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Doctor Strange

Re: Doctor Strange - Design

Haven't heard any complaints about the changes so let's:

I propose a vote for Initial playtesting
 
Re: Doctor Strange - Vote for Initial Playtesting

Quick wording tweak on the first ability:

EYE OF AGAMOTTO
After Doctor Strange inflicts 1+ wounds with a normal attack, you may view all Order Markers on the defender’s card and move up to 1 of them to another card controlled by the same player.

Could also say "another active card on the same team" but not sure that one matters so much.

yea
 
Re: Doctor Strange - Vote for Initial Playtesting

Quick wording tweak on the first ability:

EYE OF AGAMOTTO
After Doctor Strange inflicts 1+ wounds with a normal attack, you may view all Order Markers on the defender’s card and move up to 1 of them to another card controlled by the same player.

Could also say "another active card on the same team" but not sure that one matters so much.

yea

updated the OP with the above change
 
Re: Doctor Strange - Vote for Initial Playtesting

I'll just mention it again, I'd prefer we keep him at 310 if possible rather than 300 for army building reasons.

yea
 
Re: Doctor Strange - Vote for Initial Playtesting

If he's going to change I'd rather it be down to 300 than up. Since 5 & 10 point spells do exist.
 
Re: Doctor Strange - Vote for Initial Playtesting

He's currently 310, the change some people seem to want for undefined reasons are bring him down to 300. The spells are actually what make him being an non-00 design work well. 00 designs are often added to a build as their own point block, leaving no room for spells.
 
Re: Doctor Strange - Vote for Initial Playtesting

Put me in the "he's got basically all new abilities, so cost him what he's worth" camp. :) Is there like a go to build we're worried about losing here like I was with Trinity stuff?
 
Re: Doctor Strange - Vote for Initial Playtesting

He's currently 310, the change some people seem to want for undefined reasons are bring him down to 300. The spells are actually what make him being an non-00 design work well. 00 designs are often added to a build as their own point block, leaving no room for spells.

I think posts 40 to 45 sum a lot of 1.0 issues up.

But in my and others opinion he's in the unfun territory. 6 life with Magic Def., multiple Oder Marker Removal(which 2.0 will hopefully have a lot less of), and Special power shutdown. We'll have to see how he plays in playtesting but I could see him dropping down more than 300 points.
 
Re: Doctor Strange - Vote for Initial Playtesting

He's currently 310, the change some people seem to want for undefined reasons are bring him down to 300. The spells are actually what make him being an non-00 design work well. 00 designs are often added to a build as their own point block, leaving no room for spells.

I think posts 40 to 45 sum a lot of 1.0 issues up.

But in my and others opinion he's in the unfun territory. 6 life with Magic Def., multiple Oder Marker Removal(which 2.0 will hopefully have a lot less of), and Special power shutdown. We'll have to see how he plays in playtesting but I could see him dropping down more than 300 points.


Not why we are changing his design, why some people want him at specifically 300 points. Going under 300 might work as well, but currently a perfect 300 point figure doesn't do much of anything for the Avenger Starter Deck army building. No one else ends in 00 and only the two extremes of Wasp at 50 & Hulk at 450 fall into those complementary numbers.
 
Re: Doctor Strange - Vote for Initial Playtesting

He's currently 310, the change some people seem to want for undefined reasons are bring him down to 300. The spells are actually what make him being an non-00 design work well. 00 designs are often added to a build as their own point block, leaving no room for spells.

I think posts 40 to 45 sum a lot of 1.0 issues up.

But in my and others opinion he's in the unfun territory. 6 life with Magic Def., multiple Oder Marker Removal(which 2.0 will hopefully have a lot less of), and Special power shutdown. We'll have to see how he plays in playtesting but I could see him dropping down more than 300 points.


Not why we are changing his design, why some people want him at specifically 300 points. Going under 300 might work as well, but currently a perfect 300 point figure doesn't do much of anything for the Avenger Starter Deck army building. No one else ends in 00 and only the two extremes of Wasp at 50 & Hulk at 450 fall into those complementary numbers.

To clarify, because I think some wires might be mixed here, is your issue:

1. Just with the change in price from 310 to 300

or

2. With the actual ability changes?

Speaking for myself, I have no problem with him ending up at 310 and am fine working for that goal if we have specific teams that want him at that total. But the 1.0 version of the character needed mechanical changes.
 
Re: Doctor Strange - Initial Playtesting

Agree 100% on changing the design. Points were the discussion for me.
 
Re: Doctor Strange - Initial Playtesting

Gotcha. I thought so, but I think that was getting lost somewhere in the shuffle. So basically set the goal at 310 here for team building? Seems fine
 
Re: Doctor Strange - Initial Playtesting

2 games in so far. The good doctor is 0-2 I'm Avengers builds against the Fantastic Four. One was a blowout because Thor decided he just wanted to rollover and die. Mystic Arts power is strong but pretty easily countered.
 
Re: Doctor Strange - Initial Playtesting

Yeah, I figured that's how Mystic Arts would roll. But if you can screen him off, seems like a good way to get some nice shots in on Mister Fantastic. Sounds like Thor's dice didn't cooperate with that plan, though. :p
 
Re: Doctor Strange - Initial Playtesting

What if instead of an engagement restriction, you had to reveal an X on his card to shut down stat boosts? Then Reed engaging him wouldn't stop him from being a Sue counter, you just have to put an OM on Strange and reveal the X when it's his turn.
 
Re: Doctor Strange - Initial Playtesting

I'd worry the counter would move into unfun levels of effectiveness in certain match ups at that point.
 
Re: Doctor Strange - Initial Playtesting

Outside of Sue's +4, most boosts are just +1 or maybe +2 and aren't as game changing as Sue is. Could have him prevent re-rolls too since he's more likely to be facing Red Skull than Cap in themed games.

Side question for clarification, you also can't add a skull/shield/blank via an ability either correct? Not just more dice when rolling.
 
Re: Doctor Strange - Initial Playtesting

Fan Four and Lantern Corps are both hit pretty hard by the counter. Obviously lots of stuff gets around their defense entirely, but usually for smaller amounts of wounds at a time.
 
Re: Doctor Strange - Initial Playtesting

3rd game was planned against a Star-Lord Guardians of the Galaxy build. Star-Lord, Gamora, Groot and Rocket.
 
Re: Doctor Strange - Initial Playtesting

C3G STANDARD PLAYTEST FEEDBACK FORM

NAME OF THE PLAYTEST UNIT: Doctor Strange

Version tested:
Spoiler Alert!


Army Test
Map: Turtle Training Dojo
Units: 1000 pts – Doctor Strange 300, Captain America 240, War Machine 260, Falcon 190, Spells 10 pts – Lightning Bolt x2 VS 1000 pts - Fantastic Four 2.0
Spoiler Alert!

___________________________________________________________​

Army Test
Map: Wakandan Royal Forest
Units: 1000 pts – Doctor Strange 300, Thor 430, Hawkeye 220, Wasp 50 VS Fantastic Four 2.0
Spoiler Alert!

___________________________________________________________​

Army Test
Map: Conflict Chernobyl
Units: 1000 pts - Dr Strange 300, She-Hulk 370, Wasp 160, Moon Knight 170 VS 1000 pts – Star-Lord 250, Rocket Raccon 175, Groot 275, Gamora 300
Spoiler Alert!


GENERAL THOUGHTS ON THE TESTED UNIT: I really enjoyed playing Dr Strange in this newer version. His new powers are a little less of the “unfun” variety while still having the thematic strength that they should have. Magical Defense 1 is a reuse and still works fine. The Eye of Agamotto has changes where you don't need to swap out a wound or wounds and you move an order marker to another opponent card vs removing it. It does make for some fun game decisions. The Master of the Mystic Arts power now keeps you from adding to a figures attack and defense within 6 spaces. I played this as not only canceling the addition from other figures powers(Captain America, Star-Lord, etc) but also height bonus, shadow bonus, and line of sight defensive bonus. It also is a power that can be countered by a flying figure pretty easily. Even with a solid screen, a flier can pop over and tie him down. I wonder if adding Stealth or Disengage to him would make sense as a counter to the counter? Dr Strange went 1-2 and felt like 300 points was pretty good. A few more tests should be able to lock him in.
 
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Re: Doctor Strange - Initial Playtesting

I propose we move to Playtesting at 300 points
 
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