The Book of Batman (Bruce Wayne) (II)

[Margloth]

Re: The Book of Batman (Bruce Wayne)(II) - Design

I'm on board with that, but I wonder if some people won't be disappointed in a Bats 2.0 in scuba gear?

 

[Griffin]

Re: The Book of Batman (Bruce Wayne)(II) - Design

Maybe so, but for the years that I have been doing this, I try my best to make decisions that I approve of, rather than living in the fear of what other approve of. We are the nerdiest of the nerds, and this game is designed for nerds. Without being afraid of sounding arrogant, if the Heroes aren't happy with a design, it is probably $#!+.

With that said, we disagree all the time, and for me, when I have voiced my opinion and am still in the minority, that is when my humility kicks in and I shut up out of respect to democracy and the safety that there is in a multitude of wise men.

 

[Margloth]

Re: The Book of Batman (Bruce Wayne)(II) - Design

 

[Griffin]

Re: The Book of Batman (Bruce Wayne)(II) - Design

Basically, Welcome to the gun show.

 

[IAmBatman]

Re: The Book of Batman (Bruce Wayne)(II) - Design

With that said, we disagree all the time, and for me, when I have voiced my opinion and am still in the minority, that is when my humility kicks in and I eventually shut up out of respect to democracy and the safety that there is in a multitude of wise men.

Fixed.

 

[Griffin]

Re: The Book of Batman (Bruce Wayne)(II) - Design

That is rich coming from Mr. 46,960 Posts.

 

[IAmBatman]

Re: The Book of Batman (Bruce Wayne)(II) - Design

I make no claim of shutting up under any circumstances whatsoever.

 

[SirGalahad]

Re: The Book of Batman (Bruce Wayne)(II) - Design

Mini
1, then 4

Comic
2, then 6

 

[Hahma]

Re: The Book of Batman (Bruce Wayne)(II) - Design

Mini
4 then 1

Comic
6 or 7

 

[tcglkn]

Re: The Book of Batman (Bruce Wayne)(II) - Design

Can we get a space in between (Bruce Wayne) and (II) in the title of this thread please?

 

[IAmBatman]

Re: The Book of Batman (Bruce Wayne)(II) - Design

Can we get a space in between (Bruce Wayne) and (II) in the title of this thread please?

Any reason in particular? I'm pretty sure I'm going to be jamming in the phase info pretty tight as is.

 

[tcglkn]

Re: The Book of Batman (Bruce Wayne)(II) - Design

It's just an aesthetic thing that bothers me. As long as it'll be fixed upon moving it to On Deck I'll be fine.

 

[IAmBatman]

Re: The Book of Batman (Bruce Wayne)(II) - Design

I'm sure if I miss it in that transition, you'll remember and go in and fix it.

 

[Hahma]

Re: The Book of Batman (Bruce Wayne)(II) - Design

I remember having an extra hyphen in a thread title and Tickle yelled at me for it.

 

[tcglkn]

Re: The Book of Batman (Bruce Wayne)(II) - Design

I like consistency. Shoot me.

 

[Hahma]

Re: The Book of Batman (Bruce Wayne)(II) - Design

I like consistency. Shoot me.

 

[Spidey'tilIDie]

Re: The Book of Batman (Bruce Wayne)(II) - Design

mini 1, comic 10 which matches perfectly.

 

[IAmBatman]

Re: The Book of Batman (Bruce Wayne)(II) - Design

OK, as a casual tally, we're looking at ...

3 for Mini 3
2 for Mini 1
2 for Mini 4


with A3n yet to weigh in.

Comic 2, 6 (x2), 7, and 10 are getting love as well, but I figure we'll mostly trust that to whoever does art and try to match the mini as best we can once we choose it.

 

[IAmBatman]

Re: The Book of Batman (Bruce Wayne)(II) - Design

nevermind.

 

[Griffin]

Re: The Book of Batman (Bruce Wayne)(II) - Design

How are you getting half votes, and the only tie right now seems to be between Mini 1 and 4 for second place with Mini 3 in the lead. I am confused.

 

[IAmBatman]

Re: The Book of Batman (Bruce Wayne)(II) - Design

I tried splitting up Hahma and Sir G's since they both had two options, but I think I accidentally added an extra vote or two in the process. Updated. Mini Option 3 is in the lead unless A3n votes for one of the other two, in which case we might have to play "ask a Sidekick."

 

[IAmBatman]

Re: The Book of Batman (Bruce Wayne)(II) - Design

OK, SP updated and I'm sending this out to ERB (to Davidlhsl specifically, since it's been "top secret" thus far).

 

[IAmBatman]

Re: The Book of Batman (Bruce Wayne)(II) - Design

C3G INITIAL PLAYTEST FEEDBACK FORM

NAME OF THE TEST UNIT (BATMAN II)

- THEME TEST/ Check to see if there are any powers or stats on the test unit card that does not accurately reflect the theme or likeness of what the character would and could do. Also consider destructible objects, and whether or not this characters powers should affect them.
PASS

- MIRROR TEST/ Check to see if the unit were played against itself, if there would be any loops that would upset the balance of the Game.
PASS

- BONDING TEST/ Compare the unit card with all possible currently existing Bonding abilities to make sure there are no continual Bonding possibilities that do not stop appropriately or do not stop at all. This is to prevent loops in Bonding.
PASS

- SYNERGIES TEST/ Compare the unit card with all possible currently existing synergies to make sure there are no factors that could break the game by making any unit to powerful or too weak.
PASS

- POWER CHECK/ Consider the test unit and all existing units and all glyphs to compare to and check for any powers that could be over amplified and break the game. Each power must define when it takes place, who or what it affects, and What are the stipulations on the power if there are any.
PASS

- FUN TEST/ Consider whether or not the design was fun to play.
PASS

- FUN COMPETITIVE TEST/ Consider whether or not the design was fun to play against.
PASS

- DRAFTING TEST/ Consider whether or not this design is worth drafting.
PASS

- USAGE TEST/ Consider whether or not all of the powers on this card were used or at least usable.
PASS

- STRATEGY TEST/ Consider whether or not the design offers any real strategy or interesting tactics to the overall game.
PASS

Heavy Hitter or Mid-Level Hero Test
- Does it pass, Yes or No? Yes
- What should be the unit's point value? 250-260
- Give a brief overview. I think his weaknesses will be healers, high life figures, figures with super long range (9+), and figures with abilities to wound without attacking. He didn’t face a lot of these types in the heavy hitters, though, other than Aquaman, who won two close ones against him.
Batman did have Shadow Tile available in all of these matches, which helped him a lot, though he didn’t exclusively occupy it.
Right now I think he’s borderline around 250. I fear what advantages future Utility Glyphs might give him, though. I think he can make it at 250 with one tweak – I want to change the First Aid Kit to only heal 1 wound to decrease his staying power just a bit.

Spoiler Alert!

TEST 1
Map: Custom
Units: Batman II vs. Aquaman (230)
Batman took the First Aid, Bat Shuriken, and Infrared Goggles. He went 0-4 on Shadow Strike rolls despite occupying a shadow tile for all four rolls. Aquaman went 0-2 on Hand of the Waterbearer healing rolls despite occupying a water tile for both rolls.
Aquaman took all of his wounds from Batman attacking with Bat Shuriken from height, including a whiff on seven defense dice against a three skull roll. Batman won an initiative switch after putting 4 wounds on Aquaman in Round 1, but Aquaman managed to fend off the rest of his attacks.
Batman spent the whole confrontation on height and in shadow and Aquaman spent it all on water. Batman also used the First Aid to heal 2 wounds instead of taking a turn on Turn 2 of Round 2.
The Infrared Goggles didn’t come into play. Despite the loss, Batman felt like he has a slight edge in this matchup.
Who won and how many wounds did they have? Aquaman with 1 life left wins Turn 3 Round 2.

TEST 2
Map: Custom
Units: Batman II vs. Aquaman (230)
Batman took the First Aid, Bat Shuriken, and Bat-Grapple utility glyphs this time. The combatants were positioned much like last time. Batman hit 5 Shadow Strike rolls overall this time, but Aquaman healed 7 wounds. Batman used the First Aid Kit to heal two wounds once again and stuck to tossing Bat Shuriken from height and range while Aquaman shot blasts of water from three spaces away. This one felt extremely close, with Aquaman winning initiative for the final round and getting through Shadow Strike and Batman’s shadow tile and height enhanced defenses to put the final wound on the Dark Knight.
Who won and how many wounds did they have? Aquaman with 1 life wins Turn 1 Round 4.

TEST 3
Map: Custom
Units: Batman II vs. Iron Man (240)
Batman took the First Aid, Bat Shuriken, and Infrared Goggles. Low life units hate Shadow Strike. Batman hit it 2 of 4 times here, killing Iron Ma on his own turn. Iron Man flew in fast and took the shadow tile Batman most wanted, so all of his Shadow Strike rolls except one were unenhanced (and he failed that one anyway). Iron Man got in two attacks from height and two on even height. Batman only attacked Iron Man once, up close and personal, with the Infrared Goggles negating Iron Man’s shadow tile bonus.
The other two glyphs didn’t come into play this time around.
Who won and how many wounds did they have? Batman with 3 life wins Turn 2 Round 1.

TEST 4
Map: Custom
Units: Batman II vs. Iron Man (240)
Batman took the Bat Shuriken, Infrared Goggles, and First Aid Kit. Iron Man whiffed twice on his attacks overall, but still managed to put 2 wounds on Batman, which Batman used the First Aid Kit to eliminate. Batman went 3 of 5 on Shadow Strike rolls despite a lack of shadow tile bonuses until the final one, which just devastated Iron Man. He also got in a melee punch for one wound using the Infrared Tile. He fired up Bat Shuriken on his last turn to no avail, then finished Iron Man off with his final Shadow Strike.
Batman with a hot D20 is nigh invincible.
Who won and how many wounds did they have? Batman with Full Life wins Turn 3, Round 2.

TEST 5
Map: Custom
Units: Batman II vs. Spider-Man (250)
Batman took the First Aid Kit, Bat Shuriken, and Infrared Goggles into this one.
Spider-Man split focus, using his Spidey-Senses to either avoid extra attacks from Bat Shuriken or set up for a Web Sling assault. Three times he used Web Slinging to pull Batman onto an adjacent, lower height swamp tile, negating the shadow tile bonus and putting Batman down to 3 defense versus Spidey’s 5 attack. He managed to wound Batman 3 times this way, but Batman used the First Aid Kit to get rid of two of these wounds.
Batman mostly fired at Spidey from range, though he did hit him in the face a couple of times. He hit Spidey with wounds from Shadow Strike twice in all and got the other three wounds with his normal attack. I may have to play Spidey more defensively next time.
Who won and how many wounds did they have? Batman with 1 wound wins Turn 3, Round 2.

TEST 6
Map: Custom
Units: Batman II vs. Spider-Man (250)
The Infrared Goggles weren’t that useful in the last match up and I found myself wanting to disengage a few times during Batman’s turn, so this time Batman took the Bat-Grapple, Bat Shuriken, and First Aid Kit. He used all three during the course of the game, but there were poor D20 and defensive rolls all around here and Spidey’s use of Web Slinging put him over the top.
Who won and how many wounds did they have? Spider-Man with 3 wounds wins Turn 2, Round 2.

TEST 7
Map: Custom
Units: Batman II vs. Flash (250)
Batman took the Infrared Goggles, Bat Shuriken, and First Aid Kit. He used all three, denying Flash that extra shadow tile boost defensively, attacking him multiple times to try to break through his defenses, and healing up two wounds.
Batman mostly attacked with the Bat Shuriken, and Flash mostly hit and ran with his normal attack, keeping Batman clear of Shadow Tiles or making Batman take height disadvantage to be on them. Flash managed to get in some wounds here, but could only put 3 wounds on Batman (2 healed by the First Aid Kit) before succumbing to 4 Shadow Strike wounds.
Who won and how many wounds did they have? Batman with 1 wound wins Turn 2, Round 3.

TEST 8
Map: Custom
Units: Batman II vs. Flash (250)
Batman took the Bat Shuriken, Infrared Goggles, and First Aid Kit.
Flash got bold and used his special attack more early, putting 2 wounds on Batman that he took off with the First Aid Kit, then 3 more wounds before switching to his normal attack. Batman rolled poorly for Shadow Strike up to that point when he hit two in a row to give Flash his only wounds. Then Flash managed to get in a hit on a one skull attack and a defensive whiff from Batman to end the game.
Who won and how many wounds did they have? Flash with 2 wounds wins Turn 3, Round 2.

TEST 9
Map: Custom
Units: Batman II vs. Colossus (260)
Batman took the Bat Shuriken, Infrared Goggles, and First Aid Kit in. He got in an early wound on Colossus with a triple attack from height with the Shuriken. He ended up letting Colossus get in back-to-back attacks without Batman having the shadow bonus as a result, though, and burned his First Aid Kit pretty early, then took another two wounds. Batman did move to a lower level, though, giving up height for the protection of the Shadow Tile and attacking with Bat Shurikens first and his fist later. Colossus laughed off most of these normal attacks, even with Batman rolling 4 skulls regularly, but 1 did manage to slip in. Batman also hit Shadow Strike 3 times to keep it close.
Colossus rolled poorly, despite height, seeming to roll 2 or 3 skulls on most attacks.
Even with dice luck, though, Batman couldn’t pull this one off. It was close, though. Maybe closer than I’d like.
Who won and how many wounds did they have? Colossus with 1 life wins Turn 3, Round 1.

TEST 10
Map: Custom
Units: Batman II vs. Colossus (260)
Batman took the Bat Shuriken, Bat-Grapple, and First Aid Kit this time. I played this one with the First Aid Kit only healing one wound. It didn’t matter, though, as Batman hit 6 of 7 Shadow Strike rolls. Hot and nasty can’t be beat. Still, I feel Colossus has the edge when Batman isn’t rolling sick. I’m hoping the decrease in the value of the First Aid Kit is enough to keep Batman at 250. I’m going to play him at that cost moving forward.
Batman healed one wound from Colossus here with the First Aid Kit.
Who won and how many wounds did they have? Batman with Full Life wins Turn 1, Round 4.

_____________________________________________________________


Squad Test
- Does it pass, Yes or No? Yes
- What should be the unit's point value? 230?
- Give a brief overview. Batman had a chance here, but couldn’t do enough with his attacks and hit on only 2 of 5 Shadow Strike rolls despite camping on a Shadow Tile.
Map: Custom
Units: Batman II vs. Hawkmen of Thanagar x2 + 1 (250)

Spoiler Alert!

Batman took the First Aid Kit, Police Scanner, and Bat Shurikens this time. It was fun using the Police Scanner to get the positioning Batman wanted against the Hawkmen, but he ended up taking height disadvantage on a Shadow Tile to amp up his Shadow Strike, and then only hitting Shadow Strike on 2 of 5 rolls. This spelled his doom as the Hawkmen were able to get into position to hit him with big attack after big attack and without Shadow Strike and only getting one wound healed from First Aid Kit, Batman wasn’t able to keep up. Their defense was also too tough for Batman to want to rely on two dice Bat Shuriken attacks, so once the Hawkmen reached melee, he mostly relied on his fists. They didn’t do well, though, as both of his kills were from Shadow Strike.
Who won and how many wounds did they have? Hawkmen with 3 remaining win Turn 3, Round 2.

_____________________________________________________________


Squad Test
- Does it pass, Yes or No? Yes
- What should be the unit's point value? 260?
- Give a brief overview. Batman managed to turn on enough offense to go with slightly better Shadow Strike rolls and thoroughly whipped the Gorilla City Warriors.
Map: Custom
Units: Batman II vs. Gorilla City Warriors x2 (250)

Spoiler Alert!

Batman took Bat-Grapple (to avoid being tied up in engagements), Bat Shuriken, and First Aid Kit. The Gorilla City Warriors were looking good at first as they swarmed Batman and hit him for a wound, but he hit 3 of 7 Shadow Strike rolls and managed to use his Bat Shuriken and fists well to knock out the other Gorillas. He also healed one wound from First Aid Kit.
Who won and how many wounds did they have? Batman with 1 wound wins Turn 1, Round 3.

_____________________________________________________________


Army Test
- Does it pass, Yes or No? Yes
- What should be the unit's point value? 250+?
- Give a brief overview. With Robin providing a decoy and Superman providing a bigger target, Batman was able to roam free and kill Inmates and Doomsday without trouble.
Map: Custom
Units: Batman II (250), Superman II, Robin (Dick Grayson) (800) vs. Doomsday(390), Lex Luthor (100), Joker (190), Arkham Inmates x2 (120) (800)

Spoiler Alert!

Doomsday was killed the first time in Round 4 and came back in Round 7, but it was too little too late. He didn’t get enough help from the rest of his army, despite killing Superman all by himself and healing 8 wounds over the course of the game.
Batman put 7 wounds on Doomsday in all, including the last 6, all with his Kryptonite covered Shurikens (I’m starting to think Kryptonite Gauntlets, both for theme and balance, should be restricted to melee only, so they don’t double with the Shurikens!). Batman also took out five Arkham Inmates with his Shurikens and never had to use his First Aid Kit. Thanks to Superman and Robin, he was only even attacked once!
Lex Luthor mind controlled Doomsday once and Superman once (resulting in a Shadow Strike wound on Superman) and that was all he did.
The Arkham Inmates put one wound on Robin.
Joker reorganized a lot of Order Markers on to Robin, but did nothing offensively.
Overall, the villain army failed a bit on offense here, but I still want to make that adjustment to the Kryptonite Gauntlets just to further help keep Bats in check.
Who won and how many wounds did they have? Robin with 1 wound and Batman with Full Life win Turn 3, Round 8.

_____________________________________________________________


Army Test
- Does it pass, Yes or No? Yes
- What should be the unit's point value? 240?
- Give a brief overview. Batman was a big threat, but D20 wounding powers are definitely a weakness for him. Had the White Martians been unable to pull it off, the Man-Bat Assassins might have done it with their talons. Other than absorbing wounds for others (like the Beat Cops), Batman didn’t do much here. Still, it was a very close game!
Map: Custom
Units: Batman II (250), Beat Cops x2, Robin (Tim Drake), Commissioner Gordon, Oracle, Martian Manhunter (1,000) vs. White Martian x3 (450), Merlyn (160), Hand Ninja x1 (170), Man-Bat Assassins (150), Shadow Thief (70) (1,000)

Spoiler Alert!

Batman took the Bat Shuriken, First Aid Kit, and Police Scanner (in hopes of following around the Beat Cops to protect himself). During the first two turns of the game for the villains, Shadow Thief left the battlefield, jumped over to Batman, stole the First Aid Kit, then left the battlefield again and stayed off it for several rounds.
In the middle of the first onslaught, the White Martians were focusing all of their efforts on taking out Batman. He put 3 wounds on one White Martian with his normal attack.
Batman was never attacked, so his Shadow Strike didn’t come into play. Instead, the White Martians came after him with their minds, rolling 6 of 14 for Mass Psychic Assault to take out Batman and the two Beat Cops protecting him.
Martian Manhunter, Gordon, the Beat Cops, Robin, and Oracle made a valiant attempt at coming back, but it wasn’t enough, as Shadow Thief and Merlyn went after Oracle in end game and edged her with Shadow Thief barely surviving. Shadow Thief was too busy attacking Oracle and then taking wounds to ever sacrifice a turn to the First Aid Kit.
Who won and how many wounds did they have? Shadow Thief with 2 lives wins Turn 1, Round 14.

With the changes suggested in my tests to First Aid Kit (already posted in that thread) and Kryptonite Gauntlets (I’ll post over there momentarily) I’m happy with him at 250 (and not a scrap less!).

 

[IAmBatman]

Re: The Book of Batman (Bruce Wayne)(II) - Design

Hopefully I'll get this started tomorrow, but might take until midweek. By next Saturday night, I'm hoping to have both this and Awesome Android done with their initials.

 

[tcglkn]

Re: The Book of Batman (Bruce Wayne)(II) - Design

I'm not in any hurry on Awesome Android right now.