Heroscapers
Go Back   Heroscapers > Custom HeroScape Creations > Custom Units & Army Cards
Custom Units & Army Cards Fan-created HS army cards for units, glyphs, and equipment


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #4453  
Old February 20th, 2021, 10:14 AM
Leaf_It's Avatar
Leaf_It Leaf_It is offline
The Real Zombieland
 
Join Date: February 19, 2008
Location: USA - Utah
Posts: 1,616
Images: 5
Leaf_It is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla Leaf_It is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla Leaf_It is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla Leaf_It is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla Leaf_It is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla Leaf_It is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla Leaf_It is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla Leaf_It is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla Leaf_It is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla Leaf_It is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla
Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

I'm glad these Samurai zombies are back. I really liked them the first time. With the removal of the ability to respawn after dying, I wonder if they should be reduced even to 20 points. But I haven't played this version, so I can't be sure that's necessary. I trust your judgement off you believe 25 is the right place.
Reply With Quote
  #4454  
Old February 20th, 2021, 10:46 AM
Scytale's Avatar
Scytale Scytale is offline
Thanksgiving Custom Contest Champion
 
Join Date: August 25, 2006
Location: USA - MN - Rochester
Posts: 10,161
Images: 471
Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth
Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

I liked the previous version, and I like this version as well. I suspect that 25pts is too much as well, but testing will tell.

I think placing them on Samurai cards in the beginning is unnecessary. Just let them respawn from any Samurai once. Putting them on cards does make that easier to remember, but it's not like it's hard to keep apart the "spawned" and "haven't spawned" ones.
Reply With Quote
  #4455  
Old February 20th, 2021, 01:41 PM
Leaf_It's Avatar
Leaf_It Leaf_It is offline
The Real Zombieland
 
Join Date: February 19, 2008
Location: USA - Utah
Posts: 1,616
Images: 5
Leaf_It is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla Leaf_It is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla Leaf_It is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla Leaf_It is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla Leaf_It is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla Leaf_It is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla Leaf_It is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla Leaf_It is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla Leaf_It is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla Leaf_It is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla
Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

Wow. scytale being okay with multiturn memory mechanics? What a time to be alive.
Reply With Quote
  #4456  
Old February 20th, 2021, 03:23 PM
Captain Stupendous's Avatar
Captain Stupendous Captain Stupendous is offline
 
Join Date: May 21, 2015
Location: Country - State - Major City (Town)
Posts: 419
Captain Stupendous wears ripped pants of awesomeness Captain Stupendous wears ripped pants of awesomeness Captain Stupendous wears ripped pants of awesomeness Captain Stupendous wears ripped pants of awesomeness Captain Stupendous wears ripped pants of awesomeness Captain Stupendous wears ripped pants of awesomeness
Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leaf_It View Post
Wow. scytale being okay with multiturn memory mechanics? What a time to be alive.
The craziness of 2021 continues!
Reply With Quote
  #4457  
Old February 20th, 2021, 04:00 PM
Astroking112's Avatar
Astroking112 Astroking112 is online now
 
Join Date: March 15, 2011
Location: USA - TX - Dallas
Posts: 2,945
Images: 38
Blog Entries: 58
Astroking112 is a penguin with a machine gun Astroking112 is a penguin with a machine gun Astroking112 is a penguin with a machine gun Astroking112 is a penguin with a machine gun Astroking112 is a penguin with a machine gun Astroking112 is a penguin with a machine gun Astroking112 is a penguin with a machine gun Astroking112 is a penguin with a machine gun Astroking112 is a penguin with a machine gun Astroking112 is a penguin with a machine gun Astroking112 is a penguin with a machine gun
Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leaf_It View Post
I'm glad these Samurai zombies are back. I really liked them the first time. With the removal of the ability to respawn after dying, I wonder if they should be reduced even to 20 points. But I haven't played this version, so I can't be sure that's necessary. I trust your judgement off you believe 25 is the right place.
Thanks for the encouragement! I found them to be pretty fun, too, and a cheaper price but limited respawns should maintain the playstyle about as well as possible. I could easily see them dropping down to 20 points with further playtesting.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scytale View Post
I liked the previous version, and I like this version as well. I suspect that 25pts is too much as well, but testing will tell.

I think placing them on Samurai cards in the beginning is unnecessary. Just let them respawn from any Samurai once. Putting them on cards does make that easier to remember, but it's not like it's hard to keep apart the "spawned" and "haven't spawned" ones.
That's an interesting point on spawning them, and it would improve their synergy with the Unique Samurai a fair bit. Given their limited respawns, I think that it's reasonable enough, albeit it would be a new step for them to not have any specific place for being off of the board nor being destroyed. If it doesn't pose too big of a memory issue, then I'm fine with it.
Reply With Quote
  #4458  
Old February 20th, 2021, 04:23 PM
Leaf_It's Avatar
Leaf_It Leaf_It is offline
The Real Zombieland
 
Join Date: February 19, 2008
Location: USA - Utah
Posts: 1,616
Images: 5
Leaf_It is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla Leaf_It is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla Leaf_It is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla Leaf_It is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla Leaf_It is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla Leaf_It is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla Leaf_It is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla Leaf_It is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla Leaf_It is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla Leaf_It is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla
Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

Quote:
Originally Posted by Astroking112 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scytale View Post
I liked the previous version, and I like this version as well. I suspect that 25pts is too much as well, but testing will tell.

I think placing them on Samurai cards in the beginning is unnecessary. Just let them respawn from any Samurai once. Putting them on cards does make that easier to remember, but it's not like it's hard to keep apart the "spawned" and "haven't spawned" ones.
That's an interesting point on spawning them, and it would improve their synergy with the Unique Samurai a fair bit. Given their limited respawns, I think that it's reasonable enough, albeit it would be a new step for them to not have any specific place for being off of the board nor being destroyed. If it doesn't pose too big of a memory issue, then I'm fine with it.
So if I'm understanding properly, Scytale is saying that they should start on the board, just like the Ebon Armor, and then when they die, they can be placed on a Samurai card, and then return after that samurai dies?



Also just realized that they work with commons, which is pretty neat.
Reply With Quote
  #4459  
Old February 20th, 2021, 04:36 PM
Astroking112's Avatar
Astroking112 Astroking112 is online now
 
Join Date: March 15, 2011
Location: USA - TX - Dallas
Posts: 2,945
Images: 38
Blog Entries: 58
Astroking112 is a penguin with a machine gun Astroking112 is a penguin with a machine gun Astroking112 is a penguin with a machine gun Astroking112 is a penguin with a machine gun Astroking112 is a penguin with a machine gun Astroking112 is a penguin with a machine gun Astroking112 is a penguin with a machine gun Astroking112 is a penguin with a machine gun Astroking112 is a penguin with a machine gun Astroking112 is a penguin with a machine gun Astroking112 is a penguin with a machine gun
Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

My understanding was actually that the suggestion was for Seishin Samurai to still start off of the board (in a hypothetical "haven't spawned yet" pile), and when any Human Samurai dies, a Seishin Samurai that hasn't been placed yet can replace that figure. When a Seishin Samurai dies, it still cannot be placed again.

Reading through it again, I realize now that I'm not quite sure whether the intent was for them to start on the board or not. They're a lot stronger if they get two lives (especially since in the beginning, you could move all of them) and it could get confusing for who is alive for the first time or not, so I don't really like that direction too much.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leaf_It View Post
Also just realized that they work with commons, which is pretty neat.
Yeah, one of the most fun pairings for them is actually with the TSA, who I think really suffer from only having three ranged attacks of 2 and 3D Counterstrike to their name for 65pts. They're not bad, but they definitely feel a bit dull too often for my tastes, and having the added tactics of replacing them upon death (or tying up certain key figures) really makes them feel much more engaging to play.
Reply With Quote
  #4460  
Old February 22nd, 2021, 10:13 AM
Scytale's Avatar
Scytale Scytale is offline
Thanksgiving Custom Contest Champion
 
Join Date: August 25, 2006
Location: USA - MN - Rochester
Posts: 10,161
Images: 471
Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth
Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

Allowing them to start on the board doesn't work with unlimited activations, though obviously that aspect could be limited. Doing that makes them feel too much like Ebons, IMO.

I was definitely thinking they would start off the board. You just need to have a "not spawned" yet pool. Seems fine to me. Though I don't know if the rest of the IS would agree.
Reply With Quote
  #4461  
Old March 9th, 2021, 03:38 PM
Skinderella's Avatar
Skinderella Skinderella is offline
 
Join Date: December 4, 2020
Location: UK - Norwich
Posts: 101
Skinderella knows what's in an order marker Skinderella knows what's in an order marker
Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

I would like some feedback on Valtia, who I’ve been play testing a lot lately and in my opinion is in the final stages getting ready for submission. I’ve had a lot of feedback from the Discord server as she’s gone through various iterations, until landing upon this current version.



Mini is Arcturia from Dungeons and Dragons: Waterdeep: Dungeons of the Mad Mage.

Availability
Spoiler Alert!


Backstory (not finalised, I do plan to write an actual snippet for her)
Spoiler Alert!


Design
Spoiler Alert!


I’d love to know what people think, any and all feedback would be greatly appreciated! I’m at a point with her where I’m confident in this design. She’s been a lot of fun, and really brings out an encompassing swarm play style whilst bringing some big additions for the insects.
Reply With Quote
  #4462  
Old March 9th, 2021, 04:01 PM
Sir Heroscape's Avatar
Sir Heroscape Sir Heroscape is offline
Sir Formerly Known As adoney
 
Join Date: September 14, 2015
Location: U.S - Idaho - Boise
Posts: 7,210
Images: 106
Sir Heroscape is hot lava death! Sir Heroscape is hot lava death! Sir Heroscape is hot lava death! Sir Heroscape is hot lava death! Sir Heroscape is hot lava death! Sir Heroscape is hot lava death! Sir Heroscape is hot lava death! Sir Heroscape is hot lava death! Sir Heroscape is hot lava death! Sir Heroscape is hot lava death! Sir Heroscape is hot lava death! Sir Heroscape is hot lava death! Sir Heroscape is hot lava death!
Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

Glad someone is using/working on this miniature....it's a great one!

As for the design...

Before I go into feedback, I'd ask that you keep an open mind and willingness to hear criticism. I see that this is your first time jumping into the custom scene (at least officially by trying your hand at an SoV submission, hence why you're posting here), and we've had some wonderful individuals in the past get really disheartened because they came here with excitement for their design and then felt slighted when people gave honest feedback. We trust you've done your playtesting and design, but also recognize that looking to make a design Canon through the SoV process does bring the design under a lot of scrutiny and holds it to a much higher standard than just a custom at your own home table. So it's important to recognize as a relatively new designer that we are doing our best to evaluate the design as we see it, which means we may see it differently than you when we compare and contrast with other designs, the overall canon, the mechanics and the gameplay implications.

So with that said, here's what I have to say

I think this is a great first start. It's simple and has some clear synergy with some pretty straightforward powers that aren't overcomplicated. The leftbox stats look fine though I'm not sold on the Wild personality. The right box stats are also pretty standard for what we've seen in other Kyrie Warriors, though the Range 3 has me confused. Nothing in the mini or in the theme you've established really indicates that this should be a Range 3 design.

Butterfly Haze Aura. Why is it called that? if you look at the mini and the design as a whole its confused as to what is actually happening here. She isn't a butterfly...sooo...Now I do see that in your notes you mention it's a swarm of them protecting the other insects, but there's nothing about the mini or the design that would make that ability make sense in terms of theme. Now if you just called it "Magical Barrier" or "Haze Aura" that actually could be justified since she looks like she could be some magical fey-type Kyrie. All that to say, probably just better to remove Butterfly from the power name.

In terms of the power itself, I don't mind the ability as it's pretty simple and pretty restrained by keeping the aura to only 3 spaces.

Swarm Alert. @Scytale I believe this has the same issue as Omegacron right? i.e. we can't activate partial members of squads. This power you could technically move Sujoah, one Ant or a spider or any combination of those.
Reply With Quote
  #4463  
Old March 9th, 2021, 04:01 PM
Scytale's Avatar
Scytale Scytale is offline
Thanksgiving Custom Contest Champion
 
Join Date: August 25, 2006
Location: USA - MN - Rochester
Posts: 10,161
Images: 471
Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth
Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

I feel very strongly about the uniqueness of different types of kyrie, and insect-like Aquilla kyrie is perfect. I'm all for this mini as an Aquillan kyrie.

I'm not sure I love the focus on insects, but it's not bad. Obviously Aquilla has some insects, but just because she has insect wings doesn't mean she needs to work with insects. And how about Arachnids, one of the few buglike things in official 'Scape?

Burrfly Haze Aura is ok. The theme is alright and it's useful. It would be OP if insects had range, but at least so far none of them do.

I'm not really keen on Swarm Alert. The idea is a strong one, and I'm super-happy you limited it to normal attacks, but the lack of a range requirement means you are essentially buying a form of Scatter as a power for all of your Insects as you can just leave Valtia in the starting zone all game (and she can't even get shot at!). There is a place in the game for figures that can sit quietly in the starting zone (until cleanup), but not a big place. Scatter is a really, really good power, and the opponent has no real mitigation strategy. Sure, it can be balanced with Valtia's high cost, but it's just not fun to play against.

Stats are good, but Wild feels off. Also, Why Range 3? That makes her unnecessarily valuable in cleanup.
Reply With Quote
  #4464  
Old March 9th, 2021, 05:29 PM
Skinderella's Avatar
Skinderella Skinderella is offline
 
Join Date: December 4, 2020
Location: UK - Norwich
Posts: 101
Skinderella knows what's in an order marker Skinderella knows what's in an order marker
Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

Thank you both for the feedback!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sir Heroscape View Post
Glad someone is using/working on this miniature....it's a great one!

As for the design...

Before I go into feedback, I'd ask that you keep an open mind and willingness to hear criticism. I see that this is your first time jumping into the custom scene (at least officially by trying your hand at an SoV submission, hence why you're posting here), and we've had some wonderful individuals in the past get really disheartened because they came here with excitement for their design and then felt slighted when people gave honest feedback. We trust you've done your playtesting and design, but also recognize that looking to make a design Canon through the SoV process does bring the design under a lot of scrutiny and holds it to a much higher standard than just a custom at your own home table. So it's important to recognize as a relatively new designer that we are doing our best to evaluate the design as we see it, which means we may see it differently than you when we compare and contrast with other designs, the overall canon, the mechanics and the gameplay implications.
I really appreciate your message here. I have been keeping an eye on here for a while and appreciate the tight rules in order for a design to be great and fit in with the rest of the game and lore. I’m an artist by trade so I feel I can take criticism pretty well and understand how important it is. I know that going in that there will be things I’d never noticed before that someone else questions straight away, or I think something on the design stands out or is obvious in what it does, but outside my own bubble it’s not obvious or doesn’t fit. I can assure you though that nothing said here will dissuade me from continuing the design. If the design was heavily disliked I would simply start from scratch and try again!

Quote:
I think this is a great first start. It's simple and has some clear synergy with some pretty straightforward powers that aren't overcomplicated. The leftbox stats look fine though I'm not sold on the Wild personality. The right box stats are also pretty standard for what we've seen in other Kyrie Warriors, though the Range 3 has me confused. Nothing in the mini or in the theme you've established really indicates that this should be a Range 3 design.
Wild personality is admittedly something I wasn’t sure on. I’ve been aiming for her to be obsessed with insects to an unhealthy degree, and originally her personality was Devout, and has flicked to other things like Merciless, Ruthless, and Driven. Her range 3 specifically matches her aura, the idea behind it is that her swarm that surrounds her is the same thing she uses to attack people by commanding the burrflies to sting her foe. This can be changed of course, but I felt it fitting that she could command the burrflies protecting her to also attack for her.

Quote:
Butterfly Haze Aura. Why is it called that? if you look at the mini and the design as a whole its confused as to what is actually happening here. She isn't a butterfly...sooo...Now I do see that in your notes you mention it's a swarm of them protecting the other insects, but there's nothing about the mini or the design that would make that ability make sense in terms of theme. Now if you just called it "Magical Barrier" or "Haze Aura" that actually could be justified since she looks like she could be some magical fey-type Kyrie. All that to say, probably just better to remove Butterfly from the power name.
Burrfly Haze Aura has gone through multiple names, including Insect Haze Aura and Burrfly Swarm. It’s something I’ve had a very set theme for but struggled to find strong, self explanatory name. Burrflies themselves are an already established race in Valhalla. Sujoah is an enlarged one that was Aquilla’s pet, and from Sujoah’s backstory they’re described as “aggressive little jungle bugs with painful stings, they are considered pest to most Ticallian Kyrie…”. It is also why I went with an attack range that matched her aura range, seeing as they’re naturally aggressive it’d make sense someone commanding them would make use of that. I’ll happily change it to something like Insect Haze Aura if it conveys the idea better.

For what it’s worth, the Arcturia mini is a boss in D&D and one of it’s video games that utilises some insect stuff. Although I’ve not played Neverwinter, watching snippets on youtube she has frequently has swarms of what appears to be butterflies, as well as other creatures, creations, and magic.

Quote:
Swarm Alert. I believe this has the same issue as Omegacron right? i.e. we can't activate partial members of squads. This power you could technically move Sujoah, one Ant or a spider or any combination of those.
I believe Swarm Alert should be okay? Obviously not as knowledgable on the rules as you guys but Urk activates 8 Common Goblins which in theory could be a couple of Bugbears and several Cutters.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Scytale View Post
I feel very strongly about the uniqueness of different types of kyrie, and insect-like Aquilla kyrie is perfect. I'm all for this mini as an Aquillan kyrie.

I'm not sure I love the focus on insects, but it's not bad. Obviously Aquilla has some insects, but just because she has insect wings doesn't mean she needs to work with insects. And how about Arachnids, one of the few buglike things in official 'Scape?
The insect focus was a mixture of inspiration from the Mortal Kombat character D’Vorah, the origins of the mini itself, and the fact that insects aren’t that strong to begin with. Originally I did want to include Arachnids, but I felt Arachnids had developed their own space with Predators. Certainly not something I’d be against adding in or even changing to though.

Quote:
I'm not really keen on Swarm Alert. The idea is a strong one, and I'm super-happy you limited it to normal attacks, but the lack of a range requirement means you are essentially buying a form of Scatter as a power for all of your Insects as you can just leave Valtia in the starting zone all game (and she can't even get shot at!). There is a place in the game for figures that can sit quietly in the starting zone (until cleanup), but not a big place. Scatter is a really, really good power, and the opponent has no real mitigation strategy. Sure, it can be balanced with Valtia's high cost, but it's just not fun to play against.
If Swarm Alert had some sort of range requirement, would it be a much more sellable design? Say if the insect either had to start or end moving within 3 spaces of Valtia? I definitely don’t want this mini to be sitting in the start zone all game, and I liked that this power lets you get aggressive with insects and sets up the Red Ants well. Is it something that needs adjusting or just better off scrapping? I agree that Scatter is a very strong power and this was a concern during play testing. It ultimately wasn’t as strong as the rats due to a lack of disengage and much lower defense, but I can definitely see it being unfun just due to the nature of it.

Quote:
Stats are good, but Wild feels off. Also, Why Range 3? That makes her unnecessarily valuable in cleanup.
As stated above in my response to Sir Heroscape, the attack range was purely to match the aura range as she’s commanding her swarm to pile in on something and sting them. I enjoy the theme it has, but this can be dropped if it’s too strong or disliked. And the Wild personality is something I’ve admittedly not been sure on. Devout, Ruthless and Merciless have all been other personalities I’ve had in mind for her. Relentless was briefly one I liked because of Sujoah and Red Ants also having it, but the bonding it created was a no go.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Go Back   Heroscapers > Custom HeroScape Creations > Custom Units & Army Cards
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
C3G Dredd'verse workshop Tornado C3G Project 1043 January 26th, 2021 10:35 AM
MiniatureGeek's Custom Workshop #1 Miniature Geek Other Customization & HS Additions 14 August 20th, 2009 10:37 PM
Sci Fi Terrain by Games Workshop RichardD Custom Terrain & Obstacles 12 August 4th, 2009 02:38 PM
Bad_Calvin's Workshop - update 4-7 bad_calvin Custom Terrain & Obstacles 54 June 5th, 2009 09:09 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 09:15 PM.

Heroscape background footer

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2021 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.