When will Cormin be added to the SoV Display Thread?
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Soldiers of Valhalla - nominations and discussion
- Thread starter Scytale
- Start date
When will Cormin be added to the SoV Display Thread?
Done. Sorry, I was waiting for Cormin to have a Book before adding him to the thread and must've missed that one had been created for him.
Hate to bug, but wondering how Ashi-Dhulu was doing. I heard that someone else is looking at him now?
wriggz
Friendly Neighborhood Librarian
There is active testing occurring. We want to ensure we do our due diligence to ensure that submissions meet the high standards set by the SoV, and such testing takes time.
I can assure you AshI has full priority right now, but as a great wizard once said: "A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."
Nominating Kon-Tar-Na:
The figure used is the Confrontation: Creatures of Dirz - Dasyatis Prime. Here is a photo that shows the coloration of the mini, which is quite Marro-ish. Here is a high-detail photo; that one was painted so the colors are no longer accurate, but you can see the detail. The mini very much looks like a skinless Marro to me.
There has been some (well, one person anyway) pushing back on whether this looks like a Marro, at least in coloration. It's not quite as orangish as some, but even in coloration Marro have a decent amount of variation. This is more on the pink side of things, and (obviously, given the source) matches the Gnids quite well.
Much like the Marro Gnids had some good off-color proxies, I'd consider the Nemesis Evolution, Dasyatis Evolution, and Aberration Prime to all be good proxies to use for this mini.
I've tested this one a decent amount. I think I could reasonably price it 5 or 10 points lower but 150 feels pretty safe. He's very strong in some matchups, but Taste of Blood can be difficult to trigger in some matchups (either because of high defense or because your opponent spreads out). He's very good at taking out low-defense ranged stuff that clumps up, of course. Pairing him with TKN makes for an interesting army since he thrives on the irregular terrain that the big Hivelord hates.
I did make him Relentless, so he also bonds with Death Knights. He's much better with his grubby munchies than with the Death Knights, though.
I think this is obvious from the wording, but you may only use Taste of Blood once per activation. So a maximum of two attacks from KTN per OM. The other possibly confusing point is that the intention on Leaping Assault is that it is only available if you use 3 or fewer movement points. This could be stated explicitly, but that would be nonstandard wording. I'll leave that decision to the editors should this get that far.
Thanks in advance to the judges for considering the design. Also, thanks to all those who helped in the design and testing - I couldn't have done it without you.
FYI ..
This figure is on sale at Miniature Market for $3.50
http://www.miniaturemarket.com/rkh-sclv02.html
Nominating Kon-Tar-Na:
FYI ..
This figure is on sale at Miniature Market for $3.50
http://www.miniaturemarket.com/rkh-sclv02.html
Thanks for the heads up on this! I picked one up. This guy looks like a lot of fun to play.
I will say this guy doesn't seem all that Marro to me. The Gnids looked Marro, I get that one. This guy just seems too much of a stretch. I hope I'll change my mind once I have one in hand, because I otherwise really dig it.
wriggz
Friendly Neighborhood Librarian
I vote Nay to the Warforged Champion. The design choice of Uncommon Hero does not feel warranted. Though I respect the desire to add a conditional bonding hero to the Warforged Soldiers.
However, what is it about moving the enemy that causes the Champion to charge? Is he acting as an opportunists, in which case shouldn't he attack the moved figures. Is it that he is moving as part of a formation, in which case having him take a turn from the start zone when the soldiers are on the front line seems odd.
Why is he loyal? That is a bit of an odd choice for a Vydar Unit. Why is he a soldier not a champion? Is it to benefit from Marcus or something else?
The Warforged are ripe for some synergy, and I would love to see a design that is both thematic and synergetic.
However, what is it about moving the enemy that causes the Champion to charge? Is he acting as an opportunists, in which case shouldn't he attack the moved figures. Is it that he is moving as part of a formation, in which case having him take a turn from the start zone when the soldiers are on the front line seems odd.
Why is he loyal? That is a bit of an odd choice for a Vydar Unit. Why is he a soldier not a champion? Is it to benefit from Marcus or something else?
The Warforged are ripe for some synergy, and I would love to see a design that is both thematic and synergetic.
wriggz
Friendly Neighborhood Librarian
Ashi-Dhulu by @MegaSilver
"Burt, it's under the ground! It's an underground monster!" – Kevin Bacon (Tremors)
Balance – Ashi-Dhulu follows in the long tradition of un-synergistic hero figures. The Fen Hydra is the gold standard here and at only 5 more points does out-shine Ashi-Dhulu in many ways. The worm’s ability to auto-destroy common figures and faster movement over elevations make Ashi-Dhulu unique enough to warrant drafting over other similar costed options. On the flip side, Ashi-Dhulu’s weakness against Unique Heavy armies (looking at you Samurai) and low life for a melee unit, keep it from eking out units like Tyrian or Brunak.
I found that there were some match ups where Ashi-Dhulu was a superstar with others where he fell flat. You would think that the worm evolved on Valhalla since Kyrie seem to be its natural prey, as it is able to make short work of these high priced squads. Swarmy melee squads with low attack or even short range squads also seemed to struggle, with the Goblin Cutters being a notable exception. I did considerable testing with Common Hero heavy builds, since this where I felt Devour could be most overpowered. I’m happy to say that in multiple runs I never found wyrmlings, elementals or other common heroes completely outclassed. There were a few times where Ashi-Dhulu did significant damage, but this was at the cost of losing all board control as the worm ate up order-markers as fast as it ate tiny dragons.
Creativity – Ashi-Dhulu is one of those “why didn’t I think of that” designs, whose simplicity can mask the creativity. The combination of disengage, underground movement and auto destroying common figures come together to create a figure unlike anything else in Heroscape canon. I especially like when the figure’s class and personality aren’t just added to artificially enhance theme, but rather flow from the design, which seems to be the case for both Devourer and Menacing. The choice of going with high defense and low life is also worth noting as it makes Ashi-Dhulu more dangerous to low attack commons, while making him weak to high attack heroes.
Theme – While there are some that will liken Ashi-Dhulu to the Worms of Dune, the purple worm will always pull me back to that horror classic, Tremors. One of the most satisfying aspects of playtesting is when a figure’s play matches its theme and in this case Ashi-Dhulu comes up in spades. The unstoppable underground monster popping up all over the map, striking terror into the hearts of commons, is exactly how I would expect a “Graboid’ to play.
My only gripe was the inability to devour Unique Squads. In the era before Fanscape or even D&D, this would have been a deal breaker. However in light of Wyrmlings, Elementals, Thralls and a number of other Common Hero heavy armies, I applaud the decision to go with devouring common figures over squad figures.
Playability – Figuring out how to get the most out of Ashi-Dhulu was a puzzle, which for me is a boon. Leading with Ashi-Dhulu results in giving up valuable board position leaving the rest of your army waiting in the start zone. Conversely, Ashi-Dhulu is not generally suited to clean up, since most common squads are broken at that point, and clean up heroes like Kaemon Awa, Tyrain and the Marro Warriors can pose significant challenges. This leaves Ashi-Dhulu as a second wave figure, used interspersed with Bread and Butter units or after earlier sharks have fallen.
In this role, playing Ashi-Dhulu presents many choices from requiring clever (and sometimes lucky) order marker management to deciding how best to use Devour. It is interesting to note that on high ground Ashi-Dhulu’s normal attack has a 76.6% chance to destroy a common figure with 4 defenses and 84.6% for a 3 defense figure, meaning that Devouring and giving up high ground is not always the best choice. The constant consideration Devour demands made Ashi-Dhulu an interesting figure to play and play against.
Speaking of playing against Ashi-Dhulu, this is where the figure really shines. A player that attempts to rush the purple worm without thought to position or follow up attacks will be quickly devoured. Excuse my age, but playing against Ashi-Dhulu really does remind me of the scene in Tremors where Kevin Bacon and his friends have to pole-vault across rocks to avoid being eaten. There were a few times where opponents had to give up high ground to keep Ashi-Dhulu from claiming that space on the following turn, jumped into a river to avoid being devoured, or spread figures out to avoid follow up attacks after a successful Devour. The most fun was trying to set up worm traps with stray figures on low ground, in order to destroy the purple menace on the following turn.
Summary – Short of running the Elf wizards, maintaining the Roman’s shield wall or lining up Mimring’s Fireline Special Attack, there are few units that impact the strategic elements of a game the way Ashi-Dhulu does. By itself that would be enough to warrant giving Ashi-Dhulu a try, however when coupled with excellent thematic design both on the card and on the battlefield this is one worm I would recommend bringing to dinner.
I vote
to induct SoV
"Burt, it's under the ground! It's an underground monster!" – Kevin Bacon (Tremors)
Balance – Ashi-Dhulu follows in the long tradition of un-synergistic hero figures. The Fen Hydra is the gold standard here and at only 5 more points does out-shine Ashi-Dhulu in many ways. The worm’s ability to auto-destroy common figures and faster movement over elevations make Ashi-Dhulu unique enough to warrant drafting over other similar costed options. On the flip side, Ashi-Dhulu’s weakness against Unique Heavy armies (looking at you Samurai) and low life for a melee unit, keep it from eking out units like Tyrian or Brunak.
I found that there were some match ups where Ashi-Dhulu was a superstar with others where he fell flat. You would think that the worm evolved on Valhalla since Kyrie seem to be its natural prey, as it is able to make short work of these high priced squads. Swarmy melee squads with low attack or even short range squads also seemed to struggle, with the Goblin Cutters being a notable exception. I did considerable testing with Common Hero heavy builds, since this where I felt Devour could be most overpowered. I’m happy to say that in multiple runs I never found wyrmlings, elementals or other common heroes completely outclassed. There were a few times where Ashi-Dhulu did significant damage, but this was at the cost of losing all board control as the worm ate up order-markers as fast as it ate tiny dragons.
Creativity – Ashi-Dhulu is one of those “why didn’t I think of that” designs, whose simplicity can mask the creativity. The combination of disengage, underground movement and auto destroying common figures come together to create a figure unlike anything else in Heroscape canon. I especially like when the figure’s class and personality aren’t just added to artificially enhance theme, but rather flow from the design, which seems to be the case for both Devourer and Menacing. The choice of going with high defense and low life is also worth noting as it makes Ashi-Dhulu more dangerous to low attack commons, while making him weak to high attack heroes.
Theme – While there are some that will liken Ashi-Dhulu to the Worms of Dune, the purple worm will always pull me back to that horror classic, Tremors. One of the most satisfying aspects of playtesting is when a figure’s play matches its theme and in this case Ashi-Dhulu comes up in spades. The unstoppable underground monster popping up all over the map, striking terror into the hearts of commons, is exactly how I would expect a “Graboid’ to play.
My only gripe was the inability to devour Unique Squads. In the era before Fanscape or even D&D, this would have been a deal breaker. However in light of Wyrmlings, Elementals, Thralls and a number of other Common Hero heavy armies, I applaud the decision to go with devouring common figures over squad figures.
Playability – Figuring out how to get the most out of Ashi-Dhulu was a puzzle, which for me is a boon. Leading with Ashi-Dhulu results in giving up valuable board position leaving the rest of your army waiting in the start zone. Conversely, Ashi-Dhulu is not generally suited to clean up, since most common squads are broken at that point, and clean up heroes like Kaemon Awa, Tyrain and the Marro Warriors can pose significant challenges. This leaves Ashi-Dhulu as a second wave figure, used interspersed with Bread and Butter units or after earlier sharks have fallen.
In this role, playing Ashi-Dhulu presents many choices from requiring clever (and sometimes lucky) order marker management to deciding how best to use Devour. It is interesting to note that on high ground Ashi-Dhulu’s normal attack has a 76.6% chance to destroy a common figure with 4 defenses and 84.6% for a 3 defense figure, meaning that Devouring and giving up high ground is not always the best choice. The constant consideration Devour demands made Ashi-Dhulu an interesting figure to play and play against.
Speaking of playing against Ashi-Dhulu, this is where the figure really shines. A player that attempts to rush the purple worm without thought to position or follow up attacks will be quickly devoured. Excuse my age, but playing against Ashi-Dhulu really does remind me of the scene in Tremors where Kevin Bacon and his friends have to pole-vault across rocks to avoid being eaten. There were a few times where opponents had to give up high ground to keep Ashi-Dhulu from claiming that space on the following turn, jumped into a river to avoid being devoured, or spread figures out to avoid follow up attacks after a successful Devour. The most fun was trying to set up worm traps with stray figures on low ground, in order to destroy the purple menace on the following turn.
Summary – Short of running the Elf wizards, maintaining the Roman’s shield wall or lining up Mimring’s Fireline Special Attack, there are few units that impact the strategic elements of a game the way Ashi-Dhulu does. By itself that would be enough to warrant giving Ashi-Dhulu a try, however when coupled with excellent thematic design both on the card and on the battlefield this is one worm I would recommend bringing to dinner.
I vote
to induct SoV
Ashi-Dhulu by @MegaSilver has received 4 Yea votes to induct (Scytale, Soundwarp SG-1, vegietarian18, and wriggz) and moves on to final United Fanscape review.
Last edited:
Nominating Kon-Tar-Na:
FYI ..
This figure is on sale at Miniature Market for $3.50
http://www.miniaturemarket.com/rkh-sclv02.html
Thanks for the heads up on this! I picked one up. This guy looks like a lot of fun to play.
I will say this guy doesn't seem all that Marro to me. The Gnids looked Marro, I get that one. This guy just seems too much of a stretch. I hope I'll change my mind once I have one in hand, because I otherwise really dig it.
After having this guy in my hands, I'm going to change my tune a little bit. This guy is quite passable as a Marro figure. It's not perfect, but its close enough to convince me.
Is he being tested on a peanut base? Or just a large circular one?
Also... I'm a rookie figure painter. If I wanted to dull his bright blue/pink colors to try and match the Marro a little closer, would a light black wash do it? Or, in the opinion of you better painters, should I do something more? I'm thinking I might have to brush over some of the blue since it's more of a surface color.
D&D style large single spaced base.
(I've been eyeballing my version of this mini the last few days, trying to decide the best way to go about re-basing him. Those who have already done it - any advice? I tried to push the pegs out from underneath but no dice. I could just get the exacto knife and cut him out but I want to make sure that's the best way to go.)
I don't know about being a better painter, but I have done some marro before. If your willing to put in a few extra steps you can have the skin looking very close. A flesh basecoat, plus a sepia wash then a red wash (wipe the red wash off of high surfaces, let it pool in the cracks) makes for very nice marrow skin.
That's the conclusion I came to as well. The coloring isn't quite right, but the detail on the figure is quite marro-ish.
I exacto'ed it. But then, I always do that.
Kinseth
3-Time Online HS Champion & Diplomacy Winner of La
I like to think Marro's can have different skin color, just like humans or orcs...
Sir Heroscape
Sir Formerly Known As adoney
First time doing this. I would like to nominate my custom Tetraites for your consideration, SoV.
Tetraites was a renowned gladiator in Rome; known for his use of minimal armor and fighting bare-chested. His fame reached as far as England and France when he defeated the mighty Prudes. It was at this moment of victory and glory that Utgar summoned him to Valhalla, eager to make use of him in Taelord's Coliseum. Rather than miss the world he once knew, Tetraites relished the opportunity to spill the blood of not just man, but elf, dwarf, beast and giant alike. His name would be known, his name would be feared, his name is Tetraites.
He is the Shoanti Gladiator from the Lost Coast Pathfinder Battles line.
- Balance His base stats are kept in line with the other gladiators for a fair understanding of point value, but he is costlier because of his ability to help control Squad swarming. His one special allows him to handle heroes, squads or a hero and a squad at the same time.
- Playability His one power reads clearly and fits both his fighting style and figure. The power is used from C3G's Hogun and fits perfectly with his choice of weapon and personality. He’s fun to play because of his ability to deal auto wounds to nearby figures and help out squads. But aside from bonding, he’s a strong solo figure as well, holding his own against a single hero or squad.
- Creativity A wild gladiator that follows Utgar just speaks thematic for me. As another historical figure, he fits right in with the lore behind summoning the strongest heroes to the war on Valhalla. How fitting for Utgar to summon him away as soon as he reached the peak of his fame and glory, only to be put into another arena on another world. But unlike the other rebellious gladiators, he’s quite content with his new “calling” and revels at the opportunity to spill the blood of his foes. Not only does he provide another bonding option for the Capuans, but his wild personality gives him more versatility in Dreadgul builds for bonding with them.
- Theme He lived on Earth as a gladiator, and now lives on Valhalla as a gladiator in Taelord’s Colesium. His opponents feared him on Earth, and now that he’s on Valhalla, he will do everything in his power to prove his dominance. So far, he has not lost a fight, and looks forward to the day that he gets to meet his other gladiator brothers on the battlefield.
- Accessibility The miniature is part of the Lost Coast Pathfinder Battles line, and from my research among numerous online stores there are 34 known available figures, with an undisclosed stock on paizo.com. On their website, I was able to input 99 units of this figure and go through checkout (without paying of course) and no error or adjusted quantity was given. This suggests the paizo.com has a numerous stock of this figure. If that were not the case than I’m sure there would have been some sort of message letting me know. But there you have it.
Thank you for your consideration.
For what it's worth, the 99 input on paizo does not reflect their stock. You actually have to email them to get an actual number. I am confident that the numbers for this guy is sufficient regardless.
I like the design and the theme. My gut says the points may be a touch high but I'm more than willing to test it. I vote YES to review.
I like the design and the theme. My gut says the points may be a touch high but I'm more than willing to test it. I vote YES to review.
A question before I vote. Is Tetraites supposed to be able to hit himself with Bludgeoning Strike? Technically the wording currently allows him to. If not, I'm sure Editing in C3V can handle it, so it's not a deal-breaker in any sense. Just verifying intent.
Lazy Orang
Hard as ice
Either way it doesn't seem relevant, as I can think of literally no situation in which anyone would ever want to do that.