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C3G Legacy Library This is the archive for all the designs released in the original era of C3G. Feel free to post any figure specific questions in their individual books. |
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#109
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Re: The Book of Hela (Public Playtest)
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#110
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Re: The Book of Hela (Public Playtest)
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She doesn’t need either to be viable if you ask me. She plays better when there are Asgardians that have been destroyed, friend or foe, sure, but her effectiveness does not require it. IMO, that’s accurate. Queen of Hel is not the power that makes her good, it’s her Touch of Death Special Attack and Goddess of Death powers that are her draw. Those make her viable in any army. Queen of Hel is merely a bonus. So your analysis is off. You're making it seem as if she's no good in any game unless it contains Asgardians, which is just incorrect. A special attack of 4 that doubles each skull, with a follow up auto-destroy on a 15 or higher(subtracting their remaining life from the roll) is already a really good tool of destruction. Then add on to the fact that anything she manages to kill herself, you get to put on her card and either once per game revive with 3 life remaining, or use as a +1 skull/shield/or add to her d20 roll per figure. We're looking at a design that will play great or better in an Asgardian game, but play good or better in a non-Asgardian game. As far as theme goes, it was best stated by Ronin in that we're going to be ending up a little loose on theme however you slice it. Be it as-is or what you're suggesting it be changed to(the idea of non-heroic deaths equating to ranged attacks, special attacks, or special powers being the final hit), either way it's not going to be absolutely perfect. |
#111
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Re: The Book of Hela (Public Playtest)
The most effective army for Hela is probably going to mostly be Asgardians, correct. But in the comics, whenever it's "Thor vs. Hela," who does Hela have alongside her? A bunch of... Asgardians. Like, dead Asgardians, but still Asgardians. It'd be weirder for her to be leading pretty much any other sort of army if we're being real.
Hela + Asgardian Warriors is a perfectly valid army for me, thematically, and you'd get full use of her card. You just have a squint a bit. And we've already seeded some forward-thinking synergy for possible Undead Asgardians on this card, where squinting isn't necessary. Also, side note - how do we feel about "Thrall" instead of "Reanimate" for Hela's synergy hook? Old Scandinavian word for slave, and it has some nice mind control-y vibes. (Also some weird synergy with C3V's Thralls but, hey, I'd call that a bonus.) JOHNNY139'S CLASSIC CUSTOM THREAD! | Visit now!
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#112
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Re: The Book of Hela (Public Playtest)
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#113
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Re: The Book of Hela (Public Playtest)
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Without going point by point over the whole discussion here, my thoughts more or less line up with johnny's. It might not be super faithful to the actual mythology, but the take on Hela here does resonate with when I've seen her pop up in the comics. Plus, once we get more of those Thralls designed, the regular Asgardians are going to take more of a backseat. To me, this looks like a very minor issue that's only going to get smaller. The only point I'm seeing where I really diverge from johnny is on the Etins - I don't think it's worth breaking out a bulleted list to try and grab every so-and-so in the 9 Realms, but the number of Etins in the game and Hela's association with Loki merits their inclusion, IMO. |
#114
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Re: The Book of Hela (Public Playtest)
Since I was pinged for this, my thoughts are that the design is fine where it stands.
-She really doesn't need Asgardians in her army to be playable, it's an option, but so is just blasting on people and stealing their souls. -I feel simply having the species Asgardian already causes her to gravitate toward Asgardian builds regardless of how her power works, and that's not going to be changed. -I don't see why it's that terrible of a thing for her to work with Asgardians to begin with. It makes more sense than anything else save the Zombgardians being talked about. -I don't feel the 'killed by things not melee attacks' thing really translates to 'dishonorable death' in any meaningful way. It seems incredibly abstracted and I don't think many would even get the connection without it being explained to them. Side note the first, I like the idea of adding in the Thrall stuff. Let's her play more as a general once some thematic Zombgardians are made. Side note the second, Goddess of Death should specify Unique Heroes. Otherwise she can use it to revive a Common or Event Hero placed on her card by an outside source (like Ghost Rider or the like). My Repaints and Mods: Updated 1-13 My Custom Cards: Updated 4-15 My Custom Superheroes: Updated 1-13 My figure images for online games: Alliance figures, Utgar figures My Etsy Store |
#115
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Re: The Book of Hela (Public Playtest)
Updated GoD with Unique.
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#116
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Re: The Book of Hela (Public Playtest)
Yeah, I'm not seeing the heavy dependence on Asguardians here since she can place any figure she destroys on her card combined with a pretty potent SA. Having a few in your army is a nice fall back plan should you fail to kill anything with her but it the design isn't dependent on that. I actually kind of like the idea of pairing her up with some of the uncommon Asguardian warriors. Those guys don't see enough play time in my games and as the 'god of death/ruler of the afterlife' she should certainly have some living followers. Death cults are a real thing. It is just too bad Hela + Asguardian Warrior x? doesn't add up to 800/1000/1200 on it's own. That could have been a nice little army.
As for the Ettin connection, I'm a bit split on that. The Ettin could certainly use some more army build options but I'm personally not familiar with her leading or working with the Frost Giants. |
#117
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Re: The Book of Hela (Public Playtest)
Well, technically, since she is Loki's daughter, she is part Frost Giant, aka Ettin.
As far as clarifying my earlier remarks, I do like the proposed power change, but to be honest, I never had a problem with the current wording. I agree with the comments L_O made about Norse mythology, but it's important to realize that Marvel has strayed from that more and more, each time they add their own stories to the greater mythos. Just please realize that she is NOT the lost child of Odin from the movies. Semi-Retired C3G Hero (and first Official Member of the C3G Target Audience!) The correct way to add C3G playtests to posts. My favorite day EVER on heroscapers. DISCLAIMER: C3G claims no ownership of the characters or artwork used for C3G customs. All rights for the characters belong to their respective publishers/creators. C3G cards are not intended for sale, and C3G does not authorize any party to profit from C3G cards. RIP George Perez
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#118
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Re: The Book of Hela (Public Playtest)
It seems like the majority are fine with keeping it as-is, and the only point of contention left is whether to add Etin to the power or not.
Seeing as everyone but @johnny139 is on board with the inclusion, I figure it's at least worth seeing how much reluctance/push back there is there. Here's how the power would read if it were added: Quote:
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#119
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Re: The Book of Hela (Public Playtest)
Try this:
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Semi-Retired C3G Hero (and first Official Member of the C3G Target Audience!) The correct way to add C3G playtests to posts. My favorite day EVER on heroscapers. DISCLAIMER: C3G claims no ownership of the characters or artwork used for C3G customs. All rights for the characters belong to their respective publishers/creators. C3G cards are not intended for sale, and C3G does not authorize any party to profit from C3G cards. RIP George Perez
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#120
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Re: The Book of Hela (Public Playtest)
I have no opinion either way on the Etin thing. I had more of an issue with the ranged attack "dishonorable death" thing and had no issue with what you had originally. I do like the inclusion of the Thrall as well.
Would I want it to be everything I love...sure...but that's just not realistic so I'm going to focus on finding things that will make me unhappy and work on fixing those. |
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