and blocking discipline), Kobudo (Japanese weapon discipline) and Ju-Jitsu (grappling art).
Click to expand...

Very interesting! I've been training in and have taught martial arts for over 17 years myself, and I also do a lot of martial arts history research (I've written a 200 page paper, that has since grown to close to 400, and co-authored several articles that have been published). I do Chinese Kung Fu, Okinawan Karate, and Tai Chi. What's interesting is that Griffin's earlier comments about stopping KB apply to Okinawan and Japanese-derived martial arts, but not so much to Chinese styles. There are multiple concepts and philosophies depending on style and region.
 
Re: The Book of Knockback Optional Rules

Now I have an argument for my wife as to why I spend so much time on these boards.

Education FTW!
 
Re: The Book of Knockback Optional Rules

GreyOwl said:
Griffin said:
Drewman-chu said:
Thanks Griff, you really know a lot about martial arts. What is your specialty?
Click to expand...
Shotokan (striking and blocking discipline), Kobudo (Japanese weapon discipline) and Ju-Jitsu (grappling art).
Click to expand...

Very interesting! I've been training in and have taught martial arts for over 17 years myself, and I also do a lot of martial arts history research (I've written a 200 page paper, that has since grown to close to 400, and co-authored several articles that have been published). I do Chinese Kung Fu, Okinawan Karate, and Tai Chi. What's interesting is that Griffin's earlier comments about stopping KB apply to Okinawan and Japanese-derived martial arts, but not so much to Chinese styles. There are multiple concepts and philosophies depending on style and region.
Click to expand...
That is true. I have been a practitioner for 23 years (since I was 5). I have studied many forms of Japanese Martial arts and some Chinese (like Wing Chun). I have always found that the Japanese arts were more practical and effective than the flashy overcomplicated philosophies of the Chinese. But I do have an enormous amount of respect for all styles, except for Tae Kwon Do (even though I was given a first degree black belt, which I did not except, because it was literally given to me. :headshake:)
I too have instructed at my own school and my father's school for many years Shearin's School of Self-Defense, although now, I only do private lessons for getting into shape, self-defense, and I manage some local kickboxing and tournaments which I also used to do. I will occasionally teach seminars at private schools for self-defense and sometimes specifically for females, and I have even instructed some local law officers. I use to compete a lot, but I got kinda bored winning all the time ;), so now I teach as often as I can (pass it on to the next gen. and all).
I don't really like the tournament scene anymore though, as the judges are usually uneducated martial artists, and are too easily impressed with unaplicable acrobatics as opposed to demonstrations of power and self-discipline.
I think that you and I have more in common than I thought, but that doesn't mean that we have to start agreeing about stuff though. ;)
 
Re: The Book of Knockback Optional Rules

Griffin said:
But I do have an enormous amount of respect for all styles, except for Tae Kwon Do
Click to expand...
Heh...I have to agree with you there. :)

Griffin said:
I don't really like the tournament scene anymore though, as the judges are usually uneducated martial artists, and are too easily impressed with unaplicable acrobatics as opposed to demonstrations of power and self-discipline.
Click to expand...

Yup, precisely why we don't really get involved in the tournament scene, too.

Griffin said:
I think that you and I have more in common than I thought, but that doesn't mean that we have to start agreeing about stuff though. ;)
Click to expand...

Of course not! :) (oh wait...was that agreeing with you?!)
 
Re: The Book of Knockback Optional Rules

So, according to the current KB rules, there is no way to punch someome off a castle wall using KB if there is a battlement to run into before going over the wall?
 
Re: The Book of Knockback Optional Rules

Cigarman said:
So, according to the current KB rules, there is no way to punch someome off a castle wall using KB if there is a battlement to run into before going over the wall?
Click to expand...
If the figure getting knocked back is given enough movement, they can go over that battlement.
 
Re: The Book of Knockback Optional Rules

So basically, it can be done, it just takes a LOT of KB points ...
 
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