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  #1  
Old November 5th, 2010, 01:52 PM
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List of Holes Remaining in Unit Design

I really like the reference thread Majora has put together for unreleased classics. I would like to make a similar list of loose ends that focuses on functional holes left in the game, rather than on the flavor and story.

Related lists:
What's Missing by Faction
Unreleased Classics

UNITS THAT COULD USE A BOOST FROM SOME ALLIES
(My criteria is that they are not only low performing - even in draft situations - but also that they are lacking in synergy)
Sudema
Dund
Deathwalker 7000
Deathwalker 8000

FACTIONS THAT ARE MISSING SOMETHING
Ranged vipers
Something to tie the cowboys together
Something to tie the ninjas together
Knight ranged unit
Ranged drow
More World War II units
More primadon-type units
More norse units
A hunter cheerleader
Something to bring the undead together better
Something to make the elf wizards more effective

GENERALS THAT ARE MISSING SOMETHING
Flagbearer for Aquilla
Flagbearer for Valkrill
Dragon for Valkrill
Blue Dragon for Aquilla
Green wyrmling for Ullar
Wyrmling for Valkrill
Wyrmling for Utgar with some sort of fire line ala Mimring and Moltenclaw
Kyrie for Aquilla
Kyrie for Valkrill
Kyrie for Vydar (though possible not due to story reasons)
Ninja for Aquilla
Ninja for Valkrill
Heroes for Valkrill

ABILITIES WITHOUT ENOUGH TARGETS
Greenscale Warriors' bonding references a unique lizardfolk hero and none exists
The Mohican River Tribe has only one, low-cost, bonding target

INCOMPLETE FOR D&D-AS-STANDALONE
Arachnids for Estivara
A unique hero for the Death Knights to bond with (they have only the air elemental from D&D)

ROLES NOT FILLED
Common squad horde counters

Last edited by kenjib; November 11th, 2010 at 04:26 PM.
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  #2  
Old November 5th, 2010, 03:00 PM
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Re: List of Holes Remaining in Unit Design

I really don't see the need to complete EVERY faction. After a while, it gets pretty stale. And besides, one of the things that fascinates me about HS is the cross-factional armies. If every single faction has a melee and a ranged squad, and some hero to tie them together, then HS just won't be as exciting for me. I prefer to play my Knights with 4th Mass, or my Vipers with Mohicans.
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  #3  
Old November 5th, 2010, 03:11 PM
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Re: List of Holes Remaining in Unit Design

It would be great if the customs community could come up with something to fill those gaps. Then submit them to the SoV.

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  #4  
Old November 5th, 2010, 03:18 PM
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Re: List of Holes Remaining in Unit Design

A unique hero for the Death Knights to bond with (they have only the air elemental from D&D)

I thought the Death Knights bonded with Taelord? Also the air elemental is a common hero, not a unique one.

Anyway, most of what you have listed as needed holes makes sence with the exception of the Valkrill units. I would not waste any time trying to make him a real full fledge general. There is just way too much needed to be done to get him even up to the Vydar or Aquilla level general status.

As for needs not listed, there are still a few. I felt like every faction should have had a calvary unit after the Templars & Groks came out. However since those units are not all that well done, I guess we could just ignore that aspect of armies.

One unit I really think that is needed (and I have begun some desing work on but not posted) is a Samuri Hero that makes the Samuri squads more competative as a themed army.

More WWII themed units are a big need IMO. Srg. Drake and the AE are homesick.
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  #5  
Old November 5th, 2010, 03:23 PM
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Re: List of Holes Remaining in Unit Design

The Death Knights also bond with Sir Hawthorne and Khosumet - they're fine.

I want the 9th Elf Wizard - or at least confirmation that the 9th member of the Nine is just Sonlen and he's too awesome to let Ulginesh take over his mind.

As far as a Samurai hero that makes Samurai squads better as a themed army - they tried that. The problem is just that Kato and Taro both cost too much (and Taro is terrible...).

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  #6  
Old November 5th, 2010, 03:38 PM
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Re: List of Holes Remaining in Unit Design

Oh, and I always liked the monkeys with guns idea, it should have a few more units too. One common squad and the flag bearer is not enough.
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Old November 5th, 2010, 04:05 PM
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Re: List of Holes Remaining in Unit Design

Can't these units just be considered the Misfit Faction?
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Old November 5th, 2010, 04:08 PM
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Re: List of Holes Remaining in Unit Design

Quote:
You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to kenjib again.
Thanks.

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  #9  
Old November 5th, 2010, 04:16 PM
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Re: List of Holes Remaining in Unit Design

Quote:
Originally Posted by Frylock View Post
I really don't see the need to complete EVERY faction. After a while, it gets pretty stale. And besides, one of the things that fascinates me about HS is the cross-factional armies. If every single faction has a melee and a ranged squad, and some hero to tie them together, then HS just won't be as exciting for me. I prefer to play my Knights with 4th Mass, or my Vipers with Mohicans.
That's a good point Frylock. I'm not necessarily saying that they should all be filled, just cataloging what areas could potentially be filled.


________________________________________________________


Quote:
Originally Posted by Yodaking View Post
A unique hero for the Death Knights to bond with (they have only the air elemental from D&D)

I thought the Death Knights bonded with Taelord? Also the air elemental is a common hero, not a unique one.
I feel like D&D was cut short and never reached finished what it set out to do. The last section that includes the Death Knights is pointing out which units are incomplete from a pure D&D perspective.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yodaking View Post
Anyway, most of what you have listed as needed holes makes sence with the exception of the Valkrill units. I would not waste any time trying to make him a real full fledge general. There is just way too much needed to be done to get him even up to the Vydar or Aquilla level general status.
I'm just going to go with what's official and go from there. If I start making assumptions, like ignoring Valkrill, then the list gets more narrowly focused on my perspective rather than what's out there.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yodaking View Post
As for needs not listed, there are still a few. I felt like every faction should have had a calvary unit after the Templars & Groks came out. However since those units are not all that well done, I guess we could just ignore that aspect of armies.

One unit I really think that is needed (and I have begun some desing work on but not posted) is a Samuri Hero that makes the Samuri squads more competative as a themed army.
What do you think about what Killercactus said regarding the Samurai? I tend to agree that the problem isn't that they are missing such a unit, it's just that the units they have aren't very good, which is another topic entirely...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yodaking View Post
More WWII themed units are a big need IMO. Srg. Drake and the AE are homesick.
Good thought. I'll add them.

________________________________________________________


Quote:
Originally Posted by killercactus View Post
The Death Knights also bond with Sir Hawthorne and Khosumet - they're fine.
As I mentioned to Yodaking, that was more from a D&D only perspective because I feel like D&D was never really finished and some of the units were left hanging a bit. Do you guys think I should just remove that last section?

Quote:
Originally Posted by killercactus View Post
I want the 9th Elf Wizard - or at least confirmation that the 9th member of the Nine is just Sonlen and he's too awesome to let Ulginesh take over his mind.
Yeah I would like that too but I think that's more the province of Majora's missing classic figures thread.

Quote:
Originally Posted by killercactus View Post
As far as a Samurai hero that makes Samurai squads better as a themed army - they tried that. The problem is just that Kato and Taro both cost too much (and Taro is terrible...).
Yeah I agree. The samurai army is very complete. It just has some flaws, unfortunately.

________________________________________________________


Quote:
Originally Posted by Yodaking View Post
Oh, and I always liked the monkeys with guns idea, it should have a few more units too. One common squad and the flag bearer is not enough.
Yeah the gorillas are one of my all time favorite units theme-wise. I wanted to see more of them too.
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  #10  
Old November 5th, 2010, 04:33 PM
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Re: List of Holes Remaining in Unit Design

For a faction approach to what is present (and what is not), I appreciate the thread that IAmBatman started and passed on to me when he went all C3G on us . The list is long, but it is helpful I think as well.

I think that this is a smart way to approach what is missing in Scape--thanks for putting it together! I agree with those that feel that some holes should just not be filled necessarily--I'm not sure every really needs a cowboy, for example--but it's good to start with a full sense of what holes there are. The decision of whether to fill the hole comes later.

From my faction list the holes that bother me most have to do with things like General figures for some of the larger factions and filling in factions that have been dormant too long, like the Norse faction, imo.
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  #11  
Old November 5th, 2010, 04:47 PM
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Re: List of Holes Remaining in Unit Design

Samurai had Ronin and Mounted units that were never released. Personally I'd like to see those.

I'm sure I can help think of some holes later, but I'm on my way out the door.


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  #12  
Old November 5th, 2010, 05:01 PM
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Re: List of Holes Remaining in Unit Design

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Originally Posted by NecroBlade View Post
Samurai had Ronin and Mounted units that were never released. Personally I'd like to see those.

I'm sure I can help think of some holes later, but I'm on my way out the door.
Talk to the people that designed them, they should still have them lying around somewwhere.

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