Fourth World Workshop (New Gods/Apokolips)

[IAmBatman]

Others I'd suggest adding:
Amazing Grace, Glorious Godfrey, and Virmin Vunderbar. If you've seen Young Justice, you're familiar with Godfrey.

Still applies:

If you have write ups for them, I’ll be happy to link them.

 

[IAmBatman]

Two of the biggest ones that both intrigue and elude me are Metron and Desaad.

For some context on their potential power sets:

Like most of the New Gods, Metron is immune to all diseases, being virtually immortal. His advanced physiology makes him stronger and more disease-resistant than humans. Metron has demonstrated numerous god-like abilities somewhat inconsistently throughout his history. Metron is a super genius who has explored the universe and gained a vast amount of knowledge. Although Himon is his superior at devising scientific theories, Metron surpasses Himon as a creator of inventions based on scientific theories. Metron travels in his flying Mobius Chair, which enables him to travel through time, outer space, and other dimensions. Its tractor beams are powerful enough to carry a planet along behind the chair and can create an impenetrable energy wall. Metron has also created incredible technological wonders that are too numerous to mention here.

Although DeSaad doesn't have great powers, he is still immune to all diseases, toxins and is extremely long-lived. He is also stronger and more resistant than a human of his weight and build. DeSaad is a brilliant inventor of weapons and master of torture. DeSaad has created a lot of torture machines and devices. His most spectacular achievement is "Happyland", an amusement park that served as a prison for his victims. The prisoners were anguished over the seeming indifference of the park's customers to their plight unaware that DeSaad's technology caused the visitors to see them as something other than what they were. As the closest Darkseid assistant, DeSsad is familiar with the functioning and resources of the planet.

The New 52
In the New 52, DeSaad reappears with the status of a New God, but much more powerful and showing new abilities. DeSaad is strong and resistant enough to lift several tons easily and can face powerful beings like Power Girl. In addition, he has a high level of invulnerability and is functionally immortal. The new DeSaad's powers include telepathy, absorption and control of emotions. DeSaad is able to enter people's minds to manipulate their emotions and feed on their worst feelings, even without manipulating them becomes more powerful. He has demonstrated the ability to create illusions, either in its real form, or in the form of other people. Another of his powers is the absorption of energy, he can feed on different types of energy and even manipulate it, as was demonstrated when it absorbed energies from a particle accelerator on Earth-2. Although it isn't explained, DeSaad can open a "Boom Tube" to other dimensions at will, only when he is at maximum power.

 

[MrNobody]

APOKOLIPTIAN TORTURE
When rolling attack dice for a normal attack against an opponent’s figure, if DeSaad rolls a skull on every die, that opponent may immediately reveal and remove one unrevealed Order Marker from any Army Card that opponent controls. If your opponent does not reveal and remove an Order Marker, the defending figure receives 2 wounds before defense dice are rolled.

Eh, not really in love with this but it’s something.

If I remember correctly, DeSaad is less about getting information and more about breaking spirits. Maybe something could be done with that?

 

[johnny139]

Absolute shot in the dark for Metron:

MOBIUS CHAIR
Instead of moving with Metron, you may place him on any empty space on any battlefield in the game, or on any Army Card. Order Markers may always be placed on this card as long as Metron is not destroyed.

...I don't know what, exactly, you can do with that. Maybe let him fiddle with units while he's on their cards? I think it's interesting grounds for a dimension/timeline/universe traveler.

 

[IAmBatman]

Absolute shot in the dark for Metron:

MOBIUS CHAIR
Instead of moving with Metron, you may place him on any empty space on any battlefield in the game, or on any Army Card. Order Markers may always be placed on this card as long as Metron is not destroyed.

...I don't know what, exactly, you can do with that. Maybe let him fiddle with units while he's on their cards? I think it's interesting grounds for a dimension/timeline/universe traveler.

The bolded part is true regardless, right?

I do like what you're going for there. Fun/weird interactions with any extra-dimensional things we've come up with.

It'd probably be better if he could DO something while on the cards, though, right? Like roll a D20 and if he hits a certain roll he can place a Wound Marker on that card or remove any marker from that card, but if he rolls too low he takes a wound and is put back on his own card?

Pair that with Temporal Defense and maybe a small third power?

 

[IAmBatman]

APOKOLIPTIAN TORTURE
When rolling attack dice for a normal attack against an opponent’s figure, if DeSaad rolls a skull on every die, that opponent may immediately reveal and remove one unrevealed Order Marker from any Army Card that opponent controls. If your opponent does not reveal and remove an Order Marker, the defending figure receives 2 wounds before defense dice are rolled.

Eh, not really in love with this but it’s something.

If I remember correctly, DeSaad is less about getting information and more about breaking spirits. Maybe something could be done with that?

I definitely think a torture power should be the core of him. I'm seeing shades of Apokolyptian technology and Shakedown here, which I think are the correct powers to draw from. It might be interesting to even have him have an Attack of 1 to go with that power ....

 

[johnny139]

Oh yeah, you'd definitely want something more in the mix. Placing/removing wounds is one, maybe OMs as well? I dunno, it's a jump-off point.

Temporal Defense is definitely a good idea for him, based on my limited experience.

If I remember correctly, DeSaad is less about getting information and more about breaking spirits. Maybe something could be done with that?

That could be interesting.

SPIRIT BREAKER
Start the game with 9 black Torment Markers on this card. After attacking an adjacent Unique Hero with Desaad, if that Hero received a wound, you may place a Torment Marker on their card. If a figure has at least:
- 1 Torment Marker on their card, subtract 2 from their Move Number.
- 2 Torment Markers on their card, subtract 2 from their Attack Number.
- 3 Torment Markers on their card, negate all powers on that Army Card.

 

[IAmBatman]

Slightly tweaking the Desaad torture power language:

APOKOLIPTIAN TORTURE
When rolling attack dice for a normal attack against an opponent’s figure, if DeSaad rolls a skull on every die, that opponent may immediately reveal and remove one unrevealed Order Marker from any Army Card that opponent controls. If your opponent does not reveal and remove an Order Marker, the defending figure immediately receives 2 wounds before rolling defense dice.

Looking through the index I also can't help but notice that the Parademon Shock Troopers have really odd wording for their Apokolyptic Weaponry power ("When rolling attack dice, if Parademon rolls a skull on every die, the defending figure immediately receives one unblockable hit before rolling defense dice.")

I'm not sure "unblockable hit" is used anywhere else on an offensive power. It's primarily found on Counter Strike type powers.

 

[IAmBatman]

Oh yeah, you'd definitely want something more in the mix. Placing/removing wounds is one, maybe OMs as well? I dunno, it's a jump-off point.

Temporal Defense is definitely a good idea for him, based on my limited experience.

If I remember correctly, DeSaad is less about getting information and more about breaking spirits. Maybe something could be done with that?

That could be interesting.

SPIRIT BREAKER
Start the game with 9 black Torment Markers on this card. After attacking an adjacent Unique Hero with Desaad, if that Hero received a wound, you may place a Torment Marker on their card. If a figure has at least:
- 1 Torment Marker on their card, subtract 2 from their Move Number.
- 2 Torment Markers on their card, subtract 2 from their Attack Number.
- 3 Torment Markers on their card, negate all powers on that Army Card.

Oooh, that's nasty. Feels pretty sadistic, though, which feels spot on. (Sadistic has got to be his personality, btw).

 

[IAmBatman]

OK, so stringing both of those together into something kind of interesting ....

NAME = DESAAD
SECRET IDENTITY =

SPECIES = NEW GOD
UNIQUENESS = UNIQUE HERO
CLASS = TORMENTOR
PERSONALITY = SADISTIC
SIZE/HEIGHT = MEDIUM 5

LIFE = 6
MOVE = 5
RANGE = 1
ATTACK = 1
DEFENSE = 5
POINTS = 200

SPIRIT BREAKER
Start the game with 6 black Torment Markers on this card. After attacking an adjacent Unique Hero with Desaad, if that Hero received a wound, you may place a Torment Marker from this card on that Hero’s card. If a figure other than Desaad has at least:
- 1 Torment Marker on their card, subtract 2 from their Move Number.
- 2 Torment Markers on their card, subtract 2 from their Attack Number.
- 3 Torment Markers on their card, negate all powers on that Army Card.

APOKOLIPTIAN TORTURE
When rolling attack dice for Desaad's normal attack against an opponent’s figure, if you roll a skull on every die, that opponent may immediately reveal and remove one unrevealed Order Marker from any Army Card that opponent controls. If your opponent does not reveal and remove an Order Marker, the defending figure immediately receives 1 wound before rolling defense dice.

DARKSEID'S ELITE
Once per player turn, immediately after Desaad or an Invader figure you control rolls combat dice, you may reroll one of those dice that does not show a skull.

SUPER STRENGTH

 

[japes]

Our card template only hold 8 markers by the way. Not that we can't accommodate more with some wiggling but if 9 was picked arbitrarily and not for a specific reason I'd prefer if we limited it at 8

 

[IAmBatman]

8 seems fine to me. Three negations in a game would be a lot. Editing.

 

[MrNobody]

Well I wasn’t expecting both of those powers to be on the same card, but hey, it works! Is DeSaad mostly just known for torture or are there other essential elements of the character that need to be covered? He’s basically your standard Starscream-type treacherous 2nd in command type, right?

 

[IAmBatman]

Wikipedia really emphasized his torture and that is what I knew of him going in so I figured just go all in on it.

 

[MrNobody]

Wikipedia really emphasized his torture and that is what I knew of him going in so I figured just go all in on it.

Yeah that obviously seems to be the most major element, but I can’t really say either way. I’m personally just guessing at these characters right now, so I might just bite the bullet and do a New Gods/Forever People read-through soon. It’s something I’ve been looking for an excuse to do for a long time.

 

[ALEXAN2507]

Well I wasn’t expecting both of those powers to be on the same card, but hey, it works! Is DeSaad mostly just known for torture or are there other essential elements of the character that need to be covered? He’s basically your standard Starscream-type treacherous 2nd in command type, right?

As far as I remember there's no treachery involved with DeSaad, the sadism is definitely the core component of the character I've ever seen

 

[johnny139]

I'm planning on reading Kirby's original New Gods sometime soon, so I'll probably be able to contribute. But "torture guy, Darkseid loyalist" are the two bigger bits I know.

His second power dealing two wounds seems like an odd match with his first power - you couldn't reasonably get all three markers on anyone with less than 7 Life.

 

[MrNobody]

I agree, I think with both powers on the same card it should be 1 wound.

From reading Wikipedia, DC Wiki, and ComicsVine, I got the feeling he wasn’t really loyal to Darkseid as much as anything that gave him more power. He poisoned Darkseid’s lover at the beginning, manipulates and actively sabotages Kalibak to keep himself in power, and tries to take the Omega power from Darkseid at one point. I honestly just don’t know though.

 

[ALEXAN2507]

I agree, I think with both powers on the same card it should be 1 wound.

From reading Wikipedia, DC Wiki, and ComicsVine, I got the feeling he wasn’t really loyal to Darkseid as much as anything that gave him more power. He poisoned Darkseid’s lover at the beginning, manipulates and actively sabotages Kalibak to keep himself in power, and tries to take the Omega power from Darkseid at one point. I honestly just don’t know though.

Huh, treacherous he is then it seems
I was unaware of these

 

[IAmBatman]

I'm planning on reading Kirby's original New Gods sometime soon, so I'll probably be able to contribute. But "torture guy, Darkseid loyalist" are the two bigger bits I know.

His second power dealing two wounds seems like an odd match with his first power - you couldn't reasonably get all three markers on anyone with less than 7 Life.

Unless they have healing, of course. That said, getting one and two markers on someone is still plenty effective. The three marker deal is going to be the rarer/home run effect, like when Mister Sinister places four markers.

 

[IAmBatman]

That said, I'm cool with reducing the Torture power to 1 wound. It's powerful enough one an attack of one that it's probably a good idea anyway.

 

[MrNobody]

Does anyone want to talk about a Darkseid II? What would you want to see in a design like that? I guess I'd want to see a higher point Event Hero that serves as a sort of brutal leader for Apokolips units and maybe has something to do with the Anti-Life Equation.

I think something different and unique could be done with the "kill or be killed" nature of Apokolips and Darkseid himself. Maybe some way the other New Gods could vie for Darkseid's favor?

 

[IAmBatman]

I would think something with the Anti-Life Equation and some synergy with his "Elites" would be appropriate. That said, I wouldn't mind seeing just reverse synergy where the other New Gods we bring in boost up the current one (whom I still hold as excellent).

 

[MrNobody]

I'd like that approach too. Darkseid I is one of my favorites from the original Master Set (At least in the top 13!) and some boosting would really push him from powerhouse to absolute monster. Reverse synergy would also really work well with the theme that all the Elites are "serving" Darkseid.

It would be nice to have the Anti-Life Equation playable in some form or another, even if it's not on a Darkseid card. After all, he spends most of the time looking for it, not actually having it.

 

[IAmBatman]

For instance, I just threw this onto Desaad's write up:

DARKSEID'S ELITE
Once per turn, if you control Darkseid, then immediately after Darkseid or any New God or Parademon figure you control within 4 clear sight spaces of Darkseid rolls dice for a normal attack, you may reroll one of those dice that does not show a skull.