Diplomacy

[Kinseth]

I won't go season by season, but Ill just go through some thoughts on the game.

• I don't think England was that seasoned of a player, might have been his first game.
• E-F Alliance early game. It was rocky to start, we had the issues over ENG and my opening really was super defensive. Germany's weird opening really solidified us as allies. But it did take a lot of convincing on my part.
• Russia Germany offer. I didn't really trust Germany and Russia's idea of my attacking England would have really given RT control of the board. I wanted to work with Russia, but it really wasn't the time. I then setup the counter moves and sent over to England what we needed to do to come out ahead. I was really excited that it turned out as well as it did.
• Italy. I had a plan in place to give him Munich and move fleets to help vs Turkey's advance. Had Italy actually worked with me things would have likely changed. Because at the same time England would keep trying to do some weird moves and he also got his army squashed in Russia. After that I didn't really have the ability to do that much but defend vs Italy/Turkey.
• E-F Mid game. Lost some steam with some mishaps in Russia and that really allowed R/T to hold the line. I think we could have pushed through if that did not happen.
• E-F Late game - we talked about positioning ourselves in a way to make it look like we were attacking one another, we didn't coordinate those moves, and just said we would re-fix our lines after the fact. He didn't know I was going to take LVP.
• Fake Stab - I did try to work with Russia after I took LVP, but he was fairly quiet, I don't think he really wanted to work together, and so I didn't sense his enthusiasm so we just called off the false attacks on eachother.
• I really didn't have that much power to do anything different once I/T started attacking me. If R/I/T attacked one another that could have changed things. But I don't know exactly what I would have done, would have depended on my mood and feelings of the game at that time.
• I mean I have 2 solos just playing with the heroscape guys, and many more on other sites, if there is opportunity I am likely listening.
• If I was Turkey, I would have made a move for it. I thought he had the positioning he needed to win, and at worst he gets stopped and likely settles for a (Checks the map), large draw... Hindsight is 20/20. But I think you could get to 12 units in one season, but I am not really looking at the game. Just going off memory, I could be wrong and it wasn't that good of a position.

[MegaSilver]

I was Germany 1.0.

[Dragon Ruler]

This was my second game of Diplomacy, the first being a Heroscaper's game a couple of years ago. I also played in three or so online games with varying numbers of players, weird starting positions and no press a couple of years ago.

Unfortunately, when this game started I was very busy at work and was unable to review and prepare as I had for the first game, so I was quite rusty and definitely played somewhat tentatively.

At the outset, I immediately had issues with France, who sent a ship into the Channel. However, we reached a sort of detente, and co-existed while we each dealt with other problems. Ultimately Russia came up with an impressive plan which he pitched to Germany and France to destroy me. Fortunately France did not participate in that plan, informed me of the plan, and we began to work together in earnest.

As the game progressed, I tried to convince Turkey to work with me toward an alliance whereby I would attack France and continue to pressure Russia, and he would move against Russia and Italy. I figured other than the 5 way draw, this was my only path to victory. Turning on France, without Turkey attacking RI would have resulted in both France and me being eliminated. As the least experienced player, I did not feel comfortable in attacking France without strong assurances of Turkey attacking (for real) RI.

Kinseth is correct, I had no idea about the LVP stab, and immediately had to react and pull ships away from Russia to counter that move. I could have been hurt pretty badly there, and all of my energies would have gone to making France pay. Fortunately, I'm guessing that R's trust in anything coming from France was pretty much nonexistent at that point. And so we ended with the draw.

[Ranior]

Originally Posted by Kinseth

• If I was Turkey, I would have made a move for it. I thought he had the positioning he needed to win, and at worst he gets stopped and likely settles for a (Checks the map), large draw... Hindsight is 20/20. But I think you could get to 12 units in one season, but I am not really looking at the game. Just going off memory, I could be wrong and it wasn't that good of a position.

Indeed, I could push to 12 centers, although only 11 units actually (I could jump up four centers to 12, but only build 3 units that season).

It was fairly tempting, and I probably should have gone for it just to see how it goes.

My issue is that if you put me in the other positions, my reaction to Turkey's play as Italy and Russia is to ensure Turkey gains nothing more, and my play then from England and France is to take this gift and just run the board. I played out a few seasons of likely moves, and my personal belief is that I had an iffy shot to reach stalemate lines and get a three way draw, a possibility that a 5 way draw gets reestablished, and a good shot I just get knocked out along with Russia and Italy. There was little shot to solo unless Italy and Russia decide to help let me....


Which maybe I should try they would rather lose to me stabbing them than help France/England? But yikes, that's hard to know.

So ultimately I think you're right that there was a shot and perhaps it should have been taken, but I also agree that it wasn't that great or obvious of a shot so it kind of comes down to how much one likes to gamble.



Based on what everyone is saying here too, it sounds like my general read on the game was right--there was some possibility for the alliances to shift, but everyone was waiting for the other to make the plunge first. It's hard to build trust in the game like that, especially when you have to fear that if you make the first move that the reaction is for others to just take advantage. Sure, maybe England actually joins me if I turn on Russia, but it seems just as likely they keep working with England long term. Just so hard to make those moves....

Which does lead to the boring detente we had here, but alas.

I'm still mostly sad that Germany made the quick exit, if they held up a little longer, I think Russia and I had a very good start and while I enjoyed working with Italy, I would have rather just watched a solid Russia/Turkey run the board.

[quozl]

My general philosophy is if I have a chance to make things not boring even if I lose spectacularly, I will do that over staying in the boring position.

[Dad_Scaper]

Love it. Yes please, that.

[Kinseth]

Thanks everyone, I really enjoyed reading through the end game discussions here.

[kevindola]

Bumping this as I would be interested in playing another even if the last couple have had some unexciting play outs. Anyone new out there interesting in learning about diplomacy or heroscape diplomacy vets interested?

[Kinseth]

I would play again.