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Consolidated List of Problems With The Renegade AOA Roll Out

Yeah, that's what I assumed too. I tried to phrase my rant so as not to point the finger at any particular person or team. To clarify, I'm not saying the design team screwed up, but whoever botched the naming is making players feel like the design team screwed up. Regardless of where the designs started and who worked on them at earlier stages, the final products are Renegade's responsibility; sadly it's pretty clear that they don't really understand Heroscape on a deep enough level to pull it off.
 
nyys said:
I'm inclined to think that the team we know designed the AoA units didn't have all the say in unit names, if any. My guess is that came higher up the chain, where we all know, tends to have folks who think they know, when they clearly don't.
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They have stated as such before. They had no say in the unit names.
 
We always had proposed names attached to our designs. Almost always, those names were changed. Sometimes IMO for the better, but not always.

Miraculously, one of the few names that they did not touch was the Admiral: Admiral EJ-1M, who I named for our dear departed Jim.
 
I get being critical of Renegade and wanting what's best for the game, but I honestly think it's a bit crazy how intensely people are taking this Kyrie naming thing. It's just a design choice that isn't explicitly good or bad until there are some deep important balance repercussions, even if you find it personally annoying.
They're undead Kyrie. For the purpose of the gameplay mechanics, this means they're undead, but thematically and lore-wise, they are still Kyrie. Just undead ones. It's still allowed to be called a Kyrie box. Psyduck is a water type pokemon even though he has some psychic powers. It's not a huge misunderstanding of what makes Pokemon work to make this choice.
 
chas said:
To me, if you call someone a "Kyrie Warrior," they are a Kyrie and a Warrior! So far that's not a rules problem because nobody bonds with Kyries as such. Yet.
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I want to touch on this because I've seen other games do it.

At the end of the 3rd edition of Warmachine, names, titles, and descriptions of units counted for their synergy.

It very quickly lead to unintended consequences and balance issues. As much as it would help a lot of Scape units, I don't think it would be healthy for Scape long term.
 
The_X_Marker said:
I want to touch on this because I've seen other games do it.

At the end of the 3rd edition of Warmachine, names, titles, and descriptions of units counted for their synergy.

It very quickly lead to unintended consequences and balance issues. As much as it would help a lot of Scape units, I don't think it would be healthy for Scape long term.
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:coffee: This is exactly why I brought it up, although some posters don't get that it could be a problem in the future.
 
The_X_Marker said:
It very quickly lead to unintended consequences and balance issues. As much as it would help a lot of Scape units, I don't think it would be healthy for Scape long term.
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Hopefully Renegade won't go that level of crazy.
 
Agreed. It would have to have been done properly and carefully, and early enough in the product's life that it didn't create new problems. (Now is too late.) Anyway, I'm definitely not trying to say that these new figures should be treated as Kyrie; according to the rules, they are not Kyrie, period. I'm trying to say that Renegade (or whoever ultimately named them) had no business putting Kyrie in their titles, because it's a lie. A mismatch. (And a potentially clueless one at that; I wouldn't be a bit surprised if the publisher thinks they do count as Kyrie.) It's crossing a new line that wasn't crossed before and it has already created interpretation problems, even among players who are so into the game that they hang out in these forums. Just imagine the thousands of players who will never come to Heroscapers and never read the FAQ. Some of them will be playing wrong, and may not even find out until they get the rug pulled out from under them the first time they try to use one of those synergies in a tournament. Ouch.
 
That's not the only such oddity in the new names. Knight Irene isn't a Knight. Such as it is. At least Bok-Bur-Na (class Captain) is not still "First Officer Bok-Bur-Na" as he was in the Haslab.
 
Just_a_Bill said:
Agreed. It would have to have been done properly and carefully, and early enough in the product's life that it didn't create new problems. (Now is too late.) Anyway, I'm definitely not trying to say that these new figures should be treated as Kyrie; according to the rules, they are not Kyrie, period. I'm trying to say that Renegade (or whoever ultimately named them) had no business putting Kyrie in their titles, because it's a lie. A mismatch. (And a potentially clueless one at that; I wouldn't be a bit surprised if the publisher thinks they do count as Kyrie.) It's crossing a new line that wasn't crossed before and it has already created interpretation problems, even among players who are so into the game that they hang out in these forums. Just imagine the thousands of players who will never come to Heroscapers and never read the FAQ. Some of them will be playing wrong, and may not even find out until they get the rug pulled out from under them the first time they try to use one of those synergies in a tournament. Ouch.
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I don't know how to tell you this man but they are Kyrie. That's just not their in-game class. Calling it a 'clueless lie' that indicates to you that the publisher doesnt even understand the rules is so needlessly dramatic.
 
Everyone is missing the big picture on the new Kyrie. They’re all girls! I have decided to give them all more girly nicknames based on the fact that players already call Loviatak “Lovi”. So the others are now Kili (Kilkorax), Glini (Glinerva), Misy (Misaerx), Xixi (Xiamara), Mimi (Mielki, which probably didn’t need to be shortened), and Qiqi (pronounced ‘Kiki’, Queen Qhyrion).
 
Scytale said:
That's not the only such oddity in the new names. Knight Irene isn't a Knight. Such as it is. At least Bok-Bur-Na (class Captain) is not still "First Officer Bok-Bur-Na" as he was in the Haslab.
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The “First Officer” was, I was told at the time, going to be changed.
 
Here's another problem:

Rolling out too much material at one time!

I am trying to keep up on my complete collection of painted units, but that February/April pre-order is just too much/too costly. I am actually putting some figures on the back burner from this order. First time I have ever had to do that in both Hasbro and Renegade days.

Also, does anyone have a coupon code that works on these pre-orders? The 10% off that came with Nexus Ops (great game) is only good for in stock items - no pre-orders
 
P_J_Keller said:
Here's another problem:

Rolling out too much material at one time!

I am trying to keep up on my complete collection of painted units, but that February/April pre-order is just too much/too costly. I am actually putting some figures on the back burner from this order. First time I have ever had to do that in both Hasbro and Renegade days.

Also, does anyone have a coupon code that works on these pre-orders? The 10% off that came with Nexus Ops (great game) is only good for in stock items - no pre-orders
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Yeah, I'm buying some and passing on some too! And if I find someone who bought earlier unofficial 3D prints of AOA figures, and is now buying the official ones, I may offer to buy the unofficial ones from them! Hey, you do what you can.
 
It wouldn't be so bad if the prices weren't astronomical. But I'm worried that sales may be declining and what that means for the future of the game (again.) I haven't seen W2 sold out anywhere yet, and my FLGS even has it at 15% off, painted and regular.

W1 sold out because of nostalgia and because everyone already was in the mindset of making a substantial purchase to support the return of HeroScape. Now Renegade is going to find out how many times they can go back to that well. Especially because we're paying substantially more for the Haslab contents and its being stretched out forever. I think there's a decent chance the W1 reprint won't sell out and will end up on sale, as well as W2. It will be interesting to see if W2 has sold out before W3 is released. Either way, I expect W3 sales to be even slower.

When the game was in its original state, I would buy 4 of each common and terrain pack, and two of each unique pack. For a typical wave I would end up with 14 boosters, at $12.99, that comes out to around $182. 1 of each set of RenW3 is going to be twice that.

I am really apprehensive about common units and suspect it will be unrealistic to buy 4x like I used to. The question is will anybody invest in common squads if they're as expensive as the uniques, especially seeing as how you really need multiples to get the full effect of commons and that means double the investment.

The terrain is a whole different story. It's pretty pricey too, but it could probably survive as a product even if the HS mini game were cancelled.
 
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