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C3G Library This area collects all the released designs. Feel free to post any figure specific questions in their individual books.


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  #61  
Old July 19th, 2020, 12:07 PM
LordVenoc LordVenoc is offline
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Re: The Book of Astral Plane - Design Phase

So the precedent from Levy makes the idea of maps like this "part of the battlefield" and thus counting toward win conditions. Is there a particular reason we don't want it to count? I'd just hate to see some future unit having a power to push something to the plane get majorly affected cost-wise because they could potentially shove a final unit there and end the game.

Player turn feels waaaaaay too fast for wounds. Being there is taxing, but probably shouldn't be that big a death sentence.
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  #62  
Old July 19th, 2020, 12:09 PM
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Re: The Book of Astral Plane - Design Phase

If the Telepath gets shunted off the battlefield but not destroyed (say they get collected by Brainiac), would there be a way to kill the Construct? That would be my guess as to why it doesn’t count towards win conditions.
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  #63  
Old July 19th, 2020, 12:14 PM
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Re: The Book of Astral Plane - Design Phase

Lotta good choices, Tornado! I like the third one in the first set of spoilers, with its sort of hidden "eye" effect. I also really dig that second to last one as well, as it screams "Shadow King" to me!

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DISCLAIMER: C3G claims no ownership of the characters or artwork used for C3G customs. All rights for the characters belong to their respective publishers/creators. C3G cards are not intended for sale, and C3G does not authorize any party to profit from C3G cards.

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  #64  
Old July 19th, 2020, 12:16 PM
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Re: The Book of Astral Plane - Design Phase

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrNobody View Post
If the Telepath gets shunted off the battlefield but not destroyed (say they get collected by Brainiac), would there be a way to kill the Construct? That would be my guess as to why it doesn’t count towards win conditions.
Yeah, that was my thinking. I didn't want there to be a way for figures to be on the Plane by themselves and unreachable for other figures to put the game in a stalemate. I guess Levy allows that already, though?

I didn't think about shunting figures there being a game ending situation. So maybe I'll follow the Levy precedent and make sure any figures that can go to/start out on the Plane have language to deal with the situation I feared.

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DISCLAIMER: C3G claims no ownership of the characters or artwork used for C3G customs. All rights for the characters belong to their respective publishers/creators. C3G cards are not intended for sale, and C3G does not authorize any party to profit from C3G cards.

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  #65  
Old July 19th, 2020, 12:16 PM
LordVenoc LordVenoc is offline
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Re: The Book of Astral Plane - Design Phase

Brainiac is distinctly not part of the Battlefield. This is technically part of the battlefield. Heck I'd say it should be destroyed if your person gets removed from the battlefield like that. Prevents weird issues like Jean transforming. But that's a discussion for over on the construct.

I think part of the question is just on how you want to handle any mechanics for shunting things there. I plan to have a way for things to get out of the Phantom Zone, so that was why my thought came up. Currently, if something manages to get to the Astral Plane, doesn't seem like there's a way for it to come back.
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  #66  
Old July 19th, 2020, 12:30 PM
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Re: The Book of Astral Plane - Design Phase

There's no built in way for things to get to the Astral Plane OR to get off the Astral Plane. That's something the figures would have to do on their own.

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DISCLAIMER: C3G claims no ownership of the characters or artwork used for C3G customs. All rights for the characters belong to their respective publishers/creators. C3G cards are not intended for sale, and C3G does not authorize any party to profit from C3G cards.

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  #67  
Old July 19th, 2020, 12:51 PM
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Re: The Book of Astral Plane - Design Phase

I don’t think the Phantom Zone or whatever should count towards win conditions either. In a Supes story, a character sent to the PZ is pretty much considered “defeated.” Sure, they may break out next week, but in the context of a HS-sized battle, they’re usually done.
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  #68  
Old July 19th, 2020, 12:54 PM
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Re: The Book of Astral Plane - Design Phase

Hmm, OK, so we have precedents with Brainiac's bottle city and with Levy's other dimension. I need to read through both of those and would love to hear of hypothetical designs that could cause problems in either direction. Then we can choose which is least offensive and go with it.

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DISCLAIMER: C3G claims no ownership of the characters or artwork used for C3G customs. All rights for the characters belong to their respective publishers/creators. C3G cards are not intended for sale, and C3G does not authorize any party to profit from C3G cards.

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  #69  
Old July 19th, 2020, 01:11 PM
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Re: The Book of Astral Plane - Design Phase

I guess my argument (thinking more about the PZ than the Astral Plane, but I think it makes sense to consider both in this context) is that “I defeated Zod by sending him to the Phantom Zone so I win the game” feels way more accurate than “I sent Zod to the Phantom Zone, but I still have to go in there and beat him up to win the game.”

Astral Plane is trickier, because I do feel like “You may have beaten us on the physical plane, but I can still win using my Astral Form!” is a valid story to tell. There’s also the mechanical concern of it being too easy to beat your enemy’s strong character just by sending them to the Astral Plane. (I’m essentially imagining a hypothetical design that’s Angstrom Levy, but for the AP.)

I will be a but cheeky and point out that the two characters we have that are most similar thematically to this system, Freddy and Dormammu, don’t count towards win conditions when they’re in their own “planes.”
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  #70  
Old July 19th, 2020, 03:40 PM
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Re: The Book of Astral Plane - Design Phase

The cleanest way to tell the "I need to beat you on the Astral Plane" story is through a game played entirely on the Astral Plane, I think. Much like if you ever felt the need to defeat Dormammu in the Dark Dimension, you'd have to play a game on a Dark Dimension map.

Freddy and Dormammu are two voices for consistency with what I have here, yeah. So those are two points in your column versus LV's.

Let's review how Freddy and Dormammu word it, as well as what Levy and Brainiac do. Back with a post that covers all that in a minute here.

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DISCLAIMER: C3G claims no ownership of the characters or artwork used for C3G customs. All rights for the characters belong to their respective publishers/creators. C3G cards are not intended for sale, and C3G does not authorize any party to profit from C3G cards.

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  #71  
Old July 19th, 2020, 03:53 PM
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Re: The Book of Astral Plane - Design Phase

OK, so what it basically amounts to is Brainiac, Freddy, and Dormammu all put figures on cards so they're in the player's army but not "under their control," thus they don't count towards win conditions. This happens pretty cleanly and within the game rules as is.

Levy sends you to another dimension that is not on a card, but a set of physical spaces, and thus has the cleaner precedent. However, his also has built in mechanics for returning you to the battlefield.

However, bringing Levy's precedent into things makes it unclear how powers that just affect figures on the battlefield without space or clear sight restrictions work with the Astral Plane. So I think there are two potential directions we can go in here:

A. As it is right now. It's not a part of the battlefield and doesn't count for win conditions.

B.

SETUP:
The Astral Plane is intended to be playable as a standalone map or an addition to other battlefields. When playing the Astral Plane with another battlefield, it is considered part of that battlefield, but remains physically separate. Simply place the the battlefields side by side in the play area, unconnected.

SPECIAL RULES

OTHERWORLDLY PLANE
Only a Telepath or a figure with the Magical Defense special power can affect the Astral Plane or figures occupying the Astral Plane while not occupying the Astral Plane.

At the end of each Player's turn, roll one unblockable attack die against any figure you control occupying the Astral Plane unless it has the Magical Defense special power or is a Manifestation or Telepath.

If your affected figure started the game on a battlefield other than the Astral Plane and you roll a blank, immediately place that figure in any empty space in your Start Zone, if possible.

-----------------------------
Now that I typed it all out, I'm strongly leaning towards the flavor and flexibility that comes from Option B.

C3G can be played with official Heroscape, but it's not recommended.


DISCLAIMER: C3G claims no ownership of the characters or artwork used for C3G customs. All rights for the characters belong to their respective publishers/creators. C3G cards are not intended for sale, and C3G does not authorize any party to profit from C3G cards.

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  #72  
Old July 19th, 2020, 04:18 PM
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Re: The Book of Astral Plane - Design Phase

Hmmm...okay. I still prefer these printable maps just not counting towards win conditions, but I don’t hate that either.
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