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C3V/SoV-inclusive Power Rankings

dok

dok

GenCon Main Event Champion - 2010, 2011, & 2017
Site Supporter
Almost all of you are familiar with the power rankings that spider_poison began and Jexik continued. What follows here is an effort at creating a new set of power rankings that includes the custom figures from the C3V and SoV projects. Much of the credit for these rankings, of course, goes to the creators of the original power rankings, upon which all of this is based.

These rankings are maintained by me and do not reflect the consensus views of the C3V project. That said, I will be attempting to maintain and update these rankings based on feedback and, especially, tournament results.

EDIT: I've done a complete overhaul of the rankings. In the process of putting together the updated Delta pricing spreadsheet, I refined my thinking about what these tiers mean, and I decided to take a fresh look at the rankings with that in mind.

While I haven't gotten around to doing an overhaul of the formatting, it's silly to leave the "real" rankings parked way down thread, so I'll put the updated rankings here and maybe get around to formatting stuff at some later date.

A+

Deathreavers
Isamu
Major Q9
Marro Warriors
Raelin the Kyrie Warrior (RoTV)

A

10th Regiment of Foot
4th Massachusetts Line
Cathar Spearmen
Fen Hydra
Fyorlag Spiders
Greenscale Warriors
Grimnak
Heavy Gruts
Kaemon Awa
Knights of Weston
Major Q10
Marcu Esenwein
Marro Stingers
Me-Burq-Sa
Nerak the Glacian Swog Rider
Nilfheim
Quahon
Sir Gilbert
Vulcanmech Incendiborgs

A-

Airborne Elite
Axegrinders of Burning Forge
Azazel the Kyrie Warrior
Azurite Warlord
B-11 Resistance Corps
Black Wyrmling
Blade Gruts
Blastatrons
Boreos
Braxas
Cyprien Esenwein
Darrak Ambershard
Death Chasers of Thesk
Eldgrim the Viking Champion
Gladiatrons
Guilty McCreech
Heracles
Krav Maga Agents
Kuthnak
Laglor
Marcus Decimus Gallus
Mezzodemon Warmongers
Microcorp Troopers
Mimring
Mogrimm Forgehammer
Phantom Knights
Roman Legionnaires
Rygarn
Varkaanan Greyspears

B+

Alastair MacDirk
Arktos
Arrow Gruts
Asterios
Atlaga the Kyrie Warrior
Augamo
Brute Gruts
Bol
Buccaneers of Tortuga
Clayton Pierce
Corvor the Tainted One
Crixus
Dreadgul Raiders
Eltahale
Fire Elemental
Goblin Cutters
Havech Eradicators
Kate Crawford
Krug
Louis "Mad Dog" Malone
Major J15
Marrden Nagrubs
Mohican River Tribe
Moltenclaw
Morgan's Riflemen
Morgoloth
Ne-Gok-Sa
Ogre Pulverizer
Pel the Hill Giant
Red Wyrmling
Syvarris
The Varja
Tor-Kul-Na
Ulfrid Hornwrangler
Varkaanan Quickblades
Varkaanan Swiftfangs
Warforged Soldiers
Zelrig
Zetacron

B

12th Caucasus Rifles
Acolytes of Vorganund
Agent Skahen
Air Elemental
Arkmer
Avernus
Bahadur
Beorn Boltcutter
Bugbear Basher
Brave Arrow
Brunak
Capuan Gladiators
Charos
Count Raymond
Deathcommander Mark 3
Finn the Viking Champion
Goblin Slashers
Haduc
Heirloom
Himmelskralle
Honor Guard of the Blasted Lands
Horned Skull Brutes
Hrognak (unmounted)
Izumi Samurai
James Murphy
Johnny "Shotgun" Sullivan
Josie Whistlestop
Kon-Tar-Na
Kurrok the Elementalist
Kursus
Makwa Tribesman
Marro Dividers
Marro Drones
Marutuk
Minions of Utgar
Nakita Agents
Nhah Scirh Cultsts
Nicholas Esenwein
Othkurik The Black Dragon
Racheim
Re-Tak-Shi
Sacred Band
Samuel Brown
Sentinels of Jandar
Shieldsmiths of Granite Keep
Sir Hawthorne
Skull Demon
Talingul
Van Nessing
Varkaanan Darkclaws
Venoc Vipers
Venoc Warlord
Warriors of Ashra
Water Elemental
White Wyrmling
Wildwood Monarch
Wildwood Runner
Wildwood Sentinel
Zombies of Morindan

B-

8th Infantry Pathfinder
Anubian Wolves
Ashi-Dhulu
Ashigaru Harquebus
Aubrien Archers
Axentia
Breach
Cal the Smuggler
Capt. John Varan
Command Courier
Concan the Kyrie Warrior
Crypt Guardian
Drow Chainfighter
Durgeth Ravagers
Frost Giant of Morh
Gen. Simon Fraser
Gorillitroopers
Hoplitron
Ice Troll Berserker
Jorhdawn
Kantono Daishi
Kira Jax
Koggo
Kyntela Gwyn
Lilja
Locksley
MacDirk Warriors
Marrden Hounds
Master Lao Xin
Motley Max
Ogre Warhulk
Olog
Omegacron
Omnicron Repulsors
Ornak
Quorik Warwitch
Red Mantis Blade Dancers
Sentinels of Grax
Shadow Binder
Shadow Fiend
Shurrak
Siiv
Sonya Esenwein
Spartacus
Specters of Aldorn
Sgt. Drake Alexander (SotM)
Tandros Kreel
Tarn Viking Warriors
Teeth of the Makwa
Thorgrim the Viking Champion
Ulginesh
Valguard
Wastewalker Gage
Wyvern
Xualtiaca Fire Ants
Zaeus
Zettian Infantry

C+

20th Maine Volunteers
53rd North Carolina Sharpshooters
Amberhive Protectors
Ana Karithon
Achillean Gladiatrix
Armoc Vipers
Arthur of Sherwood
Ashigaru Yari
Banshees of Durgeth Swamp
Beakface Rogue
Beakface Sneaks
Bloodburst Thrall
Blue Wyrmling
Bramcephys
Brontos
Chardris
Clawfoot Interceptor
Darkprowl Thrall
Death Knights of Valkrill
Deepwyrm Drow
Deltacron
Earth Elemental
Elaria the Pale
Emirroon
Executioner 616
Jotun
Kato Katsuro
Kha
Kozil
Kozuke Samurai
Kumiko
M-43 Resistance Fighters
Maltis Tez
Microcorp Agents
Migol Ironwill
Millerson
Morsbane
Ninjas of the Northern Wind
Nottingham Brigand
Omnicron Snipers
Otonashi
Patrick Ferguson
Protectors of Ullar
Raelin the Kyrie Warrior (SotM)
Red Ants of Aunstrom
Rendar Fy
Seleena
Sgt. Drake Alexander (RoTV)
Shadow Hound
Shaolin Monks
Siege
Sir Orrick
Soontir Van
Sonlen
Suskra
Swaysil
Swog Rider
Su-Bak-Na
Taelord the Kyrie Warrior
Tagawa Samurai
Tagawa Samurai Archers
Tetraites
Theracus
Tornak
Tomb Skeleton Archers
Tombstone Gunslinger
Tyrian the Kyrie Warrior
Varkaanan Blade Dancers
Warden 816
Xundar
Yi Feng
Zettian Deathwings
Zettian Guards
Zhen Yuan

C

Agent Carr
Akumaken
Brimstone
Calibrax the Kyrie Warrior
Chen Tang
Deathstalkers
Deathwalker 8000
Ebon Armor
Eilan Sidhe
Emperor Andask
Estivara
Evar Scarcarver
Garrett Burns
Gorillinators
Gothlok
Granite Guardians
Greater Ice Elemental
Hrognak (mounted)
Iron Golem
Jarek Guy
Knights of Blackgaard
Manauvi
Marro Drudge
Marro Hive
Master Win Chiu Woo
Mind Flayer Mastermind
Myrddin
Quasatch Hunters
Ranjit Singh
Retiarius
Rhogar Dragonspine
Shiori
Sir Denrick
Skeletons of Annellintia
Tomoe Gozen
Torin
Urk
Viceron the Blood Knight
Werewolf Lord
Wolves of Badru
Z'Thoth, Mouth of the Abyss
Zombie Hulk

C-

Brandis Skyhunter
Deadeye Dan
Deathstrike Thrall
Deathwalker 9000
Dumutef Guard
Einar Imperium
Erevan Sunshadow
Feral Troll
Grigor & Rogirg
Gurei-Oni
Kee-Mo-Shi
Kelda the Kyrie Warrior
Major X17
Marro Gnids
Martial La Hire
Mok
Moriko
Obsidian Guards
Otar
Parmenio
Prince al'Kahora
Priscus
Rechets of Bogdan
Roman Archers
Shades of Bleakwoode
Sharwin Wildborn
Sujoah
Tomb Skeletons
Tul-Bak-Ra
Uzog
Zogross Hardscale

D

Acolarh
Arashara Goshiri
Cormin the Dark
Cxurg'gyath
Deathwalker 7000
Dünd
Dzu-Teh
Elite Onyx Vipers
Empress Kiova
Iskra Esenwein
Khosumet the Darklord
Master of the Hunt
Mika Connour
Pelloth
Preyblood Thrall
Runa
Saylind the Kyrie Warrior
Sir Dupuis
Sudema
Templar Cavalry
Wo-Sa-Ga

F

Grok Riders
Hatamoto Taro
Sahuagin Raider


Previous rankings, with all their pretty formatting and commentary:
Spoiler Alert!
 
Last edited:
I like how these power rankings are similar to the ones on my blog. Although I haven't done the blog for thee last 3 units, I'm sure they would be similar.

I'm thinking the Gnids are getting a little too much credit, as guys like Q10 or Q9 will laugh at them, and now even the elf wizards with Haduc will be even more of a threat to them. I'm not seeing how they are a B+ unit yet, sorry :?
 
Thanks dok, awesome work.

When people will have learned to use them well, I think the Blade Dancers will go closer to the HSB.

On the other hand, I am still convinced that the need for a double line of sight when using Directed Fire (both Omegacron and the attacking figure must have LOS) makes Omegacron weaker that he seems.

I have added the rankings for Van Nessing and Kira in their book.
 
*Theoryscape Alert!* (hey - it's what I do, right?)

I just don't know about the Resistance fighters at B. Now, I haven't played a single game with them, but I just look at a 3-figure, 2 attack ranged squad and can't help feeling the Tagawa Samurai Archers all over them. I know they're mobile and they can get around screens, but anything they're shooting at that's behind a screen can probably shrug off 2 attack without much trouble anyway, and mobility is only so good in this game it seems (just ask the Gorillinators).
 
killercactus said:
*Theoryscape Alert!* (hey - it's what I do, right?)

I just don't know about the Resistance fighters at B. Now, I haven't played a single game with them, but I just look at a 3-figure, 2 attack ranged squad and can't help feeling the Tagawa Samurai Archers all over them. I know they're mobile and they can get around screens, but anything they're shooting at that's behind a screen can probably shrug off 2 attack without much trouble anyway, and mobility is only so good in this game it seems (just ask the Gorillinators).
Click to expand...
I'll admit that the choice was B versus B- with them, for sure. However, the TSAs are at B-, and I'm comfortable asserting that the M-43's special powers are worth one notch more than counterstrike. Priority Targeting means that getting attacks with height advantage is much easier than it is otherwise. And Guerrilla Tactics is more than just "mobility" - it's zombie-style mobility that allows you to move figures from the back while attacking with figures at the front.

That said, consider them on the watch list.
 
Their mobility is incredibly useful. EDIT: You can fire on a target, then move other figures up to engage your opponent, or bring up new figures to replace figures that will be destroyed or engaged in the next turn. Of course, the possibilities go beyond that, but they're a very mobile squad.
 
Does Van Nessing justify an increase of the Werewolf Lord to a rank of B? Drafting both of these heroes is a 245 point investment (with decent stats, if not limited attacks), but it bestows a 50% chance of your WL OM's getting a free turn with Van Nessing. Of course, the flip side is that your WL-wielding opponent could also get a turn with Van Nessing, but having 2 opponents with Werewolves seems a bit rare in the competitive scene.

Now, if your opponent also has a WL and Van Nessing, at least you don't have to worry about her taking a free turn with your VN. :)
 
Filthy the Clown said:
Does Van Nessing justify an increase of the Werewolf Lord to a rank of B? Drafting both of these heroes is a 245 point investment (with decent stats, if not limited attacks), but it bestows a 50% chance of your WL OM's getting a free turn with Van Nessing.
Click to expand...
I considered this recently, and almost made the change. The only thing stopping me is that the WL already has a bonding squad. But given that I like Van Nessing more than the WoB, most of the time, it's easy to argue that the 50% Van Nessing activation is more handy than the 100% WoB activation, when you consider the point investment needed. Still, you usually want one OM directly on VN anyway for Divine Mission, so on average you're only getting one extra VN activation per round, even if you put two numbered OMs on WLs.

Like I said, I was very close on this - I was closer to bumping the WL than I was to bumping Kyntela or Ulginesh or Arkmer, FWIW. I'm still open to bumping the WL, but I'd like to see some non-theoryscape results.

Filthy the Clown said:
Of course, the flip side is that your WL-wielding opponent could also get a turn with Van Nessing, but having 2 opponents with Werewolves seems a bit rare in the competitive scene.

Now, if your opponent also has a WL and Van Nessing, at least you don't have to worry about her taking a free turn with your VN. :)
Click to expand...
Ah, interesting point; it's a variant of the Marcu versus Marcu thing.
 
I don't see how VN makes any noticeable change to WL's value. Werewolf Lord's bonding is instead of taking a turn with WL, isn't it? So having a marker on werewolf doesn't add any extra turns--just an almost negligible amount of flexibility.

EDIT: I stand corrected.
 
capsocrates said:
I don't see how VN makes any noticeable change to WL's value. Werewolf Lord's bonding is instead of taking a turn with WL, isn't it? So having a marker on werewolf doesn't add any extra turns--just an almost negligible amount of flexibility.
Click to expand...

Not true. Moon Frenzy will activate the WL and a Hybrid of your choice when it goes off.
 
Ah. I see. I guess I never noticed because WL has always been killed before he got any use in our games.

I still agree with the party that says that his rating is unchanged.
 
Zogross and the Greenscales had a strong showing in Maryland, going 5-0. However, they didn't face the sorts of armies (ranged commons or disengaging melee, most obviously) that would give that army trouble. So, it's definitely on the watch list to move up, but I'd like to see more results.

If anyone else has results from the C3V/SoV figures in a competitive setting, I'd like to see them. The only other use I'm familiar with is the Zombie Hulks that were used in the Michigan Monster Mash event, but they were played as pseudo-commons with full bonding, so I can't really count those results.
 
Sorry.........................

Anyways, I have played the Hulks a couple more time. They may not have great survivability, and their Rise Again power may not work well when large/huge figures don't come into play. But I don't think that they deserve their rank because they are not as worth as much as another squad of zombies. They can deal the damage necessary to bring down heroes that zombies can't bring down with out losing the height that is difficult for them to get in the first place. Their bonding does have its setback, but a clever player can usually play intelligently enough to make it so that you don't get screwed. They may be B+ worthy, although some more playing is necessary to make sure that is certain. They fill a different niche than the ZoM, one that complements the ZoM's playstyle.
 
dok said:
If anyone else has results from the C3V/SoV figures in a competitive setting, I'd like to see them. The only other use I'm familiar with is the Zombie Hulks that were used in the Michigan Monster Mash event, but they were played as pseudo-commons with full bonding, so I can't really count those results.
Click to expand...

Did anyone play this last weekend for NHSD?
 
We played a bunch of C3V stuff at our last game day. It was supposed to be a tournament but it devolved into a regular game day.

I played the following army:

Omegacron 180
3x Repulsors 300
Cyprien 450
Sonya 495

Not enough games/competitive enough of an atmosphere to really say anything, but Omegacron with a mobile screen is pretty decent. Nothing to throw a parade over, but it's a solid B, maybe B+ if played well.

Other people played Omegacron with 1 squad of snipers and a mess of repulsors. There was decent success with that. The player with that army said they really liked having only 1 squad of Snipers, as he thought more would be overkill when you've got a screen.

Varkaans also did well, but not overly. They're good against melee but expensive against range. And range is good against melee and even with range, so you I don't know how competitive the Varkaans can be.

If I'd like to see any of the C3V units really explored competitively, it's definitely Omegacron. He has the most potential.
 
Yesterday I went to the Portland NHDS and brought the 4x mariedians and 2x of each wyrmling plus otonashi. Another guy brought omegacron with 2x snipers 3x repulsors and filler. It was a doubled edged sword format so a lot of the units were B rated with a little bit of A units. I went 5-2 and beat my army twice and lost to it twice. The omegacron army did well I think but I didn't watch his games that much. I think the mariedians are good were they are and are a solid B unit.
 
Nice list. I definitely have to put myself in the group that hasn't figured out how to use the Gnids.

Their greatest flexibility comes with the Marro Hive in play - and that isn't that often.

Without the Hive, they are simply a 4-squad two-attack melee unit. I'd rather spend the 50 points on another Divider or Drone squad.

(I wonder what the probability of kills is for four attacks of two dice vs three attacks of three)

As well, given that you have to have a successful attack AND then kill one of them to make cling work (which means you take engagement away), I just don't see them as a B+ unit.

In fact, I'd rank 'em a C
 
Trust me, the Gnids are definately a "B" unit. You have to swarm with them even without the hive, they get thier points worth...maybe not with kills per se...but making that much easier to for the rest of the Army to kill figures that have been *infected*.
Yes you may lose the engagement when you cling, but your oppnent loses Defense and Movement...and the loss of both makes the Gnids very formidable in every game I've played with them.
 
Filthy the Clown said:
Does Van Nessing justify an increase of the Werewolf Lord to a rank of B? Drafting both of these heroes is a 245 point investment (with decent stats, if not limited attacks), but it bestows a 50% chance of your WL OM's getting a free turn with Van Nessing. Of course, the flip side is that your WL-wielding opponent could also get a turn with Van Nessing, but having 2 opponents with Werewolves seems a bit rare in the competitive scene.
Click to expand...
KC's results clinched it; I bumped the WL to a B. I even considered B+ but B still feels right for now. (If you can beat Robber's 10th, I'll take it to B+. ;))

I've also added the Zettian Infantry, although the book probably won't go up until we have the new card from the C3V art department. I was pretty aggressive in their initial placement - I put them at B+ and bumped their bonding heroes to B. I think most of the SoV judges would have gone a notch or two lower on both counts. We'll see how they do when they get played at events.
 
Of the official figures I think Cyprien value has dropped by a pretty good amount in the era of fan scape. With both the Zettian Infantry and Omegacron allowing more viable soulborg army cores it makes it that much harder for me to take Cyprien to a tournament. If you are going to a tournament that allows C3V-SoV there is a heightened chance of facing one of those builds, because people will obviously want to try out the new units. I also assume Vulcanmech Incendiborgs are soulborgs which will also hurt Cyprien worth. I'm not sure if all that justify a drop in grade, I'm just saying that I would not even think of bringing Cyprien to a tournament were C3V and SoV are allowed, just to risky. In reality time will only tell how the new units affect the meta game and it's affect on official figures.
 
I played a team drafting tournament yesterday and had a good experience just using Nicholas by himself as an assassin. I made several mistakes with him in one of the two games I played. Instead of attacking Q9 I attacked a 2 life Marro Hive which could have been taken out by my teammate. Eventually Nicholas died and my mezzodemons got killed by Q9.

In my other game he took out a ton of Aubrien Archers and a 3 wyrmlings earning his points easily. At the end of the game he was still at full life. He is definitely worth his points just by himself without the Thralls.
 
Zettian Infantry ... I put them at B+ and bumped their bonding heroes to B. I think most of the SoV judges would have gone a notch or two lower on both counts.
Click to expand...

I tried out Zettian Infantry along with DW8K, DW9K, and Warden this weekend vs. a dwarf/M-43 army. While the ZI definitely give a boost to the DW heroes, I found the M-43 thinned their ranks out enough while the Axegrinders advanced to knock out the DW's. I'd definitely rank the M-43 above the ZI.
 
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