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D2 - changes in the base size

RichardD

New member
I thought that it might as well have it's own thread, as I can see this issue generating a fair amount of internet traffic.

FWIW, I'd rather the bases didn't change. I don't buy the "it'll bring in more players and grow the market" line; that's some excuse dreamt up by a beancounter. People won't choose to buy a pack of HS figures simply because of smaller bases. And the idea that the new bases are the only size suitable for use in other tabletop games has obviously come from someone how hasn't noticed that Games Workshop have been using base sizes almost identical to "old" 'scape bases for the best part of 25 years without going broke.

There are two and a half obvious downsides. The fact that the figures will no longer match all the rest of our HS figures. The face that smaller bases are less stable in use. And I've no idea if the effect on gameplay (the smaller the bases, the more opportunity to micromanage the position of the figures on their hexes) is a good thing or a bad thing.

So why is it being done? Well, as I said we can ignore the official line. My view is that it's to help deal with the scale issues. By making the bases smaller, it makes the figures themselves look larger, which goes some way to avoiding the obvious comparisons between "classic" 'scape and D&D Minis retreads. It works only until you line the figures up next to one another, I suspect.

Of course, I'll still buy them. But I'd rather this particular change wasn't happening. It won't fool anybody, it won't benefit anybody, and simply isn't necessary IMO.
 
My response from the other thread:

Making other games compatible with Heroscape="Great customs!"

Making Heroscape compatible with other games="Heroscape should be for Heroscape, not for people to play in other games!"

I fail to see the logic in this. As far as I can tell, The bases do not change the game in anyway. Why is that something to quit Heroscape over?
 
Yeah it is highly improbable that the primary reason other gamer's are not playing HS is because of the bases. It also contributes the pattern of HS losing its uniqueness:

-Step 1: Emilination of Classic Figures
-Step 2: Changing the Bases
-Step 3: ?

WOTC should just say that they are doing it to increase efficiency since it is more efficient to have 2 lines use the same bases than different ones
 
You don't buy changing the bases to bring in more players? I'm no economist but I see that as the only logical reason.
 
WOTC should just say that they are doing it to increase efficiency since it is more efficient to have 2 lines use the same bases than different ones

They won't be using the same bases. Any D&D minis coming out will still have the normal black base, while Heroscape minis have the harder plastic base with the decal on top.

I forgot to mention there was a huge positive base change in this wave....

The numbers are finally on the bottom of the Double Spaced figures!
 
I forgot to mention there was a huge positive base change in this wave....

The numbers are finally on the bottom of the Double Spaced figures!

Maybe others are more aware than me but until the Hydra I never even knew the double space bases even had numbers.
 
Well it started with the Feral Troll, that was the only one before the Hydra. All the DS figs in D1 had the numbers on the side of the base.
 
Yeah it is highly improbable that the primary reason other gamer's are not playing HS is because of the bases.

It doesn't have to be the primary reason, only A reason. Given that companies do not typically just throw things against the wall and hope they stick, I would suspect that they have some market research that tells them that there are others that would consider using these figures if they were more compatible.

Like many, I would prefer they don't change, but it also isn't something that will deserve the fit that some fans will throw regarding them. I suspect that a vocal minority will get up in arms, but to the general buying public, it won't be a blip on the radar.

WOTC did this a few years back with their Star Wars line. They changed to square bases for one expansion (though for different stated reasons). No, I was not especially fond of them, but in the end, it really didn't matter. The game is still the game.
 
Like I said in the other thread, it makes perfect sense.

It's going to bug me to no ends, but it makes sense. I think I may have an undiagnosed case of OCD or something that makes me want official bases for every single custom I use, also... :p


The numbers are finally on the bottom of the Double Spaced figures!

Well, there's that, haha! :p
 
When was this idea first proposed?

Why wouldn't this have been done with MS3?

There are lots of possible reasons. How well will the MS3 set sell? How will it be received by D&D folks?

Just guessing, but I suspect they wanted so see whether there would be some demand by D&D players for these figures. The new bases says that there was/is.

Or, if you wish to be more cynical, maybe the MS3 did not go over well with the D&D folks and it did not expand the game, so maybe they are looking at possible reasons why and came up with this is a possiblity (and having figures not fitting on the gameboard would be a pretty big negative IMO).

Remember that sometimes good ideas (or new ideas if you don't think this is a good idea) come later in the process.

As I said, I don't like the change, but I take it as a good sign that they are continuing to work towards ways to keep HS viable.
 
What I'm wondering is, why do the larger figures still get the old double hex base?

And I think those who believe that this won't increase sales for HS are wrong. Like it's been mentioned here before, we might not like it, but we are not the majority. Even the majority HERE aren't the 'majority'!...put it this way: I wouldn't be surprised to find that the majority of the MINORITY of casual DnD'ers and Scapers who don't use this site are more numerous than those here. That's not saying our opinion is invalid; it just means that WotC must market to them to have HS worth it's weight.

That's just the way it is.

As for me, I don't really care about the bases. It's not like they're black or anything. They're not squares.

But...in my opinion, this is the first 'blunder' of WotC with the HS line. While the smaller bases can be explained by the powers that be as a move to incorporate the figures to the DnD players out there (which is actually mildly offensive, that we're pandering to DnD players), it still makes little sense to me.

The figures that are included in D2 aren't your typical bread n' butter DnD creatures...so exactly 'which' DnD players are you trying to get to buy these? And the larger creatures still have the same old style base.

I wouldn't be surprised if DnD players are indifferent to it, but you just know that most HS players aren't going to be pleased. And this isn't me trying to be negative. If you were to ask those of us here what we'd think of new, smaller bases for future waves, I'm almost certain we'd get negative response. Yet, if you tack on the fiscal reality of "..would you take the new bases, realizing that the failure to increase the popularity of HS among DnD players is pivotal to the surviability of the HS line"...you'd get a lot of 'supporters', if only because half of nothing is nothing.

I mean, be honest with yourself. Who here who owns a decent amount of Scape would actually have wanted these new bases? The simple fact that they don't match your hundreds of other figures is good enough reason for me to go "meh".

But again, there's the bottom line: the people out there in consumer land truly outnumber us. There must actually be more DnD players out there who will now go, "Cool, I can finally use these figures with my DnD maps." and their dollars will speak far louder than any of us here who would have preferred our HS line to maintain its previous look.
 
What I'm wondering is, why do the larger figures still get the old double hex base?

Most minis games use circular bases, so to make HS figures usable in other games, they'd have to have circular bases.

And that just wouldn't work very well for HS. :p
 
What I'm wondering is, why do the larger figures still get the old double hex base?

And I think those who believe that this won't increase sales for HS are wrong. Like it's been mentioned here before, we might not like it, but we are not the majority. Even the majority HERE aren't the 'majority'!...put it this way: I wouldn't be surprised to find that the majority of the MINORITY of casual DnD'ers and Scapers who don't use this site are more numerous than those here. That's not saying our opinion is invalid; it just means that WotC must market to them to have HS worth it's weight.

That's just the way it is.

As for me, I don't really care about the bases. It's not like they're black or anything. They're not squares.

But...in my opinion, this is the first 'blunder' of WotC with the HS line. While the smaller bases can be explained by the powers that be as a move to incorporate the figures to the DnD players out there (which is actually mildly offensive, that we're pandering to DnD players), it still makes little sense to me.

The figures that are included in D2 aren't your typical bread n' butter DnD creatures...so exactly 'which' DnD players are you trying to get to buy these? And the larger creatures still have the same old style base.

I wouldn't be surprised if DnD players are indifferent to it, but you just know that most HS players aren't going to be pleased. And this isn't me trying to be negative. If you were to ask those of us here what we'd think of new, smaller bases for future waves, I'm almost certain we'd get negative response. Yet, if you tack on the fiscal reality of "..would you take the new bases, realizing that the failure to increase the popularity of HS among DnD players is pivotal to the surviability of the HS line"...you'd get a lot of 'supporters', if only because half of nothing is nothing.

I mean, be honest with yourself. Who here who owns a decent amount of Scape would actually have wanted these new bases? The simple fact that they don't match your hundreds of other figures is good enough reason for me to go "meh".

But again, there's the bottom line: the people out there in consumer land truly outnumber us. There must actually be more DnD players out there who will now go, "Cool, I can finally use these figures with my DnD maps." and their dollars will speak far louder than any of us here who would have preferred our HS line to maintain its previous look.
Good well stated post.
 
What I'm wondering is, why do the larger figures still get the old double hex base?

Most minis games use circular bases, so to make HS figures usable in other games, they'd have to have circular bases.

And that just wouldn't work very well for HS. :p


...well that makes perfect sense, come to think of it.

I'm pretty sure they would if they could, but HS is one of the few games to use hexes, so...
 
Well I no longer think of the changed bases as a deal breaker, but depending upon what they look like in person I may decide to re-base them with some extra Rotv bases that I have.

I might be completely satisfied with the change though, I will just wait and see.

Would changing the bases to heroscape bases make them not turny eligible? (not that I will ever have time to go to one)
 
I was at my FLGS the other day taking a look at the D&D single minis they had available.

I realized that with the new bases, I wouldn't be surprised if you started seeing Heroscape figures in those cases available for singles purchases just like the D&D and SW minis in some stores.
 
I was at my FLGS the other day taking a look at the D&D single minis they had available.

I realized that with the new bases, I wouldn't be surprised if you started seeing Heroscape figures in those cases available for singles purchases just like the D&D and SW minis in some stores.

Well that would be a very very positive change indeed!

After I get my head around the issue maybe I can come to terms with it...
 
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