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  #6973  
Old August 26th, 2020, 10:30 AM
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Re: Soldiers of Valhalla - nominations and discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by robbdaman View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by dukeadam View Post
Thanks, is there any centralized SoV units index? "I've seen one for C3V but it's lacking newer SoV units. What's the difference between C3V and SoV units? Is the procedure to playtest them the same?
Thanks!
The Books of C3V and SOV do list them separately in the by set and pack area.
There are a few places where the two different projects are compared. One deep dive that may be overlooked is my own explanation, where I was interviewed by @quozl . The link to that interview (The C3V, Explained) is in my signature block.

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  #6974  
Old August 27th, 2020, 11:37 AM
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Re: Soldiers of Valhalla - nominations and discussion

Do I understand correctly, that C3V units have a more transparent testing proces? Why aren't the newest SoV units (Shadow Hound etc.) available in the C3V and SoV Index?
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  #6975  
Old August 27th, 2020, 11:54 AM
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Re: Soldiers of Valhalla - nominations and discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by dukeadam View Post
Do I understand correctly, that C3V units have a more transparent testing proces? Why aren't the newest SoV units (Shadow Hound etc.) available in the C3V and SoV Index?
Seems they just haven't been added as yet to that list. The PDFs are available for download though.

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  #6976  
Old August 28th, 2020, 03:56 PM
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Re: Soldiers of Valhalla - nominations and discussion

looks like we're still missing a few votes from judges...
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  #6977  
Old August 31st, 2020, 06:16 PM
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Re: Soldiers of Valhalla - nominations and discussion

Masha Shingai by @Astroking112

There have been multiple changes made to Masha Shingai since last time he went through the SoV process, but none are huge. His Move increased, which is always nice, (used to be Awakened) Terror (but is now) of the Honorless now affects Unique Squads but not any Samurai, and Fiery Retribution changes from adjacency to a range 2 aura. These don't change how the unit is played (outside of, perhaps, an improved synergy with Tagawa Samurai Archers), but they make the big fella better at what he did before. So instead of writing a full review, this one will serve as an addendum to my prior review.

It is also worth noting that this version does not synergize with the Acolytes of Vorganund, but since they weren't out yet when I first reviewed Masha I didn't include them in my original review. I didn't find that synergy to be all that great anyway.

As I noted above, this is pretty much the same unit as before, just tweaked to be stronger. Additional Move is always valuable, of course, and with the sizable miniature and the higher Move stat of a lot of Samurai, it felt right on the battlefield. Terror of the Honorless now works against Unique Squads, the rare times that matters. Fiery Retribution was underwhelming before and it's still... underwhelming. The additional range makes it easier to apply to other Samurai, but it still takes a lot of setup to put it in place, and you still have to take damage to use it. As before, it's mostly useful as a deterrent for the opponent to attack the Yokai at range, though it can be used better with the Tagawa Samurai Archers than before.

Speaking of the Archers, the changes to Terror of the Honorless allows Shingai to work much better with them as a defender, as he no longer neuters their attacks. In theory Masha looks good as a close-range defender for the Archers, providing them with a defensive advantage and someone who can dish out damage to anything that gets close. Not so great in practice, though. Order marker placement is more forced than with other offensive screens, and in general you're better off with a proper screen than hoping Fiery Retribution will pull its weight.

While I found Masha to be hard to use, I was fine with the previous version. This one is "more fine." I didn't find the changes to be too severe, and in most ways he didn't feel much different, just somewhat stronger and easier to use. The Yokai is big, mean, and scary, even if he doesn't allows shine.

I vote Yea to induct Masha Shingai into the SoV.
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  #6978  
Old September 1st, 2020, 01:26 PM
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Re: Soldiers of Valhalla - nominations and discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sir Heroscape View Post
I'm pretty passionate about the shadow faction, and was able to find 2 more minis that are still being produced, and widely available AND have some great additions to the faction with the abilities and unique gameplay decisions they bring in coordination with the other 3 Shadows.

I therefore officially submit Shadow Wraith and Shadow Stalker to the SoV!



Bio:Xundar leapt across the gurgling creek and hid behind a small ruin, sounds of the battle growing faint after having gained some distance. His Shadows were falling fast to Utgar's forces, the General having gotten used to Xundar's powers and tactics. It was time; time to show Utgar true power. Catching his breath, he concentrated on his staff; the glow growing brighter and brighter. Then, pitch black. A figure appeared in front of the ruin, a dense, palpable darkness flowing through its body, blanketing everything close to it. Another, cat-like figure also appeared; it's body shimmering, shifting and twisting. Xundar commanded them forward while regrouping the others and stepped out from behind the ruin. “Utgar, meet my Aces."

The Shadow Stalker and Wraith are the Phase Cat and Shadow, respectively, from Reaper Miniatures.
  • Balance
    Wraith: The closest comparison is Kyntela Gwyn here, giving +1 defense to all adjacent shadows (Gywn all adjacent elves) and with a similar stat-line. Of course, the Wraith is a little more versatile with the movement potential, but has 1 less life and costs a little more. It's also important to note that the defense buff does NOT stack.
    Stalker: The Stalker is a little cheaper than it's offensive predecessors, but it fits it's point total by being almost solely dependent, defensively, on it's shifting power which is aligned with Isamu. For 3X the price of Isamu, the Stalker gets a unique power, some speed, increased stats and versatility, but like Isamu it's completely dependent on the Shifting to keep it alive, which, is notably more difficult to roll for and all without the ability to run away and hide from multiple attacks.
  • Playability
    Wraith: The powers are simple, but potent. The phase ability is unique and exciting to use because of it's many use cases in the midst of battle. The defense buff is like others, but stays in check by not allowing stacking. The wraith fills a specific role in the army, kind of like that Binder, in that while it's not a primary offensive tool, it is a support unit that will allow the front lines to hold.
    Stalker: A unit with another new, unique ability that creates a specific role in the faction because of it's ability to lock down key targets from getting to Xundar or other figures, and it's ability to distract and grapple with its target/prey while the other Shadows go for others.
  • Creativity
    Wraith: The wraith adds a very important part to the faction and allows for lots of interesting mid-game decisions on whether to be offensive with other Shadows or reinforce the frontline with a defensive buffer. The Wraith can also act as a damage soak of an opponents attacks rather than them targeting the more offensive ones.
    Stalker: The Stalker is uniquely creative in that the miniature suggests both of these abilities and left/right box stats. Everything about both the Stalker and Wraith seems to feel right.
  • Theme
    Wraith: Have you ever seen the Harry Potter movies where the Dementors fly in or appear almost out of nowhere, bringing with them an ominous doom and darkness? That is the idea here. Rather than cause fear though, the Wraiths bolster the power of their nearby Shadows kind of like how Orcs in LOTR are able to more effectively fight under the cover of Mordor Shadows.
    Stalker: The Stalker is just that, a tricky shadow that can shift it's appearance and position to throw off it's location so that attacks from its opponents miss their mark...all the while tightening it's grip on their target/prey, refusing to let them go until one of them dies.
  • Accessibility
    Both of these minis are still being produced by Reaper Miniatures and are widely in stock on their website as well as multiple sellers on eBay. They are also quite affordable. The Wraith you will likely only ever take 1-2 of in an army and the Stalker, well, as many as you want I guess.

Thank you for your consideration!
In case anybody forgot that these were submitted 2 weeks ago...
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  #6979  
Old September 5th, 2020, 07:09 PM
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Re: Soldiers of Valhalla - nominations and discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sir Heroscape View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sir Heroscape View Post
I'm pretty passionate about the shadow faction, and was able to find 2 more minis that are still being produced, and widely available AND have some great additions to the faction with the abilities and unique gameplay decisions they bring in coordination with the other 3 Shadows.

I therefore officially submit Shadow Wraith and Shadow Stalker to the SoV!



Bio:Xundar leapt across the gurgling creek and hid behind a small ruin, sounds of the battle growing faint after having gained some distance. His Shadows were falling fast to Utgar's forces, the General having gotten used to Xundar's powers and tactics. It was time; time to show Utgar true power. Catching his breath, he concentrated on his staff; the glow growing brighter and brighter. Then, pitch black. A figure appeared in front of the ruin, a dense, palpable darkness flowing through its body, blanketing everything close to it. Another, cat-like figure also appeared; it's body shimmering, shifting and twisting. Xundar commanded them forward while regrouping the others and stepped out from behind the ruin. “Utgar, meet my Aces."

The Shadow Stalker and Wraith are the Phase Cat and Shadow, respectively, from Reaper Miniatures.
  • Balance
    Wraith: The closest comparison is Kyntela Gwyn here, giving +1 defense to all adjacent shadows (Gywn all adjacent elves) and with a similar stat-line. Of course, the Wraith is a little more versatile with the movement potential, but has 1 less life and costs a little more. It's also important to note that the defense buff does NOT stack.
    Stalker: The Stalker is a little cheaper than it's offensive predecessors, but it fits it's point total by being almost solely dependent, defensively, on it's shifting power which is aligned with Isamu. For 3X the price of Isamu, the Stalker gets a unique power, some speed, increased stats and versatility, but like Isamu it's completely dependent on the Shifting to keep it alive, which, is notably more difficult to roll for and all without the ability to run away and hide from multiple attacks.
  • Playability
    Wraith: The powers are simple, but potent. The phase ability is unique and exciting to use because of it's many use cases in the midst of battle. The defense buff is like others, but stays in check by not allowing stacking. The wraith fills a specific role in the army, kind of like that Binder, in that while it's not a primary offensive tool, it is a support unit that will allow the front lines to hold.
    Stalker: A unit with another new, unique ability that creates a specific role in the faction because of it's ability to lock down key targets from getting to Xundar or other figures, and it's ability to distract and grapple with its target/prey while the other Shadows go for others.
  • Creativity
    Wraith: The wraith adds a very important part to the faction and allows for lots of interesting mid-game decisions on whether to be offensive with other Shadows or reinforce the frontline with a defensive buffer. The Wraith can also act as a damage soak of an opponents attacks rather than them targeting the more offensive ones.
    Stalker: The Stalker is uniquely creative in that the miniature suggests both of these abilities and left/right box stats. Everything about both the Stalker and Wraith seems to feel right.
  • Theme
    Wraith: Have you ever seen the Harry Potter movies where the Dementors fly in or appear almost out of nowhere, bringing with them an ominous doom and darkness? That is the idea here. Rather than cause fear though, the Wraiths bolster the power of their nearby Shadows kind of like how Orcs in LOTR are able to more effectively fight under the cover of Mordor Shadows.
    Stalker: The Stalker is just that, a tricky shadow that can shift it's appearance and position to throw off it's location so that attacks from its opponents miss their mark...all the while tightening it's grip on their target/prey, refusing to let them go until one of them dies.
  • Accessibility
    Both of these minis are still being produced by Reaper Miniatures and are widely in stock on their website as well as multiple sellers on eBay. They are also quite affordable. The Wraith you will likely only ever take 1-2 of in an army and the Stalker, well, as many as you want I guess.

Thank you for your consideration!
In case anybody forgot that these were submitted 2 weeks ago...
Thank you Sir Heroscape for sharing this creation and I hope these Shadows are at least considered. The other Shadow faction that was just released makes for a great themed army and I would love to add more troops to them.

Regarding miniatures that are pulled from popular tropes, plenty of figures that have been repurposed for VC are taken from either current or previously popular games. I don't play D&D but I do play AT-43, Confrontation, and Star Wars and the figures used from those games evoke the same emotions in me as the D&D figures do in others. For me, the Varkaanans are Wolfen and the marro taken from AT-43 are clearly Therians. But it still doesn't keep me from enjoying the figures and suspending disbelief for a moment.

Pre-painted figures that match the Heroscape feel are hard to come by en masse as it is so it would be a real shame if we add even more limiters to what is acceptable or not.

Just my two cents.
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  #6980  
Old September 15th, 2020, 09:14 AM
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Re: Soldiers of Valhalla - nominations and discussion

Long overdue from me for the Shadow Wraith and Shadow Stalked by Sir H.

Your custom probably has too much Defense.
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  #6981  
Old September 16th, 2020, 06:39 PM
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Re: Soldiers of Valhalla - nominations and discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by capsocrates View Post
Long overdue from me for the Shadow Wraith and Shadow Stalked by Sir H.
I second both the sentiment and the Vote up.

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  #6982  
Old September 16th, 2020, 07:57 PM
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Re: Soldiers of Valhalla - nominations and discussion

thanks guys
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  #6983  
Old September 17th, 2020, 10:05 AM
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Re: Soldiers of Valhalla - nominations and discussion

The Shadow Wraith has received 6 Yea votes to review (Scytale, superfrog, BiggaBullfrog, Astroking112, capsocrates, and wriggz) and moves forward in the process.

The Shadow Stalker has received 5 Yea votes to review (Scytale, superfrog, Astroking112, capsocrates, and wriggz) and moves forward in the process.
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  #6984  
Old September 17th, 2020, 10:25 AM
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Re: Soldiers of Valhalla - nominations and discussion

@Sir Heroscape , for the Shadow Stalker's Grapple, does that prevent all disengagements with the Stalker, including powers like Spear of Summoning, Carry, etc? Or it is only for normal movement?
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